CoolAid

Put in the Circle D +4C and the valve body kit of the TransGo HD2 and I;m getting some pretty hard trans slip.

First seems to be just fine, but no WOT into second, it just bangs the limiter and even when I let off second still just revs with no grab. Thing is I can put it in second manually and take off from a start, it starts slipping hard at higher RPM. In D the TCM almost sounds confused. Merging onto the freeway it would not go 3>4 even though I have those gears at part throttle.

I built the valve body and the servo part for part, word for word on the instructions. The trans had 12,000 miles on it before this, no slip. I wondering if I've toasted the trans somehow or am having issues with the TCM freaking out about the big 4,000 stall thats in there now.


Anything I can check with my HPT? Thanks.

CoolAid

Called Circle D and they said I may have a pressure issue. Its running stock 90psi settings with 50% torque management removed. Do I need to up the shift pressures with the newer stronger springs from the HD2 kit or because its a 4,000 stall?


Just took it back out. My final gear in what I think is 4th (and what HPT thinks), engages at 3,600 RPM at like 45MPH. That doesnt sound right at all. Im getting no DTCs, like the usual 121 (http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?p=101510) Although it seems to be displaying symptoms of these codes and how the TCM is confused.

9000th01ss

iTrader: (10)

Post up your tune.

Just my opinion, never do a shift kit and converter at the same time.
Do the shift kit first, with a converter like that you can hardly tell there a shift kit in it.
The bigger boost valve in the HD kit make up for the pressure of the stronger 3-4 and forward springs you put inside the trans. (you actually took the input drum out and put the springs in? most people skip it for some reason)

performabuilt

iTrader: (25)

You know that with a 4000 stall its gonna feel like its slipping at anything much less than 4000 until it goes into lockup,
And if you have not tuned for it yet its not surprising that the shifts and all are off and wont shift at wot etc, As mentioned also with a stall the shift feel "not to be confused with the actual shift" will be much less noticable even with a shift kit.

CoolAid

Its just driving very weird. In supposed 4th gear at the lightest throttle possible to keep it moving I'm a 3,600+RPM at like 40MPH. 4th feels way more like 2nd should almost as if its in 2nd but the stick and the TCM says 4th. I cant get it to shift on its own part throttle either unless I key it up then let off the gas, then it dumps in gear but just slips like hell until (as I mentioned) I'm in 4th gear at 45MPH but turning almost 4,000Rs.

performabuilt

iTrader: (25)

sounds like your not getting lockup , I would not get to excited that theres actually anything wrong till i had it tuned.
Hopefully its not actually slipping because with that much you already need a trans

CoolAid

If I try to get it on the freeway it just wants to slip to redline. I try to get it up to 65 or highway speed and the RPMs are just insane. When it locks is it supposed to dump all the slip off and go back down to the 2,500 RPM area like stock? I tried to lock it with HPT but it doesnt look like there is any provision to do so.

Circle-D

iTrader: (21)

It could be as simple as a tune to up the shift points and disable some codes for lock up. It is definitely going to feel different because of the high stall, but what you are describing kinda sounds like the trans is slipping. Have you checked the pressure ports make sure you put the shift kit in correctly?

Chris

TXCAMSS

iTrader: (60)

There are several tuning changes that need to be made with any stall converter change. First off I would lower the wot shift mph by 5-8mph on the 1-2 and 2-3 upshift and down shift. Also raise the limiter up out of the way a bit to say 6600rpm so your shifts don't hit it if it over shoots a bit. You will have to play with the part throttle shifts and adjust to your liking. It'll shift into 1-2 quick with the new TC because the TPS and speed are met quicker. You also likely are getting the PO300 misfire code (some do/some don't) and that will prevent the TC from locking up. I eliminate the 3rd gear lock up and anly allow it in 4th when it's needed.

I can shoot you a copy of our 4C tune if that'll help.

Of course you may have a transmission issue, but it's likely you just are not used to the feel of a converter if you've never had one before.

Keep us updated!

Magic Man

I agree you need to get it tuned to have it setup right.Mine would hit the limiter and slip and converter wouldn't lockup just as you discribe but after I got it tuned up it does what it's supposed to do.I have a >4k converter and on the street it was screwd up but now it's good.

CoolAid

Please do TXCAMSS, I'd like to compare and look over your TCC settings.

The 1-2-3 shift are almost seemless. When I get it into 4th it snaps in. Then I hear another lug and the TCC Mode on the HPT scanner says "On". However, I can only get it to say "Locked On" if I am under 12% TPS (or ETC in my car). I need to somehow get this thing to lock in 4th.

TXCAMSS

iTrader: (60)

PM me your email address and I'll shoot it over to you. Ours will be a bit different since ours is a cable TB and an older f-body OS, but it'll give you an idea. There is a table to set the TPS lock and unlock also. I'm at work right now so I can't look at the tables to give the actual table names, but I'm sure you get the gist of what I mean.

You'll get her dialed in.

9000th01ss

iTrader: (10)

These are a few things I changed with my 3c Not sure if it applies to a GTO or not.
Also I disagree that you need to touch the rev limiter because of this CLICK HERE
And this guy knows what he's talking about. I'm surprised he gave me the time to answer my question.
You will hit the rev limiter manually shifting though, again, not sure with the GTO.

You need to raise the shift points.
You'll notice right away that when you raise your shift points, the car will move more with less rpm. Think of it like trying to drive with the brakes partially applied, or with a 2.43 rear gear vs 4.88's.


This is what I did, aside from shift points and tcc apply times:
Misfire table values raised.
Idle airflow table values raised.
Shift pressure raised in 3rd and 4th.
Upshift/downshift mph raised below 44% (above 44% needed no changes)
TCC apply disabled below 12.50 TP to eliminate the lock up bang during a wot 1-2, 2-3 run in OD.
Full Throttle enable % lowered.
TCC high and low duty cycle tables set to 98
DTC P0751 and P0757 set to no report.

CoolAid

Thanks for the help guys. I'll plug around with some settings and see if I can get it to lock so I can limp it to the pro tuner on Sat.

CoolAid

Here is a log of what is going on. I think the trans is toast. I drained the fluid out and it came out burnt smelling and dark. Put a new filter on, new fluid and made this log then drained again and the new fluid is darkish too.

The log is very erratic because the vehicle is very hard to drive consistent and I wanted to show what was happening at different TPS levels. In my supposed 4th and final gear I am engaged at 85MPH at 6,500RPM. That should be 2nd really, 2nd redlines around 85, 4th should pull to 170. Almost as if 2nd and 4th are switched around. Third is non-existent and only engages around 6,300 RPM lol.

Im not sure what I did wrong. The kit went in part for part, spring for spring. The gaskets are in the right spot on the plate...etc... Either way I'm sure I have a smoked trans Thanks for the help in this thread though you guys are awesome. Here is a link to the tune I modified with the suggested settings, although the trans acted the same way with the old tune which was just shift points and -50% TM. (File was too big to post here, 1.42 MB of 1.24 allowed)

Tune

performabuilt

iTrader: (25)

I am sorry to hear that but with the new info would have to agree its toast, As for what went wrong you may never know. I would suspect some issue with the PR valve. Sorry for your missfortune I was hoping you just were not used to the stall.

Circle-D

iTrader: (21)

Sorry to hear that, I was hoping for a tune fix as well. Send the converter back and I will take care of it for you. Don't want to put that in a fresh build.

Chris

CoolAid

Thanks Chris. I was going to call 'ya about that. The converter is a top notch piece and I dont want it to be harmed by any crap that may have got into it as well as the new trans I decide to get. Can you PM me the info I need to send it down to you? Address, tips on getting the most fluid I can out of it, how to wrap it or prepare it, cost...etc...

Thanks again.

calongo_SS

iTrader: (7)

I had a similar issue a while back after a HD-2 install. Mine was done by a professional builder though, he screwed up something in PR valve and toasted the trans. Didn't take more than a few miles and banging the rev limiter once and it was burned up. Good luck.

troopercar

iTrader: (6)

Why would you say that? have you ever driven a built/stalled auto or are you just an internet expert?

You feel the shifts in my 4000+ stalled auto plenty hard under heavy throttle. Kick out the *** end hitting 2nd hard. And in everyone else's too if it's working right.