How to lighten 74 camaro
08-11-2010, 01:51 AM
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How to lighten 74 camaro Hi Guys,
I can buy a 74 camaro roller (no engine or trans) for 600.00 for a street strip car. I will put my 2002 LQ4 with a turbo 400 trans in this car. Sounded great till I read the curb weight on these cars is 3840lbs from 1 source and 3650 from another source online. Supposedly a 1970 Z28 camaro weighs about 3300 lbs.
Why is the 74 so heavy? I know the bumpers are suppossed to be aluminum and larger, but why so much weight?
How can I lighten this car. It already has a fiberglass cowl induction hood. I plan on adding a roll cage, putting in 2 racing front seats, and taking out the back seat, gutting most of the interior, and putting lighter wheels on it. Other ideas are fiberglass doors and a fuel cell instead of a fuel tank. I can always put fiberglass bumpers on it, but isnt most of the weight in the bumper support schock mechanisms? I heard these cars have aluminum bumpers anyway.
It can be mostly stripped out for a lot of strip use with some street use too.
How light can I get this car? Sorry I am brand new to f body camaros.
Anyone with knowledge please chime in. How light can this car get for street strip???
Hpbob1
I can buy a 74 camaro roller (no engine or trans) for 600.00 for a street strip car. I will put my 2002 LQ4 with a turbo 400 trans in this car. Sounded great till I read the curb weight on these cars is 3840lbs from 1 source and 3650 from another source online. Supposedly a 1970 Z28 camaro weighs about 3300 lbs.
Why is the 74 so heavy? I know the bumpers are suppossed to be aluminum and larger, but why so much weight?
How can I lighten this car. It already has a fiberglass cowl induction hood. I plan on adding a roll cage, putting in 2 racing front seats, and taking out the back seat, gutting most of the interior, and putting lighter wheels on it. Other ideas are fiberglass doors and a fuel cell instead of a fuel tank. I can always put fiberglass bumpers on it, but isnt most of the weight in the bumper support schock mechanisms? I heard these cars have aluminum bumpers anyway.
It can be mostly stripped out for a lot of strip use with some street use too.
How light can I get this car? Sorry I am brand new to f body camaros.
Anyone with knowledge please chime in. How light can this car get for street strip???
Hpbob1
08-11-2010, 07:58 AM
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Look deeper into the bumpers, I think that is the area where the car gained the most weight through the years due to government safety standards. I think it has crash beams in the doors, if so they weigh 30-40 pounds each, but might be nice to have in a street car.
08-11-2010, 12:31 PM
#3
The bumpers maybe aluminum, but its the mounting system and all of the added crash and safety equipement that adds the weight.. if you remove that stuff and you will save some weight there.
The doors on 2nd Gen are large and heavy ! gut the inners some and trim the inner sheet metal of the door (cut out, drill large holes, etc).
Replace the front and rear windshield with thinner glass or lighter weight ones.
The doors on 2nd Gen are large and heavy ! gut the inners some and trim the inner sheet metal of the door (cut out, drill large holes, etc).
Replace the front and rear windshield with thinner glass or lighter weight ones.
08-11-2010, 10:04 PM
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Good ideas to lighten 74 camaro Thanks guys,
Sounds like much of the added weight in a 74 camaro vs a 70 is in the bumper support cushioning system and the doors. I just read online there are leaf springs in the bumpers that are very heavy. Someone suggested removing the leafs and just bolting the bumpers in place. I guess the camaro glass can get heavy too.
Anyone have any other ideas on how to lighten this car? Thanks
Hpbob1
Sounds like much of the added weight in a 74 camaro vs a 70 is in the bumper support cushioning system and the doors. I just read online there are leaf springs in the bumpers that are very heavy. Someone suggested removing the leafs and just bolting the bumpers in place. I guess the camaro glass can get heavy too.
Anyone have any other ideas on how to lighten this car? Thanks
Hpbob1
08-12-2010, 07:10 AM
#6
Trade it for a 69?
Seriously, I know the weight went up a good bit with the body change from 69 to 70.
A fuel cell might actually add weight over a stock tank, but is still not a bad idea for track safety.
Getting rid of accessories like AC and power window mechanisms like you already plan on doing will go a long way. A smaller battery will pick up a couple more pounds.
Not all weight gain is bad. Having a rigid chassis is generally a good thing. I think once you get the car it will be obvious what can be stripped.
doh. Just found this link.
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro74.php
Seriously, I know the weight went up a good bit with the body change from 69 to 70.
A fuel cell might actually add weight over a stock tank, but is still not a bad idea for track safety.
Getting rid of accessories like AC and power window mechanisms like you already plan on doing will go a long way. A smaller battery will pick up a couple more pounds.
Not all weight gain is bad. Having a rigid chassis is generally a good thing. I think once you get the car it will be obvious what can be stripped.
doh. Just found this link.
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro74.php
1974 saw the Camaro finally bow to federal bumper guidelines. .... These are some of the reasons why some people believe the "real" camaro ended in 1973 (or 1971 depending on how you look at things), and for many people this era Camaro is often over-looked or forgotten.
08-12-2010, 08:11 AM
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On my 78 Z28 (rubber bumper car) I was able to remove 55 lbs from the front bumper by building a light weight replacement for the steel portion, with a 74 I don't know what you could do accept replacing it with a fibrglass bumper. The door braces each weigh 24-27 lbs. To get them out cut an access hole in the front side of the door to slide the brace out and then use a spot weld cutter to remove the spot welds on the rear side of the door. Once you get the brace out use the spot weld cutter to remove the section of the door and weld it back in. the fill all of the holes from the spot weld cutter and grind them smooth and refinish it. I removed the inner fenders from mine. I can't remmeber what they weighed, but it was worth it. By the time I got done I had to trim the fornt springs to get the ride height back (mine had Moroso drag springs so your's might not need it).
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08-12-2010, 11:25 PM
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Bught the 74 camaro tonight, now to put my LQ4 in Thanks for the responses and Ideas guys! I bought the 74 camaro tonight. I figured out how to take about 300 lbs out of her and get her down to about 3300 lbs without the driver. The 74's are about 3625 lbs stock, where as 70-73 camaro's are about 3320 lbs stock.
It already has a fiberglass cowl induction hood. I will remove the front inner fenderwells, pull the heavy stock leaf spring bumper inserts out of the bumpers and just bolt the bumpers in place. I will have light wheels on the car such as centerlines. The LQ4 has aluminum heads, water pump and oil pan as opposed to all cast iron small bock chevy factory stuff. I will probably need a newer late model camaro oil pan to make her fit. I am also going with a aluminum radiator. I will also replace the current non-stock front bucket seats with padded race seats, and maybe remove the rear seat. Car has no console, radio or heater core. And I will delete the steel beam door inserts as well. Also the intake manifold will be a late model LS1 fiber intake manifold as opposed to factory cast iron.
Only weight adders will be a turbo 400 trans (vs a turbo 350) and a roll cage. I will probably add a heater core back in for colder weather. Yes it gets down to the 40's in california in the winter here at night! lol The car is pretty clean for a roller. I will post pics soon and start a build thread. Right now I am putting my 88 5.0 hatch mustang up for sale. Has no trans but a factory 302 and I took the console out thinking it was going to be a drag only car. It is mostly stock and rough. Will probably ask about 500.00 for it. I also have a fresh built race c4 ford trans with extra clutches and a trans brake. I will be selling that to get a good turbo 400.
Plans for the camaro are a 12 bolt rear end and mini tub, nice set of wheels and tires, Z28 clone emblems, LQ4 with 2002 Z06 roller cam, Built turbo 400 with extra clutches and trans brake, 3.73 gears, Aluminum drive shaft. To top her off I am adding a S400 borg warner turbo (about 599.00 new) with a VS racing 200.00 intercooler and homemade DIY turbo intake and exhaust tubing. I will run her on 93 octane pump gas and methanol injection.
For suspention mods I will have moroso front springs, adjustable shocks up front and cal tracs out back.
This wil be a street/strip car. A mix of about 70 percent street and 30 percent track. Mostly 1/8th mile drags. Car should make about 400 hp naturally aspirated and about 800 hp under 15 lbs of boost.
Again I wil post pics this weekend and start a build thread too. The build should take about 6 months do to budget and slow economy.
Sorry about writing a book here, but I just bought this car tonight, brought it home and I am pretty jazzed about it!!!
Hpbob1
It already has a fiberglass cowl induction hood. I will remove the front inner fenderwells, pull the heavy stock leaf spring bumper inserts out of the bumpers and just bolt the bumpers in place. I will have light wheels on the car such as centerlines. The LQ4 has aluminum heads, water pump and oil pan as opposed to all cast iron small bock chevy factory stuff. I will probably need a newer late model camaro oil pan to make her fit. I am also going with a aluminum radiator. I will also replace the current non-stock front bucket seats with padded race seats, and maybe remove the rear seat. Car has no console, radio or heater core. And I will delete the steel beam door inserts as well. Also the intake manifold will be a late model LS1 fiber intake manifold as opposed to factory cast iron.
Only weight adders will be a turbo 400 trans (vs a turbo 350) and a roll cage. I will probably add a heater core back in for colder weather. Yes it gets down to the 40's in california in the winter here at night! lol The car is pretty clean for a roller. I will post pics soon and start a build thread. Right now I am putting my 88 5.0 hatch mustang up for sale. Has no trans but a factory 302 and I took the console out thinking it was going to be a drag only car. It is mostly stock and rough. Will probably ask about 500.00 for it. I also have a fresh built race c4 ford trans with extra clutches and a trans brake. I will be selling that to get a good turbo 400.
Plans for the camaro are a 12 bolt rear end and mini tub, nice set of wheels and tires, Z28 clone emblems, LQ4 with 2002 Z06 roller cam, Built turbo 400 with extra clutches and trans brake, 3.73 gears, Aluminum drive shaft. To top her off I am adding a S400 borg warner turbo (about 599.00 new) with a VS racing 200.00 intercooler and homemade DIY turbo intake and exhaust tubing. I will run her on 93 octane pump gas and methanol injection.
For suspention mods I will have moroso front springs, adjustable shocks up front and cal tracs out back.
This wil be a street/strip car. A mix of about 70 percent street and 30 percent track. Mostly 1/8th mile drags. Car should make about 400 hp naturally aspirated and about 800 hp under 15 lbs of boost.
Again I wil post pics this weekend and start a build thread too. The build should take about 6 months do to budget and slow economy.
Sorry about writing a book here, but I just bought this car tonight, brought it home and I am pretty jazzed about it!!!
Hpbob1
08-12-2010, 11:50 PM
#10
Trade it for a 69?
Seriously, I know the weight went up a good bit with the body change from 69 to 70.
A fuel cell might actually add weight over a stock tank, but is still not a bad idea for track safety.
Getting rid of accessories like AC and power window mechanisms like you already plan on doing will go a long way. A smaller battery will pick up a couple more pounds.
Not all weight gain is bad. Having a rigid chassis is generally a good thing. I think once you get the car it will be obvious what can be stripped.
doh. Just found this link.
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro74.php
Seriously, I know the weight went up a good bit with the body change from 69 to 70.
A fuel cell might actually add weight over a stock tank, but is still not a bad idea for track safety.
Getting rid of accessories like AC and power window mechanisms like you already plan on doing will go a long way. A smaller battery will pick up a couple more pounds.
Not all weight gain is bad. Having a rigid chassis is generally a good thing. I think once you get the car it will be obvious what can be stripped.
doh. Just found this link.
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro74.php
69 specs:
The 1969 Chevrolet Camaro Z28
Specifications
Wheelbase, inches: 108.1
Weight, lbs: 3,765
Number built: 20,302
Base price: $3,185
1970 specs:
Length: 188.0" Height: 50.1" Width: 74.4" Wheelbase: 108.0" Weight: 3313
My 73 weighs 33?? but I have a harwood 4 inch cowl.
Also they do make fiberglass bumpers for 74-77 camaros. Here is one
Last edited by jamminj007; 08-13-2010 at 12:03 AM.
08-13-2010, 12:23 AM
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WOW, Beautiful 74 red camaro pic! My camaro is silver with about a 4 inch fiberglass cowl hood painted silver to match. I like the wheels and everything on this red 74 in the pic. About the only thing I will add is the Z28 clone emblems on the front fenders and the trunk area. My car is not that clean, but the paint is not bad at all. So with those wheels, car polished up and Z28emblems, she would still look really good right now! I will post pics this weekend!
Hpbob1
Hpbob1
08-13-2010, 06:27 AM
#13
These two links seems to verify that distant memory
http://www.oldride.com/library/1969_...et_camaro.html --> 3,135 lbs
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro70.php --> 3313#
Guess all those 70's disco biscuits didn't do as much damage as I thought.
By the way, very pretty car. I do love that body style.
Last edited by Pop N Wood; 08-13-2010 at 06:35 AM.
08-13-2010, 09:58 AM
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Thanks pop n wood,
Yes the 67-69 1st generation are definitely lighter. The 70 - 73's are about 100 lbs heavier. I just need to take the weight out of my 74 from the bumper support system and door inserts to make it as light as the 70-73's. Thats definitely a very pretty 74 pic!
Hpbob1
Yes the 67-69 1st generation are definitely lighter. The 70 - 73's are about 100 lbs heavier. I just need to take the weight out of my 74 from the bumper support system and door inserts to make it as light as the 70-73's. Thats definitely a very pretty 74 pic!
Hpbob1
08-13-2010, 10:09 AM
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Is that 74 mini tubbed? By the way, does that red 74 camaro look mini tubbed? Can I get those rear wheels under my stock 74 camaro quarter panels like that? Those are exactly the type of mags and wheels I want. Skinnies up front and deep dish probably drag radials in the back. How will this car handle on the street? I am more into straight line acceleration than worrying about cornering. Sorry for all the newb questions. I am brand new to 2nd generation F body camaros.
Hpbob1
Hpbob1
08-13-2010, 10:28 AM
#16
camaro In all honestly that was probably from a hot rod magazine article I read back in the 70's. The number rattling around in my head was a 200 pound gain.
These two links seems to verify that distant memory
http://www.oldride.com/library/1969_...et_camaro.html --> 3,135 lbs
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro70.php --> 3313#
Guess all those 70's disco biscuits didn't do as much damage as I thought.
By the way, very pretty car. I do love that body style.
These two links seems to verify that distant memory
http://www.oldride.com/library/1969_...et_camaro.html --> 3,135 lbs
http://www.nastyz28.com/camaro/camaro70.php --> 3313#
Guess all those 70's disco biscuits didn't do as much damage as I thought.
By the way, very pretty car. I do love that body style.
This is mine a 73 Camaro has a LY6 and 4l80e
08-13-2010, 11:07 AM
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i have an 81 z28 that weighed in at 3204 w/o driver. only had a fiberglass hood. the interior was minimal but did have all the seats and door panels, no console, radio, a/c etc. but had a moly 6pt cage installed. also got rid of the heater housing on the firewall because it was an original ac car and a heater onlt box for an 81 is few and far between. the engine was an alum. head 355 and had the wheelwells still in the car. just my 2 cents but i would leave the wheelwlls int he car for 2 reasons. 1. it helps stiffen the front of the car up. if you have ever placed the car on jack stands and let the front down you can see how far the front sags. 2 having the wheelwlls in the car keeps the air out from under the car. im not an areo expert but ive read numerous articles that say that is worth a few mph at the drags. the doors are heavy and i believe the glass is thicker so a set of 70-73 doors and glass would help and modding that monster front bumper would help, but if you gut the interior and heater box (i live in indiana, usually had enough eat to keep the windows from fogging) should get down to that 32xx-33xx weight mark. hope this info helps
08-14-2010, 04:52 PM
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Pics of my 74 camaro Hi Guys,
Thanks for the responses.
Jamminj007 Nice ride, very clean sharp camaro! Does anyone know if the rear wheel area of the red 74 camaro pic in this thread is mini tubbed? I am guessing probably. That is the look I want. Below are pics of my new 74 camaro. Right now there is no engine or trans. It is going to to get my LQ4 motor and a turbo 400 trans, and then stage 2 will be adding a turbo.
I want to put nice wheels and tires like the red camaros wheels and Z28 emblems on the car. Notice my speedometer goes to 130mph and my factory in dash tach goes to 7,000. Was this a standard V8 option in 74 or a Z28 option. I doubt my car is a original real Z28, but I wil make it appear as a Z28 clone with fender and trunk Z28 emblems then be powered by a 75mm S400 borg warner turbo with a 364 cube LS LQ4 motor running a 2002 Z06 vette cam. I will will run 3.73 gears and this will be a street/strip car.
Anyone know if this is an electric or mechanical in dash factory tach? I will probably try to hook it up and also run my own aftermarket tach.
Notice the crap wheels on this car I got in the sale. What do you guys think for 600.00??? This car now is dirty and all dusty and not even washed. I am temporarily storing it at a friends house in a field so I cant wash it there. If it were washed and rubbed out, and had nice wheels and Z28 emblems I think it will look sharp now without even painting it. A nice paint job is probably 2 or 3 year s down the road. First I will get it all set running good mechanically.
I will be starting my build thread soon.
Thanks for the responses.
Jamminj007 Nice ride, very clean sharp camaro! Does anyone know if the rear wheel area of the red 74 camaro pic in this thread is mini tubbed? I am guessing probably. That is the look I want. Below are pics of my new 74 camaro. Right now there is no engine or trans. It is going to to get my LQ4 motor and a turbo 400 trans, and then stage 2 will be adding a turbo.
I want to put nice wheels and tires like the red camaros wheels and Z28 emblems on the car. Notice my speedometer goes to 130mph and my factory in dash tach goes to 7,000. Was this a standard V8 option in 74 or a Z28 option. I doubt my car is a original real Z28, but I wil make it appear as a Z28 clone with fender and trunk Z28 emblems then be powered by a 75mm S400 borg warner turbo with a 364 cube LS LQ4 motor running a 2002 Z06 vette cam. I will will run 3.73 gears and this will be a street/strip car.
Anyone know if this is an electric or mechanical in dash factory tach? I will probably try to hook it up and also run my own aftermarket tach.
Notice the crap wheels on this car I got in the sale. What do you guys think for 600.00??? This car now is dirty and all dusty and not even washed. I am temporarily storing it at a friends house in a field so I cant wash it there. If it were washed and rubbed out, and had nice wheels and Z28 emblems I think it will look sharp now without even painting it. A nice paint job is probably 2 or 3 year s down the road. First I will get it all set running good mechanically.
I will be starting my build thread soon.
08-14-2010, 05:47 PM
#19
Does anyone know if the rear wheel area of the red 74 camaro pic in this thread is mini tubbed?
No the red car is not tubbed. It only has a 15x8 wheel. Our camaros can take a 10 inch wheel with no issiues whatsoever(I have 17x10). Now if you want to put an 11 inch wheel your gonna have to beat the left side seatbelt hump in.
No the red car is not tubbed. It only has a 15x8 wheel. Our camaros can take a 10 inch wheel with no issiues whatsoever(I have 17x10). Now if you want to put an 11 inch wheel your gonna have to beat the left side seatbelt hump in.
08-14-2010, 11:59 PM
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Got the wheel size, what about tires? Thanks jamminj007,
What size do you think the rear tires are on that red 74 camaro in the pic? I bet a set of 4 15x10 rims would look good on a street car too.
What do you think of riding with skinnies up front and fat tires (like the red camaro pic) in the rear vs fat tires on all 4 corners? How is handling etc on the street?
I like the look of skinnies up front and meaty tires with a deep dish mag in the back. But my friends are saying the car wont handle very well when driving on the street.
Whats your opinion for actual driving experience with skinnies up front and wide tires out back? By the way your 73 looks great! Very clean and a real nice green color with the black vinyle top!
Hpbob1
What size do you think the rear tires are on that red 74 camaro in the pic? I bet a set of 4 15x10 rims would look good on a street car too.
What do you think of riding with skinnies up front and fat tires (like the red camaro pic) in the rear vs fat tires on all 4 corners? How is handling etc on the street?
I like the look of skinnies up front and meaty tires with a deep dish mag in the back. But my friends are saying the car wont handle very well when driving on the street.
Whats your opinion for actual driving experience with skinnies up front and wide tires out back? By the way your 73 looks great! Very clean and a real nice green color with the black vinyle top!
Hpbob1