Magnus

iTrader: (4)

What kind of tires you guys on, those of you with light weight cars.

Right now, cam only NA I cut 1.31's with 28x10.5x15's WHEN the car hooks up which is like 1 out of 10 passes.. (i don't race on world class prepped tracks so I am not building my car to hook on a track that is VHT's every other pass so I don't need to hear that a 28x10.5 is enough tire.. cause its not)....

I'm wondering if a 28x10.5W will be enough tire to hook a few hundered more HP with wheelie bars.

I'm not trying to be "cool" on a true 10" tire.. I just want the car to hook consistantly every pass.

I am man enough to run the tire required, but I'm not sure how crazy I must go.

I would prefer to avoid doing a full out tub in the car if I don't need too.

I'm thinking the car will go low 9's at 155 or so.. just a guestimate.

What do you guys think?

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Magnus,

Judson Massengill runs 9.17-9.30 on 29.5x10.5 ET Drags.

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

What HP, raceweight and 60's?

LTLHOMER

iTrader: (10)

OSCA T/S guys cut mid 1.2's and low 1.3's on 30x12.5 et streets with stock suspension and no wheelie bars.

It would be quite the site to see a 9 second car with all that when guys are going much quicker without those aids.

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

How much HP and weight are they at?

What's going to put me to my goal is a very light weight car, moderate amount of HP and perfect traction.

I am not relying on excessive HP to roll my car to my ET. I'm going to need to achieve it in the 60'.

Expanding on what I stated earlier, with 28x10.5x15 ET Drags and an amazingly light car I have trouble consistantly hooking low 1.3 60's.. and this is only running 10.2@128 at a very low HP level..

LTLHOMER

iTrader: (10)

2900-3500 lbs. Torque arm cars usually come in around 3000-3200.

Maybe someone can explain how less weight (let's say 2-500 lbs) can make it harder to hook. My understanding would be that while you don't have as big a force down, that would balance the less force that you need to propel forward. I would think mass would essentially cancel out of the equation. Obviously where the weight is makes a difference (distribution front to back and etc), but not just the weight itself. Any thoughts?

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

Well, I'm sure thats a very important part of the picture. Currently most of my vehicles weight is just engine and transmission.. all toward the front of the car..

What I do know though is that with my low power setup currently and the tracks I race at, 28x10.5x15 ET drag is not enough tire no matter how many outlaw cars run them into the 8's.. For my car, and the track preps I work with, its not enough.. so obviously throw a few more hundered HP into the mix and a harder hitting t-brake launch and I'm gonna need a lot more tire, especially when the car hits the wheelie bars on the ground..

How much tire though, I'm still not sure.

Outlaw

Can you expand apon your set up more? What suspension, gears, tranny, etc etc?

We have guys on 275/60/15 Drag Radials going 1.2's in the 8.4-8.6 range at 3200-3400#s with stock suspension in the PSCA. Rick Head went 7.6@186 on a 315 Drag Radial and stock suspension (3rd gen) so I think it would be more helpful to hear what you have setup wise and also I saw right now you are running N/A. First thing that tells me is you are leaving at 5000+ RPM off the line? Somthing you will not have to do if you plan on adding a power adder of some sort.

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

Those cars you mention probably race at tracks with great prep. I'm trying to build my car to hook on any track that doesn't have NHRA event style prep.

My current setup:
Raceweight: 2850lbs
28x10.5x15 ET Drags in back
4.10 gear
QA1's in back, usually have them at 5
QA1 R's in front, have them at 1
Spohn anti-sway/drag bar.
8pt roll bar
Alston adjustable torque arm (pinion angle at -.05)

NA Cam only LS1
TH350 w/brake
ATI 8" 5500 RPM Coverter. I leave off the brake at 5200 rpm.

413rwhp.

With this setup, launching off of the brake, I do not hook consistantly when the track is average prep. _IF_ the track is great prep, yes.. I do hook very well all the time.


My new setup, the only changes I will have is:
10pt cage
LS2, probably solid roller, perhaps 427...
rwhp will be around 600 perhaps..
More tire..
Less gear

If I can launch off of the brake, i'd like too.. I really have the most fun racing from the 60'.. so the better 60' I can cut, the happier I will be with my racing experience.

Camaro_Zach

iTrader: (19)

keith, youre never give this up, so just splurge the $300 and find out if it helps. everytime somone says no, this isnt the first thread regarding this. everyone always says you dont need a tire the size of your house. but you insist you do....so get it! try it! you might be right! no one has the exact setup you have in the world. so get a bajesus sized tire, and if it slows you down, which it will, put the smaller one back on and dial in the suspension!

oh, and less gear? i have 4.11's and i plan on haulin some serious ***, and i see no need to go down to a 3.23 (an example) just to make it to the end of the 1/4, also if you LOWER gear and get a LARGER tire, youre REALLY killin youreslf. but again do it up, post results.

Outlaw

Not all tracks are the best preped tracks in the world. I dont see ANY reason with a few changes in parts, your car should not be able to handle the power you want to go to.

Here is what it comes down too... are you just trying to make this work on the size tire you are on? You seem to want to go to the bigger tire, so do it if you think that going to a bigger tire will solve it all. But when it comes down to it, really, and no offence, but 400 rwhp aint much and if you cant hook that on a 28x10.5 slick, you have a problem some where else.

Have you ever scaled your car to see what the weights are corner to corner and front to rear bias?

Real simple fix would be lowering your launch RPM till it dead hooks, get a base line 60 ft where it hooks EVERYTIME. Then creep up on the car, making small changes and as the car hooks at the lower RPM and you see your 60'ft baseline become better, increase your launch RPM. When the car becomes non consistent or your 60fts slow. Start making small changes to the car, shocks, tire pressure, etc. You did not say what tire pressure you run your tires at, but I would check it right before your pass and then after you get off the track, check it again to see what it went up too. Maybe you need to start lower or higher. Have you ever had someone video tape the rear of the car from the side to watch what the car is doing and what the car is doing to the tires? maybe its crushing the tire and bouncing the car off the rims. or not crushing the tires at all. So many factors could cause a problem that its next to impossiable to say this or that will fix your problem without knowing everything.

One thing you must keep in mind is you have to do the same thing everytime you go to make a pass.. you have to be consistent in what YOU as the driver do. Same RPM burnouts for the same amount of time, etc. you cant go out one pass and do a small burnout and the next one John Force and try and compare what the car does on the line.

NHRAFORMULA00

iTrader: (2)

Kieth- Outlaw is dead on with his advice.My friends 8.70 renagade car goes high 1.20s when it hooks,low 1.30 when it doesnt on the same size tire.When we set the front shocks too stiff 8-10 the car wants too wheelie for about 300ft, no bars allowed in the class.6-7 and it slips the tires a little.too get your combo to go low 1.20 on a track like 41 ,you would need 30 tall tires, the right gear, youll get more hook , but the top end is gonna suffer! i would go too the next NHRA event and try too disect the AFIA cars like AL Cordas.

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

Outlaw, yes I know I can launch at a lower RPM to help the car hook better.. I can also foot brake it... but I have a trans brake and I like using it.. I want to continue to use it.

I have not put the car on a 4 corner scale.

There are plenty of witnesses that can atest to my suspension setup, the track I race at and my tire.. It simply is not enough to hook my car consistantly off the brake WOT. When I spin, I don't spin for 10 feet.. I'll just get a few revolutions of spin but its enough to nock my 60' down about .05 and my ET with it.

Zach, I'll need to change my car for my trap.. If I trap 155, i'll have run out of gear about 20 mph ago with the current setup.

I know the top end is gonna suffer, and I'm ok with that. I really love the 60'. I have the best time launching the car.

I want to avoid the common feeling I have now.. When I drive to the track I'm always wondering, am I gonna hook, am I gonna hook...

GueSS Who

The W tire will fix that problem. If you are spinning just some of the time the W tire will definitely take car of it. I went 1.27 on a 28inW tire. With the W tire you will probably even be able to set your rear alittle tighter. The W tires are a night and day difference.


Like the above people are saying though. If you cant hook up 400rwhp then 600 is going to be near impossible. My car makes right at 700 to the wheels and it was a chore to find out how the suspension worked and how to make it hook up leaving on the bottle.

Last Thunder shootout
9.23@150 with a 1.27 60ft weighing in at 3480lbs. I took the 200lbs out of the car for the KingoftheCainField race and this is what happened. Wieght plays very hard on your setup. Can be good and can be bad.
www.lifeinwidescreen.com/nbm.avi

Magnus

iTrader: (4)

Yea, thats my fear.. I have a hard time hooking my current tire consistantly, what am I going to do with a lot more HP?

Definately sounds like W tire is the way to go.

I think the fact that my car is so light over the rear is a big part of my problem.

I want to be able to take my car to any track and be able to hook it well.. I want to relax and enjoy the car instead of having to dial things in due to changing weather and VHT thickness..

Thanks!

Loudmouth LS1

iTrader: (10)

Hey magnus, I saw you said you have the transbrake and like to use it, so why don't you pick up a two step so when the track conditions start to go to **** a bit you can lower ur launch point off the brake, it might help a bit.

The Juggernaut

iTrader: (7)

Keith-

For the 10th time- screw the tires to the rims and drop the PSI 10.5 and you
will dead hook that 28x10.5 tire everytime.

But for your next set up, would suggest a little more tire.29-30" x10.5.

Outlaw

Magnus,
I read what you want and here is my take, you want to eat your cake and have it put in your mouth by a swimsuit model. I will put on my fortune-telling hat and look into the future. You will put the W's on, it will fix your problem with your 400hp and when that 600 or so is put into your ride, you will be right where you are now if not worse off.
Loudmouth and 01-Z both have things you should also already have, but I guess you don’t., If you use a transbreak on slicks, you screw your slicks and rims. This is not for fun, it’s a safety thing.
From the tone of others on here responding to your posts, you don’t heed others advice, so ill quit wasting my time. All I have left to offer you at this point is good luck...

Loudmouth LS1

iTrader: (10)

**** I assumed he already had the slicks screwed to the rims, mine have been done since day one! Damn, i'm sure with the kind of 60's he's cuttin he's gotta be spinnin the tires on the rim without 'em screwed!

Ben R

Consistant 1.28 60', best of 1.24 60'

Car made 900 on motor and we were spraying 300 off a transbrake. It was a ladder-bar Mustang with a 28x10.5. No 'W'. Car weighed 3,100.