One Member's "New" harness woes, PIC HEAVY
03-15-2013, 09:17 PM
#1
One Member's "New" harness woes, PIC HEAVY A short while back I was contacted by a member of this site. He unfortunately was having some serious troubles with his "New" harness. I use the term new loosely. As soon as I removed this harness from the box I found several issues just on the exterior of the harness, before I removed any of the loom. The issue with the harness was it was losing ignition power on one complete bank. I found the issue to be a terminal that had been crimped with a pair of pliers or something other than a crimp tool.
I will not disclose the producer of this harness, not trying to call any certain company out. Just trying to show you guys that you should choose wisely when purchasing a harness. From what I was told this harness wasn't even priced dirt cheap, this company lists their harness for over $500!
Here are the issues I found when looking at the exterior of the harness. The first thing I looked at was the fuse block, and I noticed that the fuses were used, and that the relays were also used and had been painted black to cover up that they were used. The PCM Connectors were also used. Pics Below
Then I started looking at the connectors, to see if they were used or what have you. I found a couple connectors that did not have the Terminal Position Assurance Locks. (TPA). One of those connectors did not even have a seal in it AND it had two wire crimped into one terminal in a connector meant for a one wire sealed termination. Pics Below.
Then I started looking at the wire used to assemble the harness. There were several issues with the wire in this harness. Number one being that there are a lot of primary wire used in the harness, which should never be used in an engine harness. Then when I looked at the wire sizing I noticed that 90% of the harness was made out of 22ga wire. I noticed the coil harness connectors and many other items that should have 20 and 18ga wire had the 22ga wire. After looking at wire sizing I wanted to look at the color codes used. GM color coding was not used in this harness, and on some of the wires I found that a permanent marker was used to attempt to add a tracer to the wire. PICS Below.
Then before stripping off the wire loom, I took a look at what loom was used. It was VERY, VERY thin parts store loom. See Pic.
With the first piece of loom off I found a couple splices, which were "covered" in non-adhesive lined thin wall heat shrink. One of the splices wasnt even completely covered with the heat shrink, and on the large ground splice that I took the heat shrink off of the heat shrink wasnt even shrunk down all the way onto the wire just like the last picture of the wire going int the fuse block. This method of splicing a junction is not the way Delphi recommends that it be done.
Before I took apart some connectors to see the crimping methods used, I looked at the tape used on the harness and at the wire to each connector. I found that standard electrical tape was used and had already become partially gooey. Then I found that the mass air wiring had several splices in it where they apparently ran out of wire.
Then I took apart the GT 150 connector that was for the fuse block on the engine harness side. And I found that the terminals had been crimped with some sort of hand tool other than a crimp tool. The result was a VERY poor "crimp" and bent terminals. These two things were the cause of the problems with the harness. I also noted that the metripack 150 crimps were done with a repair tool that is supposed to be soldered with the crimp. It is also notable that a unsealed crimper was used by the shape of the seal crimp, which tore the seals. You can also note that the core crimp is incorrect also, for reference I have added pictures of production crimps. (had to use my cell phone)
Wrong GT 150 Crimps
Production GT 150 Crimps- Notice the straightness and the indention on the back of the terminal.
Wrong Metripack 150 Crimps- Notice the poor crimp depth and the unsealed seal crimp. There is also supposed to be core visible on both sides of the crimp wings for proper wire depth.
Production Crimp. Perfect crimp depth, core depth, and seal crimp.
In closing, I would like reiterate that I will not disclose the manufacturer of this harness. I just wanted to bring some things to light for you guys, especially the improper crimps, primary wire, non-adhesive heat shrink, and used connectors, all of which WILL lead to issues.
Happy Hotrodding!
Bill
I will not disclose the producer of this harness, not trying to call any certain company out. Just trying to show you guys that you should choose wisely when purchasing a harness. From what I was told this harness wasn't even priced dirt cheap, this company lists their harness for over $500!
Here are the issues I found when looking at the exterior of the harness. The first thing I looked at was the fuse block, and I noticed that the fuses were used, and that the relays were also used and had been painted black to cover up that they were used. The PCM Connectors were also used. Pics Below
Then I started looking at the connectors, to see if they were used or what have you. I found a couple connectors that did not have the Terminal Position Assurance Locks. (TPA). One of those connectors did not even have a seal in it AND it had two wire crimped into one terminal in a connector meant for a one wire sealed termination. Pics Below.
Then I started looking at the wire used to assemble the harness. There were several issues with the wire in this harness. Number one being that there are a lot of primary wire used in the harness, which should never be used in an engine harness. Then when I looked at the wire sizing I noticed that 90% of the harness was made out of 22ga wire. I noticed the coil harness connectors and many other items that should have 20 and 18ga wire had the 22ga wire. After looking at wire sizing I wanted to look at the color codes used. GM color coding was not used in this harness, and on some of the wires I found that a permanent marker was used to attempt to add a tracer to the wire. PICS Below.
Then before stripping off the wire loom, I took a look at what loom was used. It was VERY, VERY thin parts store loom. See Pic.
With the first piece of loom off I found a couple splices, which were "covered" in non-adhesive lined thin wall heat shrink. One of the splices wasnt even completely covered with the heat shrink, and on the large ground splice that I took the heat shrink off of the heat shrink wasnt even shrunk down all the way onto the wire just like the last picture of the wire going int the fuse block. This method of splicing a junction is not the way Delphi recommends that it be done.
Before I took apart some connectors to see the crimping methods used, I looked at the tape used on the harness and at the wire to each connector. I found that standard electrical tape was used and had already become partially gooey. Then I found that the mass air wiring had several splices in it where they apparently ran out of wire.
Then I took apart the GT 150 connector that was for the fuse block on the engine harness side. And I found that the terminals had been crimped with some sort of hand tool other than a crimp tool. The result was a VERY poor "crimp" and bent terminals. These two things were the cause of the problems with the harness. I also noted that the metripack 150 crimps were done with a repair tool that is supposed to be soldered with the crimp. It is also notable that a unsealed crimper was used by the shape of the seal crimp, which tore the seals. You can also note that the core crimp is incorrect also, for reference I have added pictures of production crimps. (had to use my cell phone)
Wrong GT 150 Crimps
Production GT 150 Crimps- Notice the straightness and the indention on the back of the terminal.
Wrong Metripack 150 Crimps- Notice the poor crimp depth and the unsealed seal crimp. There is also supposed to be core visible on both sides of the crimp wings for proper wire depth.
Production Crimp. Perfect crimp depth, core depth, and seal crimp.
In closing, I would like reiterate that I will not disclose the manufacturer of this harness. I just wanted to bring some things to light for you guys, especially the improper crimps, primary wire, non-adhesive heat shrink, and used connectors, all of which WILL lead to issues.
Happy Hotrodding!
Bill
__________________
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www.bp-automotive.com
1-888-467-4491
Standalone LS Swap Harnesses IN STOCK!
LSX, LTX Stand alone swap harnesses. S10 LSX conversion PLUG AND PLAY harnesses, 24x conversion PLUG AND PLAY harnesses. LT1 to LSX PLUG AND PLAY Harnesses.
sales@bp-automotive.com
www.bp-automotive.com
1-888-467-4491
03-15-2013, 11:57 PM
#4
It was not one of the three main sponsors see recommended in this forum. This company is not a sponsor here.
Of the three sponsors you see in here you will not find work like this. You should look into all three of us and then make a decision, and dont let price dictate your choice.
Of the three sponsors you see in here you will not find work like this. You should look into all three of us and then make a decision, and dont let price dictate your choice.
03-16-2013, 12:18 AM
#6
Enlightening.
Not condoning the work, just asking for clarification here... From what I believe I saw in your post. This harness was sold to a customer as "an all new work" i.e. new connectors, wire, relays, fuse panel, etc.? What I'm trying to distinguish for our viewers is the above piece was not supposed to be a reworked harness in any way, correct?
I've seen and used new harnesses and they are like fine art. I took pictures as I took them out of their boxes.
Not condoning the work, just asking for clarification here... From what I believe I saw in your post. This harness was sold to a customer as "an all new work" i.e. new connectors, wire, relays, fuse panel, etc.? What I'm trying to distinguish for our viewers is the above piece was not supposed to be a reworked harness in any way, correct?
I've seen and used new harnesses and they are like fine art. I took pictures as I took them out of their boxes.
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03-16-2013, 12:30 AM
#8
I believe you are correct.
I was looking at your website and I see you rewire harnesses a well,. I do happen to have my harness from the car I sold so...this might be a better option, cheaper and knowing is done correctly and I like all the options you offer.
I was looking at your website and I see you rewire harnesses a well,. I do happen to have my harness from the car I sold so...this might be a better option, cheaper and knowing is done correctly and I like all the options you offer.
03-16-2013, 12:34 AM
#9
Enlightening.
Not condoning the work, just asking for clarification here... From what I believe I saw in your post. This harness was sold to a customer as "an all new work" i.e. new connectors, wire, relays, fuse panel, etc.? What I'm trying to distinguish for our viewers is the above piece was not supposed to be a reworked harness in any way, correct?
I've seen and used new harnesses and they are like fine art. I took pictures as I took them out of their boxes.
Not condoning the work, just asking for clarification here... From what I believe I saw in your post. This harness was sold to a customer as "an all new work" i.e. new connectors, wire, relays, fuse panel, etc.? What I'm trying to distinguish for our viewers is the above piece was not supposed to be a reworked harness in any way, correct?
I've seen and used new harnesses and they are like fine art. I took pictures as I took them out of their boxes.
03-16-2013, 12:53 AM
#10
This harness was supposed to be 100% new. All of the wire is new. Granted its mostly the wrong gauge and some of it is primary wire. My guess is they reused the pcm connectors because if you purchase them in low quantities they are expensive and if you purchase a box it can really get into your pocket.
03-16-2013, 01:24 AM
#12
This is my harness... Im embarassed to say I wasted my money on this rats nest of used connectors and bad splices. Stay away from ssp wiring or sand and street performance whatever they call themselves this week. Their harness is junk as you can see. They don't answer the phone and when they do you get a lady with no idea how to diagnose your issue. My car has been down longer than it has been running due to bank 1 losing power. Don't make the same mistake I made. Buy a quality harness and save yourself the time and money from dealing with bootleg harness makers. If anyone has any questions feel free to pm me
03-16-2013, 06:03 AM
#14
I have a 88 mustang coupe with a 6.0/T70 I had the harness on my 91 4.8 coupe first and after about a week the electrical gremlins showed up. I thought it was maybe 1 loose wire but Bill was kind enough to take the time to disect and find why my car would lose bank 1.
Another issue with SSP. The instruction color codes dont match the colors on the wires in the harness. They "forgot" my obd2 port that comes standard with every harness. I also paid to have labels on all connections and i think 2 or 3 were tagged.
Another issue with SSP. The instruction color codes dont match the colors on the wires in the harness. They "forgot" my obd2 port that comes standard with every harness. I also paid to have labels on all connections and i think 2 or 3 were tagged.
Last edited by 1bad03snake; 03-16-2013 at 09:04 AM.
03-16-2013, 10:50 PM
#17
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This is my harness... Im embarassed to say I wasted my money on this rats nest of used connectors and bad splices. Stay away from ssp wiring or sand and street performance whatever they call themselves this week. Their harness is junk as you can see. They don't answer the phone and when they do you get a lady with no idea how to diagnose your issue. My car has been down longer than it has been running due to bank 1 losing power. Don't make the same mistake I made. Buy a quality harness and save yourself the time and money from dealing with bootleg harness makers. If anyone has any questions feel free to pm me
03-18-2013, 06:59 AM
#18
Nice to see that you did post who did the harness for you. One of my co-workers just bought a 62 Impala and is starting to shop around for parts. I told him who I used for my car, and he doesn't want to copy me ( kind of weird but what ever). So he was debating about where to get one from.
Tell him not to even consider a SSP harness. Wire loom makes things look nice, but hides shitty work.
03-18-2013, 02:17 PM
#19
this is exactly what im having problems with. Dropping spark to drivers side bank randomly.. SSP harness just like the one described. He also put the wires in backwards on my trans connector.