S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

Hi All,

Here I am finally ready to crank my "new" engine and it won't fire. My MSD-6010 is about 3 yrs old, but has been in the box until a month ago. I hooked up my laptop and it shows "0" cranking RPM. The motor is from a 23k mile 2003 Corvette with only a cam/pushrod/springs/timing chain change, otherwise stock.

So, what are the symptoms of a "dead" box? And what is the procedure for getting tech support/returning it? Can MSD check these by serial number?

Tomorrow, I plan to double check my power and grounds, but I'm confident they're OK...

Thanks!

Russ

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

TTT

I know there have been a few here that had to return their box, what info needs to be given for a replacement?

Russ

xpndbl3

iTrader: (23)

Check power and ground first, then check that the crank and cam sensors are plugged in properly. Next look on the laptop to see what happens, basically you call MSD and ship them your box and they'll update it and ship it back. My MSD box has started my car probably 50 times now right away everytime in the past month I've had it running. No complaints here, bought the box about 6 months ago.

topher455

iTrader: (6)

Make sure you have power when cranking too. I have seen several people hook into a run only circut instead of a run start circut. I have never had any issues with the three 6010's I have set up but I have heard there are issues with them.

Shawn MacAnanny

iTrader: (12)

Also try fully charging the battery or jumping the battery. If the box doesnt see 200 RPMs it wont fire. Do you have a timing pill in the box to get it to start or have you atleast uploaded a tune?

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

Pulled stuff apart today for inspection and just to check and be sure my harness was pinned correctly. Checked voltages while there and found with 12.75 across the batt, I have 12.55 on the cam circuit, 12.49 on the crank circuit, and 12.49 at the MSD box. Laptop shows no error codes (these are alluded to on MSD's tech forum, but do not exist in any manual) and "0" cranking RPM even though the motor spins freely. Did you have to send back the harness too?

I'l check tomorrow, but I'm pretty sure I do. There aren't many circuits in a '72 Maverick that kill juice while cranking...

I might try a pill just to see, but from what I've read, a pill will wipe out any programming and "0" out all the tables (of course, reloading isn't all that much trouble). I have 9.9V while cranking, even that should produce some kind of tach signal???

Anybody have a list of the possible error codes in graphview while connected? After looking around MSD's forum (I signed up, but can't post yet), it appears that some peeps with their battery "trunk-mounted" like mine are experiencing trouble. MSD says grounding through the chassis is a no-no. Personally, I can't see it... They also recommended grounding both heads (tried that today, no help) to the block, which is grounded to the chassis with 16" of #2 wire. My MSD box is under the dash and my harness has pretty much been incorporated into the chassis harness. I haven't paid any attention to the coil wiring yet since I have no cranking RPM's showing...

Russ

xpndbl3

iTrader: (23)

if you only have 9.9volt while cranking that is your issue. the box needs to see around 12 volts minimum during cranking to fire up. Sounds like a weak battery to me, just the starter shouldn't pull it down that far.

rickou812

iTrader: (10)

I just went through this and this is what I had to do to check it per MSD tech:

1: pull all 8 plugs and hook to plug wire and lay plugs onto the coil brackets.

2:Hook your lap top to the box and start up the tuning software.

3: Spin motor over with the plugs out and see if you get a RPM reading and of course see if the plugs are firing.

If the answer is yes, then they will send you a UPS shipping label to return the box to them for replacement.

This is a known issue, for some reason the box will not read RPM at low engine cranking speeds.

Pop N Wood

iTrader: (1)

You beat me to my suggestion. A very common problem. Hopefully MSD has a solid fix.

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

Interesting! I wonder what they are doing to (the boxes to) rectify this? I was in for the day, but my curiousity is up and that wouldn't take long...

< Well, that didn't work either, still no fire. Did find something interesting though, I previously tested for connectivity by sucking on the MAP hose while hooked up to the laptop. With the key on, the MAP table would show corresponding movement. However, as soon as I crank it, the MAP reading freezes no matter what is happening with the vacuum (no change while cranking).

Something else strange. I VOM'ed my distribution block (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2103983&tab=summary) and found continuity between the ground part and the 12V key-on part, yet no fuses are blown and everything else tied into it works as expected. Guess I need to run a direct hot and see what happens...>

Russ

xpndbl3

iTrader: (23)

your msd box wires should be ran directly to the battery or the pos cutoff switch and to the batt ground as well. I used 10 gauge wire, skip running through 40 year old junk factory wiring. Hop on a quality relay and a fuse holder and you're golden.

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

The box seems to "go dead" while cranking, so that's on my list for tomorrow. In fact, that's the last thing I can do w/o buying new sensors or sending the box in...

Russ

xpndbl3

iTrader: (23)

I'd definitely just run a dedicated power and ground to the battery for this msd box, it's something that 99% of the racers I know do as well.

topher455

iTrader: (6)

Most newer cars wont start if the cranking voltage drops below 10.5v when cranking. It screws with the sensor signal too much. As stated check your engine to chassis ground and charge the battery. Also try direct wiring the box to the battery for testing purposes.

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

YOWZA!

Thiis ended up being the problem. Sorry if it seemed like I blew you off, I just couldn't get my head around it. After trying a bunch of ineffective stuff, I tried putting the key in "RUN" and using a remote starter button to crank the motor and my 8 little plugs (still mounted to my aluminum ground block) are jumping the gap.

Got my factory wiring diagrams out and took another look. The factory harness had a 12V wire direct from the starter solenoid to the coil + post along with a reduced voltage (ballast resistor) wire through the "RUN" position. When cranking only, the coil got the full 12V but when the key was released and snapped back to "RUN", the reduced voltage from that position fed the coil.

So, now I need to add a relay from BATT to the MSD using the starter wire as the trigger. I'll post back this weekend...

Thanks!

Russ

topher455

iTrader: (6)

Im glad I could help. I have been an auto tech for about 13 years now and most "Horrible Issues/Problems" I have encountered are always from something very very simple. I always tell my trainee's to check the stupid stuff first b/c normally someone else did not.

So how does it drive??

S10xGN

iTrader: (11)

I try not to get too ambitious when I'm on dayshifts, so it''l be the weekend before I can crank it... Then locate some insurance and register it... Lucky for me I'm looking at my 7-day break!

Russ

topher455

iTrader: (6)

Enjoy it and let us know how it does!!

IntercooledC6

iTrader: (2)

check all fuses, make sure you have voltage going to it, check wiring, if all is good box is bad...

topher455

iTrader: (6)

Ummmm.