shaolink9

what are the adnavtages of having a a6 ...will it run harder or get better mpg? i searched and did not see it thnx guys.

TireSm0ke

iTrader: (1)

The 6l80 is a beast of a transmission. Like others have said its probably the most stout auto tranny ever to come out of GM.

Randy WS6

iTrader: (69)

And putting it in a F-Body is justs as tuff. You will need a controller ,because the f-body ecm will not work with a 6L80E

Tommy 35 SS

from a roll you'll accelerate quicker because there are more gears to chose from

the more gears, the better gas mileage you'll get, the faster you'll go, and the more adaptable your car will be

the first gear in those 6l80's is like a 4.XX, so your rear end can be a higher ratio while maintaining the same amount of off the line speed

plus double overdrives, so high end you'll still be accelerating, and not lagging, keeping you in the rpm range more

the tranny comes with a sport mode from the start i believe too, so u can have performance shifting with or without a manumatic shifter/paddle shifters

Elcaballoloco

iTrader: (3)

How big is this thing and what does it weigh? What about the converter?

Any aftermarket parts out there for it yet?

OMFG....think of a full manual A6....that would be sex.

What do they come in?

Tommy 35 SS

so far they come in the 2006 and after Corvettes, GM 3/4 ton gasoline trucks and SUV's, most 2009 half ton trucks will finally get them, Pontiac G8 GT, and of course the 2010 Chevrolet Camaro. That's as many as i can name off the top of my head

both the Corvette and Camaro have paddle shifters, including both the 300 hp V6 Camaro and the SS

Tommy 35 SS

o yeah, the new cadillac cts-v has the 6l90 from the heavy duty trucks, 556 hp
the cadillac STS and XLR also have this tranny
the escalade and yukon denali too

BlackTA96

iTrader: (3)

does anyone make a controller for the 6L80E yet??

snketr

iTrader: (3)

Speartech

poorhousenext

The trans controller is built into the transmission.

Question then becomes, which Engine management computers can communicate with it to get it to work. Speartech can build you a wire harness and advise you on what works and what doesn't.

If you missed the below thread, it might shed some more light on the A6 6L80 & 90 transmission. Embedded in it is link to the most informative thread I've seen on the A6s and problems getting one to fit in older cars. The A6s are fatties...lol Do a search in Hybrid section on 6L80 to find more builds with them, including one John Spears, Speartech did as test bed to see what it took to use them with LS conversion.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...=#post10319980

I'm working through problems of fitting 6L80 & LS7 in 66 C2 Corvette right now. Speartech is supplying the engine/trans harness and working on making a wire harness to connect the Pontiac G8 shifter I'm using so it's TU/TD mode can be used to communicate with trans to allow manual shifting of trans. He does that with a toggle switch on his build.

Elcaballoloco

iTrader: (3)

nm....

rsz288

Poorhousenext has it in a nutshell here, , and knows this trans very well with his very unique Corvette project.

Speartech was the first to get a 6L90 running behind an LS2, in his truck (search on speartech or 6l80 or 6l90 and you will find it), and probably first to have done the hard work and had them running behind an LS7. He certainly can provide a solution for these trans, along with Tap Up Tap Down control.

From a controller viewpoint, yes it is in the trans, and the controller and the solenoid-valvebody are integrated into one assembly. Same for 6L80 and 6L90.

This controller (T43) only works with an E38 or E67 GM controller and 58X engine, and maybe the latest Bosch unit. It would probably run behind a 24X engine, but run in limp mode and probably stay in 3rd gear the whole time. It needs compatibility with the engine controller. They talk.

Eventually it will probably get to "manual mode", but only when the trans & the controllers well understood. Replacing the in box controller with an aftermarket unit would not be all that difficult with the right talents and resources, there are "only" 8 solenoids, 4 pressure switches, a temp sensor, input and ouput speed sensors, and a 7 position switch with 5 contacts, though programming the unit to do the right thing at the right time would be pure wizardry! . Am sure there are one or two proto controllers running out there somewhere!

HPTuners has the most comprehensive aftermarket view of the parameters in the T43 controller, but then its a matter of what to do with all those parameters without frying the trans. Clutch to clutch electronically controlled trans are a science by themselves.

They weigh about 240lbs, come with a 12" converter in most applications bar 4.4L Cadi, where it is about ~9".

The case is very similar in height and width to a 4L60/65 at the front where the converter housing meets the case, that's where the similarity ends, the rear of the case is not much smaller, and is very tall by comparision to earlier trans'.

The hard stuff aside, with the right calibration loaded it is a great trans, and in 6L90 car guise handles 550FtLb of input torque and 885 ftlb of output torque, and if the Cadi LSA 6.2L S/C engine is anything to go on: 555HP. With a 100,000 mile warrantee.

In the Cadi CTS V, it helps make the car the fastest sports sedan in the world around the Nurburgring.

In 6th gear with a 2.73 rear end in a Corvette, it is quite common to get 30-35mpg at cruise, and my experience is similar in a 68 Camaro.

Cheers!

poorhousenext

Credit where credit is due.

Poorhouse doesn't know the 6L80/90 trans, he just knows RSZ288 who does...LOL

RSZ288 is the one who has done the leg work for fitting 6L80/90 and studied them so he could understand how the electronics work. Sure has been carrying me...

shaolink9

thnx guys so do you think the swap is worth is wat owuld it cost ?

poorhousenext

Can't tell you yet if the A6 is worth cost as I'm still in process of build. What I can tell you is why it was worth the cost to me to give one a try. My reasons may not make it worth cost to you. In fact one are both could be off base entirely.

My project is LS7/6L80 1966 Corvette convertible Resto-mods. More are less a Z06 wannabe...LOL

No. 1 reason.
Most vette resto-mods use 5sp/6sp manual transmissions as auto are looked down on. Manual trans was out of the question for me due to conditions of my knees. I chose to try and do a quality 6sp auto install just to make it unique/different vs a 4 sp auto and/or 5/6sp manual. Bottom line prime motivation for me to use A6 was trying to do a cool build to get peoples attention.

Next reason was trying to level the performance playing field somewhat that manual trans cars have over autos, as automatics have minimum of 6% more drivetrain loss than manuals.

The A6 by design is supposed to decrease drive train loss over conventional designed auto. GM/Ford when designing trans had goals of increasing fuel economy and performance across a wide variety of platforms from trucks to touring sedans. While I'm not wild about the 4.03 1st gear ratio, I understand why they went with it and the other gear ratios from both fuel mileage and performance standpoint of trying to get gross weight moving with the least amount of gas pedal by using them with a wide range of rear end ratio based on weight and usage of different applications.

What I see performance wise when I compare the A6's gearing to that of M6 is improved performance in 1st-4 gear even with taller rear end ratio than M6 vette.

I'm using a 3.07 rear end ratio. If I compare that to a M6 vette with a 3.42 ratio, I have more mechanical advantage in each gear to help get me down the long black dyno quicker, whereas if I were using a 4L65 or 80 even with a 3.42 rear end, A4 could not match up with the M6 vette in any of it's 3 non overdrive gears. In fact if you run the numbers, I believe I would need a 4.44 rear end with a 4L auto in order to try and match and/or slightly exceed the M6 mechanical advantage in 1st-3rd non overdrive gears.

With the A6 with a 3.07 rear end, I can exceed the M6 with 3.42 rear end ratio mechanical advantage over a 4L auto even in a 4th gear match up with a M6, as the A6 has a 1.15 ratio 4th gear making 4th gear with a 3.07 rear end the equivalent of having a 3.54 rear end installed.

M6 vette would need a 4.64 rear end ratio to match A6 1st gear, 4.06 rear end ratio in 2nd to match, 3.61 rear end ratio in 3rd to match and 3.53 rear end ratio in 4th gear to match.

So you can see, that I want my 66 Z06 wannabe to be able to match up on the strip or street with a Z06 up to 120mph. Above that speed, I'm toast. 66 doesn't have the aerodynamics are stability to compete with one.

Now the cool appears to work for now. I'm hoping I'm right on being able to match up with M6 vette to a point. Time will tell on that.

Cost wise, I'll have almost the same amount of dollars in a built 4L65/70 used tranny as I do in the cost of my brand new 6L80 and that includes an $1500.00 dollar GM core charge in it's cost.

Found that out when I decided not put a 6L80 behind LS3 480HP powered 64 coupe. In order to use a 4L60/65/80 they have to have an internal sensor upgrade to provide data the two engine controllers RS288 mentioned in his post need to work. I bought a built 4L65 only to find out when I ordered wire harness that it would need to be upgraded to equivlant of a 4L70 trans sensor wise. That turns out not to be a cheap upgrade.

Elcaballoloco

iTrader: (3)

rsz288, that is some great info there.

It doesnt sounds like anything up your alley as per your information you put up in post 12, but do you think there is the possibility of a manual 6l80/90 in the future?

It sounds to me if everything is incorporated into the valve body, alot of the tuning issues could be taken care of with a manual setup as long as someone didn't mind the shifting.

rsz288

Thanks for the rap Poorhousenext. I think the discussions we have here help improve the understanding. Questions and needs create answers. With this great forum the knowledge is driven by the challenges of our projects and the sharing of information. Never could have got even this far without seeing examples like yours, and also THE definitive LSX/Camaro swaps in the conversion stickys here, and also many other swaps across many platforms like the pioneering 66 Chevelle with LS7 done in 2004 at So Cal Speed, shops like ATS, DSE, BRP, S&P, an others, plus the fact that Speartech did the defining 6L80/90 swap behind an LS2 and an LS7. that was a turning point for most or all of us.

Everyone adds knowlege to the base. We all move forward.

Elcabolloloco:

Considering the thought of a manual 6L80 or 90. mmmm. This would probably require a complete new set of hydraulic controls. Pseudo manual can be achieved now.

Being a "clutch to clutch" trans, there are two clutches being operated at the same time, one released, one applied, with "perfect" synchronisation each time for the load, speed, rpm, etc. The objective is smooth shifting, and a broad ratio spread to achieve acceleration and economy.

Clutch release/apply timing varies from towards a second, down to 1/10 of a second for a good shift. Difficult to see how that would be achieved without a computer, or a large investment in a more traditional valve body.

On the cost, not terribly much more than a 4L65e, though the fitting was much harder due to case size. As Poorhousenext intimates, the post 06 GenIV motors with 4 speed autos have an input speed sensor. Pre 06 trans are reasonably low cost, post 06 with ISS are much rarer and still full price or thereabouts.

Why do it? I drove a BMW X3 a couple years ago. This may even have the 6L80 in it. One of the BMW's has the 6L80. Very impressed with the shifting. Seamless! Smooth. Snappy. Hooked.

Now having a 6L80/90 up and running, the shifting is far better quality than any 4 speed auto I have driven that is running a production setup.

And running a 2.73 rear gear, the acceleration is, er, impressive when you want it, and the low cruise rpm gives great mileage.

This is a challenging conversion, but very happy that I did it, now that it is on the road!!!

Have a nice weekend!

lnwlfbsktbll

I just bought an ly6 opt. 6.0 liter and im going to put a 6l80 behind it to go into a '87 GMC swb pickup. Those tranny's appear to be very stout and it should get me around 20 mpg outta that boat

El Corvino

Since you all seem to know so much about this transmission. I currently have LT1 383 that does just over 700 HP on a big kit. Down the road I will be building a better, LSX. I am going to replace the current stock 4L60E... this motor and trans are in a 1984 Chevy El Camino. What kind of issues would I be looking at to do this build? Nice easy swap and get my wiring modded or is this just a night mirror not worth messing with? I drive the car once a month so if I get the **** economy of a built 4L60E it won't be too bad, just thought it would be bad *** to have a 6 speed auto...

82swbLQ9

Just outta curiousity. the BS3 system cqn be set up for GM trans control. Does anyone think that includes the 6L80 or would it be just for 4L60,4L80?