LS1/T56 into a 68 Camaro
09-01-2014, 07:37 AM
#101
If you have the heads off of the car find a Snap-On pneumatic compressor. They can be had used for around $150 and work effortlessly. Let me know how the Comp Cams compressor works. I need to change out my existing springs and I really hate to pull the heads just for that.
09-03-2014, 08:00 AM
#102
Just hit a major snag in my build. My stock rocker arms with trunnion upgrade have major interference with my valve spring retainers. I am using World Product Warhawk heads that have 1.550" double springs and a 1.950" installed height. The heads are off the engine now so I loosely bolted the rocker arm using the stock pedestal and the tip of the rocker was at least 1/8" off of the valve tip because the rocker body was hitting the edge of the spring retainer. I can take pictures if needed to show this better. I am using a Comp Cams LSr cam grind with .610"/.617" lift at 1.7 ratio. I planned on checking pushrod length and replacing the pushrods no matter what.
As far as I can tell I have the following options:
1. Shim the pedestal to raise the rocker and clear the spring retainer. I don't know if this is a valid option strengthwise. I also know I would have to check the wipe pattern and use longer pushrods if I do this.
2. Get different springs and retainers (Comp cams has one with a 1.320" dia and 1.835" installed height that is made to go with the cam. I don't know if this would give me the clearance I need or not with the stock rockers. I know I would need to shim the springs .115" and also I would need spring locators due to the smaller size.
3. Get new rocker arms like the Yella Terra that have adjustable mounts. Thsi seems pretty straightforward, but I still don't know if they will clear the 1.550" springs.
Any help or ideas you guy can give is appreciated.
As far as I can tell I have the following options:
1. Shim the pedestal to raise the rocker and clear the spring retainer. I don't know if this is a valid option strengthwise. I also know I would have to check the wipe pattern and use longer pushrods if I do this.
2. Get different springs and retainers (Comp cams has one with a 1.320" dia and 1.835" installed height that is made to go with the cam. I don't know if this would give me the clearance I need or not with the stock rockers. I know I would need to shim the springs .115" and also I would need spring locators due to the smaller size.
3. Get new rocker arms like the Yella Terra that have adjustable mounts. Thsi seems pretty straightforward, but I still don't know if they will clear the 1.550" springs.
Any help or ideas you guy can give is appreciated.
09-03-2014, 12:40 PM
#103
I spoke to Bill Mitchell/The Engine Shop (World products heads), Yella Terra and Comp Cams. Based on those discussions and comments on another thread I started, I am going with the 26926TS-Kit Comp spring kit and the Yella Terra YT6638 Rocker arms. I will have to shim the springs to get the right installed height and may have to grind on the head/valve cover for rocker clearance. These heads I bought, which seemed like such a bargain are now bleeding me dry. This engine better run like a bear when I am done.
10-02-2014, 01:44 PM
#104
Well things have changed alot in one month. The World Product Warhawks are gone. I sold them to another forum member for $800 and returned the Yella Terras and the Comp Cam Springs. No matter what I tried, I couldn't get these heads to work for me without major modifications or high dollar shaft rocker arrangements that were not inline with the rest of my build.
In their place, I talked to Texas Speed and went with the PRC 5.3L Stage 2.5 CNC ported heads. These seem like they will be a perfect match with my stock cubes and cam . They don't make as much peak horsepower as some of the other Texas Speed heads, but have a broad torque curve right in the RPM range my cam is set up for. In addition the price was very reasonable at around $1450.
I recieved them the other day and I have already determined my pushrod length at 7.350" and I have them on order. I was also going to check/degree the cam and check Piston to Valve (PTV) clearance, but my checking springs are overcoming the spring pressure on my lifters. I am going to disassemble two of the old lifters and shim them up tight to be like solids and try again this weekend. Once I clear that hurdle, I should be going right into final assembly.
Anyway here are some pictures of the snags I ran into with the World Product heads. You can see the interference with the Yella Terra and the inside rail, then you can see the mismatched geometry between the stock rockers and the valve when I used the Comp Cam retainer.
In their place, I talked to Texas Speed and went with the PRC 5.3L Stage 2.5 CNC ported heads. These seem like they will be a perfect match with my stock cubes and cam . They don't make as much peak horsepower as some of the other Texas Speed heads, but have a broad torque curve right in the RPM range my cam is set up for. In addition the price was very reasonable at around $1450.
I recieved them the other day and I have already determined my pushrod length at 7.350" and I have them on order. I was also going to check/degree the cam and check Piston to Valve (PTV) clearance, but my checking springs are overcoming the spring pressure on my lifters. I am going to disassemble two of the old lifters and shim them up tight to be like solids and try again this weekend. Once I clear that hurdle, I should be going right into final assembly.
Anyway here are some pictures of the snags I ran into with the World Product heads. You can see the interference with the Yella Terra and the inside rail, then you can see the mismatched geometry between the stock rockers and the valve when I used the Comp Cam retainer.
10-14-2014, 11:55 AM
#106
Things are progressing smoothly. I bought a 9 way adjustable timing set from Cloyes, retarded the cam 4 degrees and now have 0.070" PTV clearance on the intake and 0.112" clearance on the exhaust. Since then I started engine assembly again and now basically have the long block done. I put the valve covers on to paint, but I will have to remove them again toe put the rockers and pushrods on once my pushrods arrive. I had a couple things trip me up a little bit, but I overcame them.
One, I didn't know how I was going to install the damper since I didn't have a installation tool. I ended up buying two M16-2.0 bolts and welding them together head to head. The longer of the two was a 90mm long and threaded into the crank about 1/2 inch. I used my small block chevy damper install bearing and a PVC (yes PVC) pipe adapter to pull the damper onto the crank. It worked like a charm. The 140 degrees of twist required after torquing the bolt was interesting. I had my wife steady the engine while I used a breaker bar and a pipe to get the twist required. I used a piece of angle iron bolted to the crankshaft flange to keep the engine from spinning while I torqued.
Second, the 12mm to 1/8" NPT adapter I bought to install my electric water gauge didn't even come close to working. The temp bulb was too big and if I drilled it out, the threads would have been paper thin. Plan B was to drill out the 12mm hole in he head and tap it to 3/8" NPT. I had the tap, but it was a 3 1/2 hour odyssey to get the 37/64 drill bit required to get the tap started. I finally got it and the drilling and tapping went smoothly.
Almost there now. I am seriously considering packaging up all these tools and making them available to rent for other people building these engines. Something like $10 rental with a $100 deposit and have renter ship it to the next person who needs it. Does anyone think there would be a market for that?
One, I didn't know how I was going to install the damper since I didn't have a installation tool. I ended up buying two M16-2.0 bolts and welding them together head to head. The longer of the two was a 90mm long and threaded into the crank about 1/2 inch. I used my small block chevy damper install bearing and a PVC (yes PVC) pipe adapter to pull the damper onto the crank. It worked like a charm. The 140 degrees of twist required after torquing the bolt was interesting. I had my wife steady the engine while I used a breaker bar and a pipe to get the twist required. I used a piece of angle iron bolted to the crankshaft flange to keep the engine from spinning while I torqued.
Second, the 12mm to 1/8" NPT adapter I bought to install my electric water gauge didn't even come close to working. The temp bulb was too big and if I drilled it out, the threads would have been paper thin. Plan B was to drill out the 12mm hole in he head and tap it to 3/8" NPT. I had the tap, but it was a 3 1/2 hour odyssey to get the 37/64 drill bit required to get the tap started. I finally got it and the drilling and tapping went smoothly.
Almost there now. I am seriously considering packaging up all these tools and making them available to rent for other people building these engines. Something like $10 rental with a $100 deposit and have renter ship it to the next person who needs it. Does anyone think there would be a market for that?
10-23-2014, 05:58 AM
#107
Have you worked out a cooling system yet??? I am doing a 68 LS2/T56 combo and deciding which way to go.. Either 98-02 F body rad/fan or a griffin/fan direct bolt in?
Thanks
BobH
Thanks
BobH
10-27-2014, 07:35 AM
#108
Bob, after seeing someone else on here use the F-body radiator, I decided to go that way. Since I already have the fans from the donor vehicle, all I need is the radiator and then I'll just weld some tabs on my rad support. THis way I may be able to use the stock F-body hoses and I won't have to mod the water pump for the extra cooling line since the radiator will have it. I will probably come out ahead money wise since I have a nice aluminum big block Griffin radiator that I can sell now.
Another good reason for going this way is parts replacement. If I get stuck away from home, I can purchase F-body parts at any auto parts store.
Another good reason for going this way is parts replacement. If I get stuck away from home, I can purchase F-body parts at any auto parts store.
11-01-2014, 06:59 PM
#109
Made good progress this week. Engine and trans are bolted together which is bolted into the subframe and the subframe is bolted into the car. I still have to weld the subrame connectors to the sub, but I will probably finish that tomorrow.
11-13-2014, 07:24 AM
#110
I have welded the connectors, hooked up the steering, power steering hoses, throttle cable, fuel pressure gauge, back up light switch, water temp sensor, vacuum gauge, oil pressure gauge, clutch hydraulics, AC compressor, and belts. Made a bracket for my Lowes sourced air/oil separator and installed it into my PCV system (pictures to follow). Picking up my 4th Gen F-body radiator today and already have my rad support on the bench so I can fabricate and weld the brackets to install it. Received my PSI engine harness and will unbox/install it this weekend. Having some trouble bleeding the hydraulic clutch, but hopefully will get that worked out this weekend. I still have to pressure test the fuel system. Progress being made.
11-16-2014, 01:51 PM
#111
Well I got the clutch all bled. It took a little while, I had to disconnect the line at the bellhousing and get the master bled and then reconnect and bleed the slave. I had a little scare when I saw a puddle of brake fluid under the engine. I figured out that it was brake fluid running down the bleeder line and going into the bellhousing and leaking out the bottom. I have been working with my new PSI harness this weekend and agonizing over where to mount the ECM. I was almost ready to mount it on the passenger side floor with a protective cover over it even though it would affect the leg room on that side, but then I couldn't figure out where I was going to punch the 2" hole in the firewall and where I would mount the fuse panel and relays. I think I have now decided to move the battery to the trunk and put the ECM on the rad support where the battery used to be, but I have to get the radiator mounted to make sure it will all fit. I should have had the radiator by now, but the first one fell through. I should get it this week. Anyway here are some pictures of the air/oil separator that I made a custom bracket for. I may put a 90deg fitting on the top to clean the hoses up a bit.
11-22-2014, 06:59 PM
#113
Worked on the radiator support today. I bought 1" square stock, cut off short lengths and then split them in half to be like C channels. I laid the radiator on the core support and got it where I wanted it, tacked the C channels in place, removed the radiator and finish welded the C channels. For the ECM mount, I drilled holes through the core support, and then welded 5/16 inch flange nuts to the support on the same side as the mount so that it is about 1/2" off the core support. I had to put a washer behind one of the nuts wince the core support isn't completely flat. I installed the ECM with the electrical connections to make sure all the wiring will clear even with the core support mounting bolt installed. I still need to come up with a way to support the bottom of the radiator, but I have a plan and will do this tomorrow.
11-25-2014, 06:17 PM
#114
Sorry Alan for the late reply. The squirt gun we talked about prior is just a standard trigger style oil squirt gun. Nothing fancy. they can be had for a few dollars at Harbor Freight.
As far as the ECM mount, I mounted mine between the battery and the fender to retain the original battery location. I didn't want the battery in the trunk for a few reasons, the main one is corrosion.
Your Camaro is coming along rather fast. Fingers crossed you will hear it fire up by Christmas! Maybe even drive it by then.
As far as the ECM mount, I mounted mine between the battery and the fender to retain the original battery location. I didn't want the battery in the trunk for a few reasons, the main one is corrosion.
Your Camaro is coming along rather fast. Fingers crossed you will hear it fire up by Christmas! Maybe even drive it by then.
11-26-2014, 07:21 PM
#116
I took the day before Thanksgiving off and worked on the car. This will pretty much be the last progress I make before next spring because I have to jump back into a bathroom remodel I started last winter. Today I bolted the radiator support back into the front clip and mounted the AC condenser and ECM support. Then I started mocking up my fuse box relay panel. I bought a stock piece of 16 gauge sheet metal and mounted everything to that. Once I know everything that will go on it, I will cut the panel to size and mount it on the driver side fenderwell. In these pictures I have mounted the fuse box/ignition/fuel relays, the two fan relays and the starter relay. I also plan to mount a junction block to the panel to feed my other 12 volt accessories but FedEx lost my last order and I don't have it yet. The last thin I will do before the weekend is over is get my buddy to help me rest the front clip back onto the subframe so I can free up that bay of the garage for this winter.
03-17-2015, 07:26 AM
#117
Well I got the clutch all bled. It took a little while, I had to disconnect the line at the bellhousing and get the master bled and then reconnect and bleed the slave. I had a little scare when I saw a puddle of brake fluid under the engine. I figured out that it was brake fluid running down the bleeder line and going into the bellhousing and leaking out the bottom.
03-17-2015, 11:16 AM
#118
TECH Senior Member
iTrader: (7)
Well after reading Project Gat Tag O's Cougar build, I figured out that I do have a problem with the slave cylinder. Apparently SPEEDWAY Motors remote bleeder is not designed very well and doesn't use the proper end on its fitting. They give you an aluminum crush washer that is supposed to crutch this issue, but give you no directions on how the kit is supposed to go together. Well since the original bleeder did not have a washer, I don't think I used the one with the Speedway kit and alas there is my leak. Motherf'r I am super pissed off now because I have to pull the damn trans from underneath the car now to fix this. Speedway will be hearing from me.
Andrew
04-21-2015, 09:33 PM
#120
Well my bathroom remodel was finished three weeks ago and after getting the lawn equipment and the motorhome ready for the season, I was able to jump back on the car finally. Right before I quit last year, I threw the front end sheetmetal back on the car so I could use the other garage by during the winter. I also scored a brand new SLP 4th gen radiator for $150 over the winter so now I don't have to worry about my used radiator failing. Since last weekend, I have finished bolting up the front end, installed the radiator and hoses and welded my electrical panel to the inner fenderwell and mounted the components. I ended up making an upper mount for the radiator out of aluminum angle and plate and pop riveting it together. The stock 4th gen radiator hoses are almost a direct bolt in. The upper worked without mods and the lower just had to be shortened on the top and bottom. The wiring looks crazy now, but it will clean up once everything is cut and landed. I've decided I am going to run the intake over to the passenger side since there is a lot of room over there with the battery moved to the trunk.
