Go Back   LS1TECH > LS1-LS2-LS3-LS6-LS7 PERFORMANCE > Conversions & Hybrids
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?
Search

Conversions & Hybrids
LSX Engines in Non-LSX Vehicles
Sponsored by
Don Hardy Race Cars

Welcome to LS1Tech.com!
Welcome to LS1Tech.com.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join LS1Tech.com today!


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-20-2008, 04:40 PM   #1
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default My LS1 Miata build

So I decided I was tired of the Flyin' Miata FM2 kit on my miata after about 6 months of ownership and wanted to do a LS1 swap. I don't have the tools at home to do any real fabrication nor the time really. I am a full-time Mechanical Engineering student at Georgia Tech so I opted for Racing Concept's kit which includes everything needed for mounting a LSx and Ford 8.8 diff as well as a custom driveshaft, axles and a few bits here and there to get things like the clutch to work.

I use a 2002 Camaro LS1 and T56 complete with all accessories, wiring and PCM. I got the PCM flashed with a C5 Z06 tune. I use a Ford 8.8 diff with 3.73 gears.

I tore my car apt in October 2007, brought it to the paint shop, ordered the kit, got the car back from paint in the beginning of Feb 2008 (only 3 months behind...) and started the install.

I have made a detailed website with tons of pictures and info so check it out and feel free to tell me what to add. I am not done with the car yet but I update the site with every progress on the car (which only happens on weekends).

My Website: http://home.comcast.net/~npartist/


Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 04:43 PM   #2
rao
TECH Resident
Garage is empty, add now
 
rao's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 15
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Naperville, IL
Posts: 948
Default

Nice! I have thought about putting one of those together.

I'd like some more details about ground clearance. Is it on the road yet?
__________________
Rob

Current - 1998 BMW 540i LS2 Stroker/T56 Build Thread
Old - 1992 BMW 325i LS2 Stroker/T56
Older - 1995 BMW M3 LS2 Stroker/T56

Last edited by rao; 02-20-2008 at 04:48 PM..
rao is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 05:56 PM   #3
TECH Junkie
Garage is empty, add now
 
LS1-450's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 31
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: End special interest campaign funding
Posts: 3,362
Default

Hi, Welcome to LS1Tech

Are you the guy over on M.net asking about what rear end gear to use in a t-56? I have a lot of experience w/an LSX engine in a Miata. Feel free to ask any questions you like. There are others here as well. Be sure & put a Detroit "True-Trac" differential in that 8.8, it will make a night & day difference in traction. I don't know the "Racing Concepts" kit very well, but be sure & pay close attention to sub-frame re-enforcement, use front & rear anti-sway bars, & front & rear strut tower braces. Big front brakes are a must. Good-luck
__________________
LSX MUNSTER (99-NB-MX5)... 5.3L, L33 w/ LS6 cam, T56, Ford 8.8/3.90 rear; etc. In terms of aggravation, Carb>PCM
**Noteworthy People**... Mr. Hutter (Ron), Hutter racing engines...Tony Mamo (AFR)... Patrick G... PREDATOR-Z

Why'd the Mustang cross the road?

...Thanks LS1Tech; the best tech site on the Planet...
LS1-450 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 07:29 PM   #4
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

I'm npartist on m.net. I'm not the one asking about the diff but I have replied in that thread. When you say sub-frame re-enforcement I assume you are talking about the rear sub-frame. The front one is all new. I don't plan on running a rear sway as I always preferred the handling/corner exit without it when I had the turbo setup before. Whats your reasoning for keeping the rear sway? The kit includes frame rail braces and I have a 6-point roll bar and front strut tower brace so I should be ok on stiffness.

I have seen your post on m.net and am curious about the C4 brakes. I read that you machined the rotors, correct? Care to fill me in on what is required to do the swap? I plan on getting a True-Trac sometime, right now I am focused on getting the car driving. Thanks for the help.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 08:24 PM   #5
TECH Junkie
Garage is empty, add now
 
LS1-450's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 31
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: End special interest campaign funding
Posts: 3,362
Default

I mean frame rail braces, rear anti-sway, strut tower bracing help against twisting from the torque of the motor. I have a Hard Dog & have never heard of a 6 point. It does bolt in 6 places, but, is considered a 4 point. Unless, there is a new one that I haven't heard of. Usually, 6 point roll bars (cage) includes to locations on the driver & passenger side floors (door hinge pilars) w/ diagonal bracing between the seat & the door, in addition to the standard places. Anyway, it's not important, I just am curious to know if there is now available a 6 point bar.

My point regarding bracing is that a lot of people whom put big torque in little cars can't use all of the power because the body of the car twists from the torque. It's really important to build the suspension & support the unibody first & build from there. Also, later when you add pan hard bars to reduce the wheel hop, the strut & rear anti-sway will re-enforce the area. You can get the rear corner to sit by adjusting the shocks.

To put C4 brakes in a Miata is a pain in the ASS. There are 6 new parts that you need to make (machine) in order to do it. I would recommend using an after market kit for the fronts, 12" rotors either 4 or 6 piston calipers are OK. It's alright to keep the stock Miata rears. I've got my rear brakes dampened so much through a proportional valve, that stockers would have been fine.
__________________
LSX MUNSTER (99-NB-MX5)... 5.3L, L33 w/ LS6 cam, T56, Ford 8.8/3.90 rear; etc. In terms of aggravation, Carb>PCM
**Noteworthy People**... Mr. Hutter (Ron), Hutter racing engines...Tony Mamo (AFR)... Patrick G... PREDATOR-Z

Why'd the Mustang cross the road?

...Thanks LS1Tech; the best tech site on the Planet...
LS1-450 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 08:45 PM   #6
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Its a custom roll bar deal. I wanted as much stiffness/protect I could get without having a bar along the side of my head due to a lot of non-helmeted street driving. Its the rear half of Hard Dog's cage increased to 1.75x.120 with the door bars. See the pictures (they are also on my website).

EDIT: I consider mine a 6-point roll bar which is different from a 6-point cage. But I agree its not worth arguing over. I don't care either way, below is what I have...haha.

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon

Last edited by ls1_miata; 02-20-2008 at 09:00 PM..
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 08:56 PM   #7
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 1
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Default

Why the PCM flash, are you changing the heads and cam?
trexbob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 08:59 PM   #8
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by trexbob View Post
Why the PCM flash, are you changing the heads and cam?
I've been told it runs a little more timing and gains a little for a stock ls1. It was free. I will probably swap cams out in the future but not any time soon.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-20-2008, 11:40 PM   #9
Registered User
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 29
Default

Very nice car, hows traction?
JoePZ28 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 12:04 AM   #10
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoePZ28 View Post
Very nice car, hows traction?
EXCELLENT but thats because the car only moves when I push it...haha. Its not running yet. I hope to get the engine fired up for the first time this weekend but thats dependent on me getting it back from the exhaust shop on time which probably isn't going to happen.

Realistically, I am going to have traction issues with anything but drag radials in the first two gears on the street. But its nothing a little feathering can't fix. I could do fender flares and put some big tires on the back but I'm not going to. I've driven a ls1 miata with 205 width bfg drag radials on the street and it hooked up fine, if you didn't drop the clutch you could floor it in first gear.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 05:47 AM   #11
TECH Junkie
Garage is empty, add now
 
LS1-450's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 31
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: End special interest campaign funding
Posts: 3,362
Default

Yah, that's a 6 point alright;......first one I've seen. That's a nice set-up & looks easy to get in & out of.

More about the sub-frame bracing. There is no torque arm. Therefore, the body is the torque arm. Agreed, that the 6 point will help, along w/ the rail supports...etc..
__________________
LSX MUNSTER (99-NB-MX5)... 5.3L, L33 w/ LS6 cam, T56, Ford 8.8/3.90 rear; etc. In terms of aggravation, Carb>PCM
**Noteworthy People**... Mr. Hutter (Ron), Hutter racing engines...Tony Mamo (AFR)... Patrick G... PREDATOR-Z

Why'd the Mustang cross the road?

...Thanks LS1Tech; the best tech site on the Planet...
LS1-450 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 06:36 AM   #12
TECH Addict
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 2,668
Default

looks a great setup!

like the cage to! i have seen it used in mid engined conversions (one for an old mini) and thats what they do! is the chasis much stiff once these mods have been done?? is there anything else you could do (seam weld the shell)??

Chris.
chuntington101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 07:01 AM   #13
TECH Junkie
Garage is empty, add now
 
LS1-450's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 31
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: End special interest campaign funding
Posts: 3,362
Default

Here's what I mean about the C4 brakes. It's all the info. I have. You can see how an after market set-up will be much easier. Either way, it's better to go w/ a GM master brake cylinder as opposed to the stock Miata master, once the fronts are upgraded.


I went to your web page; nice work. Let me know if you need info. for the hydraulic clutch line & master when you get to it. Am not sure if your kit includes the parts needed & the stock GM to throw out bearing fitting can easily be modified & used.
Attached Thumbnails
My LS1 Miata build-c4-brakes-016.jpg   My LS1 Miata build-c4-brakes-015.jpg   My LS1 Miata build-c4-brakes-014.jpg   My LS1 Miata build-c4-brakes-013.jpg  
Attached Files
File Type: doc C4 brakes-a.doc (24.0 KB, 219 views)
__________________
LSX MUNSTER (99-NB-MX5)... 5.3L, L33 w/ LS6 cam, T56, Ford 8.8/3.90 rear; etc. In terms of aggravation, Carb>PCM
**Noteworthy People**... Mr. Hutter (Ron), Hutter racing engines...Tony Mamo (AFR)... Patrick G... PREDATOR-Z

Why'd the Mustang cross the road?

...Thanks LS1Tech; the best tech site on the Planet...
LS1-450 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 10:37 AM   #14
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

LS1-450, thanks for the info. It does appear its easier and maybe even cheaper (if one doesn't have access to machining equipment) to go with an aftermarket set of front brakes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chuntington101 View Post
looks a great setup!

like the cage to! i have seen it used in mid engined conversions (one for an old mini) and thats what they do! is the chasis much stiff once these mods have been done?? is there anything else you could do (seam weld the shell)??

Chris.
Yes, I was able to notice a significant difference in torsional stiffness with the 6-point roll bar vs the old 4-point one I had before. The Miata is known to be a wet noddle so pretty much anything helps. Seam welding, underbody braces, etc. Since I am not racing for money, I'm not going to go through the trouble of seam welding my car. I am seam welding my car club's v8 miata though. But its also gutted and has nothing but the dash skin and a seat. I think the gains from seam welding are small relative to the stiffening methods I already have on my car so that extra bit isn't worth the trouble.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 10:59 AM   #15
Doc
FormerVendor
Garage is empty, add now
 
Doc's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 9
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Jacksonville, Fl
Posts: 1,575
Cool

Hi. Nice setup. I am the official tuner for RC. Dan and Richard pushed their bone stock LS1 powered Miata to 11.5 @ 120mph last saturday at Gainesville raceway. I can setup the tune in your Miata to run with the big dawgs.

Doc
Doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 11:46 AM   #16
Launching!
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Buford, GA
Posts: 226
Send a message via AIM to icantdrift
Default

cool project, i'd be very interested to see it up close whenever it's done. i've toyed with the idea of building a 2nd LS1 hybrid using a different chassis and having owned a turbo miata naturally that came to mind.
icantdrift is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-21-2008, 03:20 PM   #17
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by icantdrift View Post
cool project, i'd be very interested to see it up close whenever it's done. i've toyed with the idea of building a 2nd LS1 hybrid using a different chassis and having owned a turbo miata naturally that came to mind.
I should be the Annual Georgia Tech Autoshow with the car for sure. Its March 29th at GT in downtown Atlanta. There are always a bunch of sweet cars at it. The public is welcome to view and anyone in the GT community can register their car.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-22-2008, 09:22 PM   #18
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Ok, exhaust is done! Buster did a great job and got it done in less than a week. Here are a few pics, more are on my site. Ground clearance is minimal right now but I am going to raise the car back to the stock height to gain an inch or so.

Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-24-2008, 05:51 PM   #19
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

Well I was hoping my old Flyin Miata AL race radiator that I had on my car for the turbo setup would work for the ls1 swap. It won't... I haven't uploaded pictures from my camera yet but will later tonight to my site. I knew it was going to be close and that the inlet/outlet location (same as stock miata rad) is not ideal for the ls1 since the ls1 has both on the passenger side of the engine. The radiator will physically fit in the stock location if I cut off one of the lower fan bungs. But even then the radiator has about 1/4 inch clearance so its tight. And of course that requires pusher fans which I want to avoid if possible.

I am either going with a Ron Davis radiator that Racing Concepts has had made for their car or going with a complete custom one from a local fabricator. I am going to check on prices tomorrow and then decide.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2008, 12:24 AM   #20
Staging Lane
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Farmington Hills, MI
Posts: 90
Default

My old radiator won't work, have to get a new custom double pass one so both inlet and outlet are on the passenger side. I am also going to move it forward so I can put puller fans.

pictures of old radiator not fitting are on my website now.

Click the image to open in full size.
__________________
Sold: 1991 Mazda Miata with 328whp/355wtq LS1/T56, Ford 8.8 3.55 diff, Ohlins coilovers, Hard Dog 6-point roll bar. Drivetrain mounted with racingconcepts.net kit.
Build-up website: www.swaptastic.net
Other cars: 2011 Grand Sport, 2002 Subaru STi wagon
ls1_miata is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2008, 12:24 AM
LS1Tech
Pontiac Firebird




Paid Advertisement
Reply

Tags
ground, heavy, install, kit, ls1, ls1miata, mazda, member, miata, modified, seam, stiffening, swap, weight, welding


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Yellow Submarine goes Nuclear - LS2/T56 Miata Wallyman Conversions & Hybrids 413 04-24-2014 08:07 PM
LS3 Miata swap in progress..... JeremyF Conversions & Hybrids 30 02-20-2014 08:49 PM
New Exhaust: How Much of a Power Gain? ***Results are In*** MX6.0 Generation IV External Engine 6 12-20-2013 04:32 PM
Anouther LS1 Miata build Azar_Hawke Conversions & Hybrids 1 03-05-2013 07:20 PM
Miata differential upgrade options for LS1.. EspaceF1Fan Conversions & Hybrids 27 10-06-2012 02:51 PM



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Service - Privacy Statement - JOBS
Emails & Contact Details