Looking to verify lock up slip
01-25-2016, 10:16 PM
#21
On The Tree
I've seen many comments about Transgo stuff be inconsistent in quality, although their HD kit seems very popular. What would cause something like that i.e. a budget lathe, not doing QC checks enough?
Never really saw any complaints about Sonnax stuff so that's what I put in my 4l60e for a complete rebuild. One issue was a code 1870 so a local shop reamed my valve body for about $10 so I could install the valve that retains PWM. That's interesting that Circle D recommends keeping PWN, so I guess I lucked out since that was the TC I wound up getting.
Never really saw any complaints about Sonnax stuff so that's what I put in my 4l60e for a complete rebuild. One issue was a code 1870 so a local shop reamed my valve body for about $10 so I could install the valve that retains PWM. That's interesting that Circle D recommends keeping PWN, so I guess I lucked out since that was the TC I wound up getting.
Sonnax makes good quality stuff for the most part. The problem with Sonnax is knowing what you might actually NEED, and what is just simply unnecessary, expensive stuff. All too often I tear down transmissions that look like the previous builder (usually a DIY'er) got a little overzealous with the Sonnax catalog. Most of their stuff does work good, but in many cases, so did the OEM part that it replaced. As I sit here, I honestly can't think of a single Sonnax part that I would consider an absolute "must-have" in a 4L60E build. There is some Ford and Dodge stuff that I use often, but not really in the '60E.
01-26-2016, 06:08 PM
#22
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Loosing TCC Hot tells me it is a hydraulic leak.....Places/Components of interest...
TCC Regulator Valve
TCC Enable Solenoid
TCC PWM solenoid
TCC Apply Valve
Turbine/Input shaft O-ring
Damage separator plate gasket/s
Damaged Case to Pump Gasket
Worn Stator Support Bushing
Leaks between the Pump halves
TCC Regulator Valve
TCC Enable Solenoid
TCC PWM solenoid
TCC Apply Valve
Turbine/Input shaft O-ring
Damage separator plate gasket/s
Damaged Case to Pump Gasket
Worn Stator Support Bushing
Leaks between the Pump halves
Now it slips when cold, just as easily. For know I just drive in 3rd and will shut off lockup in 4th. If anyone needs fresh logs that's not an issue.
Really hate the idea of tearing the transmission apart when the truck has been running a whole 3 weeks, after being apart for the last 7 months. I'll probably be just as pissed if that trans comes apart and everything was fine (minus the TC) and vice versa if the new TC goes in and slips.
The trans really does shift nice though, except for the annoying burp between shifts (I think do to TM)
01-26-2016, 06:40 PM
#24
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I feel okay flipping the trans over and unbolting the valvebody, separator plate and *I think* the pump.
My usual habitat is big turbo VWs so a lot of this GMs specific stuff is very new to me.
01-26-2016, 07:15 PM
#25
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Most of the items clinebarger listed, and the most common problem areas, can all be handled without removing the trans; at most you have to remove the valve body. The exception is the pump - you have to remove the bell housing and open the trans to get to that. Unless the last builder made a big goof, the pump should not be leaking.
Of course if the converter TCC is worn out, you might have to remove the trans anyway.
clinebarger and Dynamic396 are pro builders and might know what the most common problem areas are.
One approach might be to just say f..k it, buy the Yank converter, ensure the Transgo TCC valve was installed, patch a new TCC Enable Solenoid into the harness and give that a try.
Unless clinebarger and Dynamic396 correct me, there is a 90% probability your problem is one of those.
Of course if the converter TCC is worn out, you might have to remove the trans anyway.
clinebarger and Dynamic396 are pro builders and might know what the most common problem areas are.
One approach might be to just say f..k it, buy the Yank converter, ensure the Transgo TCC valve was installed, patch a new TCC Enable Solenoid into the harness and give that a try.
Unless clinebarger and Dynamic396 correct me, there is a 90% probability your problem is one of those.
01-26-2016, 07:16 PM
#26
TECH Fanatic
You paid to have the trans rebuilt, Have you contacted the builder? If this was a unit I built....I would fix it!
Everything I mentioned is in the pump & valve body, The Plate gaskets are off the shelf items, As is the pump to case gasket.
I'm wondering if the TG TCC regulator valve got installed backwards?? It has a threaded hole on one end, This faces toward the End Plug, Away from the spring.
Everything I mentioned is in the pump & valve body, The Plate gaskets are off the shelf items, As is the pump to case gasket.
I'm wondering if the TG TCC regulator valve got installed backwards?? It has a threaded hole on one end, This faces toward the End Plug, Away from the spring.
01-26-2016, 07:37 PM
#27
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You paid to have the trans rebuilt, Have you contacted the builder? If this was a unit I built....I would fix it!
Everything I mentioned is in the pump & valve body, The Plate gaskets are off the shelf items, As is the pump to case gasket.
I'm wondering if the TG TCC regulator valve got installed backwards?? It has a threaded hole on one end, This faces toward the End Plug, Away from the spring.
Everything I mentioned is in the pump & valve body, The Plate gaskets are off the shelf items, As is the pump to case gasket.
I'm wondering if the TG TCC regulator valve got installed backwards?? It has a threaded hole on one end, This faces toward the End Plug, Away from the spring.
Last year I brought my S10, partially completed LS swap. Came with a th400 and an fti 4000. Truck has 3.73s, and it's goal at the time was just a fun toy.
Friend has a similar truck, 6.0/76mm setup being built, with a street/strip in mind. He had the 4l60e, which with OD was the better choice for me, and the TH400 was the better choice for him so we traded transmissions
His trans at that point was already rebuilt with the TG stuff and the converter. I'm pretty sure the trans was also dyno tested (new gasket loosely installed on the pan and a few ounces of clean fluid in it), and the place that rebuilt it is called "The Transmission Shop" (local place) has a pretty solid reputation. If not performance stuff at the very least than OEM rebuilds.
That being said, the trans was rebuilt well over a year ago, and I would not expect anyone to warranty it at this point.
I greatly appreciate the help from everyone at this point.
05-08-2017, 06:16 PM
#28
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I would like to revisit this subject, without creating a new thread d hoping those that chimed in before continue to.
Had an 'ah-ha' moment last night.
Decided to manually ground the solenoids at the ecu connector.
On C2 Red,
Pin 2, TCC PWM solenoid clicked
Pin 47 and 48 as well.
Pin 42, 'TCC on' nothing. Little spark at the ground point, but that's it. No noise, nothing.
I can sort of read the hydraulic diagrams online, and it seems like that the TCC enable solenoid not turning on would cause a soft apply that I am experiencing.
Not particularly fond of trans fluid (because it goes ******* everywhere), so if anyone says otherwise I think replacing the tcc enable solenoid is the correct course of action
Had an 'ah-ha' moment last night.
Decided to manually ground the solenoids at the ecu connector.
On C2 Red,
Pin 2, TCC PWM solenoid clicked
Pin 47 and 48 as well.
Pin 42, 'TCC on' nothing. Little spark at the ground point, but that's it. No noise, nothing.
I can sort of read the hydraulic diagrams online, and it seems like that the TCC enable solenoid not turning on would cause a soft apply that I am experiencing.
Not particularly fond of trans fluid (because it goes ******* everywhere), so if anyone says otherwise I think replacing the tcc enable solenoid is the correct course of action
05-09-2017, 08:37 PM
#31
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Pretty sure this is the kt that was used anyways on my rebuild https://www.globaltransmissionparts....9-00-01-02-03/
I do hope to find something not right when the solenoid comes out, because other than the tcc soft apply, this trans isn't half bad. Shifts really nice, and with the 3.73/26" tire it takes off like a rocket from a dig.
05-09-2017, 10:21 PM
#32
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The soft apply may be due to the TCC frictions used in the converter. What brand is it?
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
05-10-2017, 04:54 PM
#33
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The soft apply may be due to the TCC frictions used in the converter. What brand is it?
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
It just straight up slips. I can set a component slip code at will.
05-10-2017, 07:00 PM
#34
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The TCI streetfighter is basically a GM V6 converter with a ring welded on to fit an LS engine. The TCC clutch size is tiny and easily worn out. Generally as long as you don't apply TCC over 35% throttle it should last.
I'm not saying its for sure your converter, but just saying its a possibility.
There is nothing wrong with replacing the TCC Enable solenoid which you already have on order; they do go bad. I assume you got the type that simply splices into the harness.
I'm not saying its for sure your converter, but just saying its a possibility.
There is nothing wrong with replacing the TCC Enable solenoid which you already have on order; they do go bad. I assume you got the type that simply splices into the harness.
05-10-2017, 07:46 PM
#35
TECH Fanatic
The soft apply may be due to the TCC frictions used in the converter. What brand is it?
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
Clinebarger should confirm, but I suspect that removing the check ball from the very end of the input shaft will give a slightly firmer TCC apply. Probably not enough to make you happy, but a little bit.
Dave926, I'm confused, Is it slipping or does it just have a soft apply?
With the TCC PWM duty cycle above 70%......The converter should be locked!!
Monitor the TCC Slip RPM, It should NEVER go above 100 RPM with the PWM duty cycle above 70%.
We still don't know what TCC Regulator Valve is in the Valve Body, Your parts in the link says the VB has a Sonnax TCC Regulator Valve, They offer a stock style with a Isolator Valve that keeps the PWM apply functioning & a TCC Regulator Valve without the Isolator that deletes PWM Apply.
If your VB still has a Isolator Valve.......TCC apply will be soft! Setting the Minimum PWM Duty Cycle to 90% in the Tune will correct this if soft apply is your only issue....The TCC is NOT slipping, And everything else is OK!
Here is the table, Set every cell to 90......
05-10-2017, 08:22 PM
#36
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Clinebarger,
Soft Apply with Slip. I can feel the TCC engage, rpm drop in the logs shows it. Absolutely any change in throttle, and I mean slight, instant slip
The TCC tables have been set to 90 min/100 max from day 1, along with the TCC slip
Soft Apply with Slip. I can feel the TCC engage, rpm drop in the logs shows it. Absolutely any change in throttle, and I mean slight, instant slip
The TCC tables have been set to 90 min/100 max from day 1, along with the TCC slip
05-10-2017, 10:17 PM
#37
TECH Fanatic
I rarely ever have issues with a 4L60E not locking up after a rebuild, I fix the TCC regulator issue, Install all new Delco Solenoids & it works every time!
I would test the TCC Enable Solenoid.....Remove the Screen from the end, Using a extended rubber tip on a air blower.....Apply shop air to the Solenoid Snout with power & ground applied, It should hold 150 PSI just fine with zero leakage. Make sure the O-ring on the snout is not damaged or missing.
Check the TCC Apply Valve for freedom of movement with a long Awl, Apply Valve issues are very rare.
Pull the Valve body next if the TCC enable solenoid & Apply Valve check out, Pull the TCC Regulator Valve & post pictures.
If that checks out, Have the Converter cut!
05-11-2017, 06:50 PM
#38
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OK, Missed the post about being able to set slip codes at will
I rarely ever have issues with a 4L60E not locking up after a rebuild, I fix the TCC regulator issue, Install all new Delco Solenoids & it works every time!
I would test the TCC Enable Solenoid.....Remove the Screen from the end, Using a extended rubber tip on a air blower.....Apply shop air to the Solenoid Snout with power & ground applied, It should hold 150 PSI just fine with zero leakage. Make sure the O-ring on the snout is not damaged or missing.
Check the TCC Apply Valve for freedom of movement with a long Awl, Apply Valve issues are very rare.
Pull the Valve body next if the TCC enable solenoid & Apply Valve check out, Pull the TCC Regulator Valve & post pictures.
If that checks out, Have the Converter cut!
I rarely ever have issues with a 4L60E not locking up after a rebuild, I fix the TCC regulator issue, Install all new Delco Solenoids & it works every time!
I would test the TCC Enable Solenoid.....Remove the Screen from the end, Using a extended rubber tip on a air blower.....Apply shop air to the Solenoid Snout with power & ground applied, It should hold 150 PSI just fine with zero leakage. Make sure the O-ring on the snout is not damaged or missing.
Check the TCC Apply Valve for freedom of movement with a long Awl, Apply Valve issues are very rare.
Pull the Valve body next if the TCC enable solenoid & Apply Valve check out, Pull the TCC Regulator Valve & post pictures.
If that checks out, Have the Converter cut!
07-16-2017, 04:17 PM
#40
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Pretty sure I lost the pump yesterday, no forward movement, and a nice clacking when the engine is running.
Checked for fluid drop with the engine running, which is almost zilch, but my Blazer drops right down no issue.
So the plan is to replace the pump, as I would rather not risk rebuilding it and its all chewed up inside.
Also found a crack in the weld joint on the piece of **** TCI converter too.
That being said, I plan on grabbing a pump off ebay. Anything I can stuff inside it from sonnax or whoever to fix the no-lockup issue as well?
