It lives!!!!
08-21-2012, 07:06 PM
#22
Staging Lane
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Cars & Coffee every Saturday from 10-12 just South of 465 on Meridian... I'll be in Indy the next 2 weekends and plan on going. Since you cammed up, I'll have to finally get off my *** and upgrade my pulley to stay ahead of you! ha.
08-23-2012, 12:50 AM
#24
Guys,
Thought I would chime in quickly here.
To answer the question quoted above its a custom cam I have run in numerous "Mamofied" packages.....especially those where I'm looking for a broad power curve and Im willing to trade some upper RPM peak power for stronger "area under the curve" with more bottom end / midrange torque and horsepower.
To be more specific about its spec's however, it's a 227/227 single pattern on a 114 LSA with a little over .600 lift and its a good choice in a combination that has a head with an exceptionally strong exhaust to intake ratio (which the reworked 215's do have) and assumes your trying to tailor the power curve like I described above.
It has excellent street manners and its ideal for a stealthy combination as it doesn't give away too much of its performance intent at an idle.
In a lighter car I would run a little more exhaust lobe but this is perfect in a 2+ ton cruiser.
Note this entire package was aimed at being a much more balanced combination....you cant go swinging for the fences in a vehicle this heavy, not with a small displacement engine at least. Big peak numbers from a displacement challenged combination only come from a package designed to breathe really well at high RPM because thats the only way a small engine (which is limited in torque output) can make big power. The inherent problem with that is an engine built to shine upstairs (requiring larger heads, more aggressive camshafts, etc.) is unfortunately always going to be a pooch on the bottom, a trait that in a heavy car is completely undesirable (the car will feel like its 3 tons unless the engine is spinning 4K+).
This wont be a dyno queen but it will certainly outrun a few that are and to drive and experience both in a car this big and heavy....trust me you would pick a combination similar to this every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Now in spite of it's dare I say mild mannered nature (compared to some larger cammed combo's) I'm still confident it will punch a respectable number (because we optimized alot of its airflow/breathing related components), but the shape of the power curve is more important in an application such as this than the actual peak numbers....and of course dyno's are dyno's (tuning tools really) and they all read differently anyway. The beauty of this package is its ability to be extremely responsive and powerful at every RPM, yet do so with little compromises or sacrifices. It will make the peak numbers of similar combo's with larger cams, yet make a bunch more bottom and not have the trade offs and short comings associated with larger cammed cars on the street. That might be an OK or acceptable compromise in a light car such as a Vette, but a really bad move in a heavy car that requires good torque output early in the curve if the car is going to feel spirited at all and get out of its own way.
On a personal note I feel the need to add that somewhere midway thru this project Shane (Lollygagger the OP) started getting hung up on dyno numbers (too much reading on the Internet I suspect....LOL) and I felt the need to reel him in a little knowing the package I designed was going to work out great for him. It became an intense conversation of sorts that I feel damaged the relationship a bit (unfortunately), and at the time I offered him the opportunity to swap to a larger cam because bigger peak numbers seemed to be a growing concern of his.
When the smoke cleared he ultimately decided to stay the course (some of that I feel due to potentially having to flycut pistons) but none the less he opted to keep the "smaller" cam and the package I originally designed for him, which (IMO) was a good move on his part and the more he experiences it (and possibly some other cars for a larger reference point), the more he will realize how good a move it was. Modding a two ton cruiser that's more of a daily driver is not the same as modding a lighter sports car or part time toy....it has to be approached in a much smarter fashion or regrets and nagging trade-offs slowly ruin all the fun.
Enjoy the new combination Shane.....I hope its everything you hoped for and more. Sorry for the bumps in the road along the way
Cheers,
Tony
Thought I would chime in quickly here.
To answer the question quoted above its a custom cam I have run in numerous "Mamofied" packages.....especially those where I'm looking for a broad power curve and Im willing to trade some upper RPM peak power for stronger "area under the curve" with more bottom end / midrange torque and horsepower.
To be more specific about its spec's however, it's a 227/227 single pattern on a 114 LSA with a little over .600 lift and its a good choice in a combination that has a head with an exceptionally strong exhaust to intake ratio (which the reworked 215's do have) and assumes your trying to tailor the power curve like I described above.
It has excellent street manners and its ideal for a stealthy combination as it doesn't give away too much of its performance intent at an idle.
In a lighter car I would run a little more exhaust lobe but this is perfect in a 2+ ton cruiser.
Note this entire package was aimed at being a much more balanced combination....you cant go swinging for the fences in a vehicle this heavy, not with a small displacement engine at least. Big peak numbers from a displacement challenged combination only come from a package designed to breathe really well at high RPM because thats the only way a small engine (which is limited in torque output) can make big power. The inherent problem with that is an engine built to shine upstairs (requiring larger heads, more aggressive camshafts, etc.) is unfortunately always going to be a pooch on the bottom, a trait that in a heavy car is completely undesirable (the car will feel like its 3 tons unless the engine is spinning 4K+).
This wont be a dyno queen but it will certainly outrun a few that are and to drive and experience both in a car this big and heavy....trust me you would pick a combination similar to this every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Now in spite of it's dare I say mild mannered nature (compared to some larger cammed combo's) I'm still confident it will punch a respectable number (because we optimized alot of its airflow/breathing related components), but the shape of the power curve is more important in an application such as this than the actual peak numbers....and of course dyno's are dyno's (tuning tools really) and they all read differently anyway. The beauty of this package is its ability to be extremely responsive and powerful at every RPM, yet do so with little compromises or sacrifices. It will make the peak numbers of similar combo's with larger cams, yet make a bunch more bottom and not have the trade offs and short comings associated with larger cammed cars on the street. That might be an OK or acceptable compromise in a light car such as a Vette, but a really bad move in a heavy car that requires good torque output early in the curve if the car is going to feel spirited at all and get out of its own way.
On a personal note I feel the need to add that somewhere midway thru this project Shane (Lollygagger the OP) started getting hung up on dyno numbers (too much reading on the Internet I suspect....LOL) and I felt the need to reel him in a little knowing the package I designed was going to work out great for him. It became an intense conversation of sorts that I feel damaged the relationship a bit (unfortunately), and at the time I offered him the opportunity to swap to a larger cam because bigger peak numbers seemed to be a growing concern of his.
When the smoke cleared he ultimately decided to stay the course (some of that I feel due to potentially having to flycut pistons) but none the less he opted to keep the "smaller" cam and the package I originally designed for him, which (IMO) was a good move on his part and the more he experiences it (and possibly some other cars for a larger reference point), the more he will realize how good a move it was. Modding a two ton cruiser that's more of a daily driver is not the same as modding a lighter sports car or part time toy....it has to be approached in a much smarter fashion or regrets and nagging trade-offs slowly ruin all the fun.
Enjoy the new combination Shane.....I hope its everything you hoped for and more. Sorry for the bumps in the road along the way
Cheers,
Tony
Last edited by Tony Mamo @ AFR; 08-23-2012 at 02:43 AM.
08-23-2012, 09:30 AM
#26
The LsX shootout is the biggest gathering of LS powered cars. The fastest LS cars in the country will be there.. We are just lucky enough that is in Indy for a 2nd year in a row. Its an all wknd thing. Jet powered dragsters, Outlaws, single digit cars are common, Lots of vendors its worth checking out if you like that type of stuff..
We could meet at Ricks Boatyard again, the track is only 10 min from there.
We could meet at Ricks Boatyard again, the track is only 10 min from there.
227/231 114 LSA
Thanks man!
Here's a little video of me leaving the Woodward Dream Cruise meet. Nothing too crazy, but still kinda cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpJwB...ature=youtu.be
08-23-2012, 10:06 AM
#28
To be more specific about its spec's however, it's a 227/231 single pattern on a 114 LSA with a little over .600 lift and its a good choice in a combination that has a head with an exceptionally strong exhaust to intake ratio (which the reworked 215's do have) and assumes your trying to tailor the power curve like I described above.
On a personal note I feel the need to add that somewhere midway thru this project Shane (Lollygagger the OP) started getting hung up on dyno numbers (too much reading on the Internet I suspect....LOL) and I felt the need to reel him in a little knowing the package I designed was going to work out great for him. It became an intense conversation of sorts that I feel damaged the relationship a bit (unfortunately), and at the time I offered him the opportunity to swap to a larger cam because bigger peak numbers seemed to be a growing concern of his.
When the smoke cleared he ultimately decided to stay the course (some of that I feel due to potentially having to flycut pistons) but none the less he opted to keep the "smaller" cam and the package I originally designed for him, which (IMO) was a good move on his part and the more he experiences it (and possibly some other cars for a larger reference point), the more he will realize how good a move it was. Modding a two ton cruiser that's more of a daily driver is not the same as modding a lighter sports car or part time toy....it has to be approached in a much smarter fashion or regrets and nagging trade-offs slowly ruin all the fun.
Enjoy the new combination Shane.....I hope its everything you hoped for and more. Sorry for the bumps in the road along the way
Cheers,
Tony
When the smoke cleared he ultimately decided to stay the course (some of that I feel due to potentially having to flycut pistons) but none the less he opted to keep the "smaller" cam and the package I originally designed for him, which (IMO) was a good move on his part and the more he experiences it (and possibly some other cars for a larger reference point), the more he will realize how good a move it was. Modding a two ton cruiser that's more of a daily driver is not the same as modding a lighter sports car or part time toy....it has to be approached in a much smarter fashion or regrets and nagging trade-offs slowly ruin all the fun.
Enjoy the new combination Shane.....I hope its everything you hoped for and more. Sorry for the bumps in the road along the way
Cheers,
Tony
The other concern from me was spending the **** ton of money and maybe not seeing a **** ton of HP in return. Like Tony and I talked about, I could get a Maggie for cheaper than this H/C combo and have great numbers and he talked me out of it due to heatsoak issues. We had some heated conversations about $$ vs. HP, which is everyone's concern with doing any upgrades to make power. Plain and simple.
Even though now I want a S/C on top of this combo now
It's always the same. You have 300hp, you want 400. You have 400hp, you want 500 and so on.
I did a baseline before the mods so once I get back to the dyno I can see the actual amount gained from the combo. All in all, I'm very happy with the choice and thank Tony for the help, and eating up all my cash.
Oh, and I know the 80's are coming back, but not being able to use a credit card is redonkulous Tony! lolz.
I'm also putting all my pics and notes together for a writeup. I have a **** ton of pics, I just need to photoshop arrows, and get all these TQ specs out of my head that kept me up a few nights lol.
08-23-2012, 10:58 AM
#30
on the pics wit arrows aka write up
08-23-2012, 11:11 AM
#32
TECH Resident
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Looks and Sounds great!
This maybe a strange request and off topic but can we get a little more video of those wheels moving? I'm thinking about getting a set and want to see how they look in motion.
This maybe a strange request and off topic but can we get a little more video of those wheels moving? I'm thinking about getting a set and want to see how they look in motion.
08-23-2012, 11:49 AM
#33
That was the beginning of your HP bug biting you and I decided to spec/grind it with a larger exhaust lobe to help the top end a tad....originally we discussed going with the single pattern 227.
Sorry for the confusion guys.....I typed it from memory at close to 1AM last night!
Enjoy the car and yes....it never ends.....once you get used to this you want more and them more becomes not enough as well (I have obsolescence planned into every project Im involved in including my own!.....LOL)
Its a disease man.....and a very addictive one!
-Tony
08-23-2012, 02:32 PM
#36
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You where in Detroit last weekend? I was home for that... i was got a few pics and short vid from sitting at the car wash on 11mile & Wooward... Nice!!
Thanks man!
Thank you!!!
Here's a little video of me leaving the Woodward Dream Cruise meet. Nothing too crazy, but still kinda cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpJwB...ature=youtu.be[/QUOTE]
Thanks man!
Thank you!!!
Here's a little video of me leaving the Woodward Dream Cruise meet. Nothing too crazy, but still kinda cool.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpJwB...ature=youtu.be[/QUOTE]
08-23-2012, 02:51 PM
#37
Lol. I'll make another video sometime soon man. You should get those rimsies....they are very nice.
Hell ya....you should've came by the V tent!
Scroll down past the STS-V and check out some of the pics......that was an amazing time!!!
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...-2012-a-7.html
Scroll down past the STS-V and check out some of the pics......that was an amazing time!!!
http://www.cadillacforums.com/forums...-2012-a-7.html
08-24-2012, 09:07 AM
#38
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Nice!! I wish i had known you guys where meeting up somewhere... i am home in Detroit like twice a month. I can throw my cell pics here. Haven't been on CF in many many moons...lol
08-24-2012, 08:22 PM
#39
