T76 feeding a TVS1900 blower
03-14-2009, 10:27 AM
#1
T76 feeding a TVS1900 blower Well, Here is the deal. Some of you know I've been wanting to do the twin/compound boost thing for quite a while, so I've just finally decided to do it 
Was gonna just use a MP 112 since they are easy to pick up pretty cheep now days, but decided to see just what kinda deal I could get on the new TVS's. Brian at Magnacharger just made me to good of a deal to pass up on, so I went ahead and got the TVS 1900.
So here is a few mock-up picks of how its gonna work.
Would like to have it blow strait into the blower, but there is just not enough room for that to happen and have couplers, a blow off valve and the meth injector needing to fit between them.
Got a few things to do before I can install it on the truck, like build an adapter plate for the 78mm TB, since I don't really want to shell out another $350-400 for a cable 90mm TB and I don't think it would gain me anything since it is already having to suck through 3" tubing and a turbo till boost from the turbo hits it. Also have to build throttle cable brackets since the TVS1900 has no provisions for a cable TB yet. And I have to get this installed since I'm still running the stock 4l60e that 1slow01Z71 loaned me when I broke my built 60e in TX a couple weeks ago.
It's a KBracing level 1000 4l80e with an EDGE Racing 3000 converter. I hope it holds all the torque of this monster,
It's going on my truck which is already turbocharged with a MP T-76 turbo and a forged and studded 346 LS1 short block and 317 6L heads. About 9.25 to 1 comp.
My goal is not peak power out if this setup, but more "usable" power. Gonna run about 15-18 psi of boost and looking for some thing in the 700's for rwhp, but a torque graph that looks like a dinner table, lol. Should put my 5200lbs 4x4 truck into the mid 11's nicely
Was gonna just use a MP 112 since they are easy to pick up pretty cheep now days, but decided to see just what kinda deal I could get on the new TVS's. Brian at Magnacharger just made me to good of a deal to pass up on, so I went ahead and got the TVS 1900. So here is a few mock-up picks of how its gonna work.Would like to have it blow strait into the blower, but there is just not enough room for that to happen and have couplers, a blow off valve and the meth injector needing to fit between them.
Got a few things to do before I can install it on the truck, like build an adapter plate for the 78mm TB, since I don't really want to shell out another $350-400 for a cable 90mm TB and I don't think it would gain me anything since it is already having to suck through 3" tubing and a turbo till boost from the turbo hits it. Also have to build throttle cable brackets since the TVS1900 has no provisions for a cable TB yet. And I have to get this installed since I'm still running the stock 4l60e that 1slow01Z71 loaned me when I broke my built 60e in TX a couple weeks ago.
It's a KBracing level 1000 4l80e with an EDGE Racing 3000 converter. I hope it holds all the torque of this monster,
It's going on my truck which is already turbocharged with a MP T-76 turbo and a forged and studded 346 LS1 short block and 317 6L heads. About 9.25 to 1 comp.
My goal is not peak power out if this setup, but more "usable" power. Gonna run about 15-18 psi of boost and looking for some thing in the 700's for rwhp, but a torque graph that looks like a dinner table, lol. Should put my 5200lbs 4x4 truck into the mid 11's nicely
03-14-2009, 11:07 AM
#3
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I've seen a mustang from Ice performance in Des Moines with a twin turbo on a supercharger before. He had some trouble making it stick though and his buddy in the single turbo stang out ran him..........
Last edited by 94dragbird; 03-14-2009 at 11:38 AM.
03-14-2009, 11:28 AM
#4
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03-14-2009, 11:36 AM
#5
Makes sense. I'm interested to see what kind of results you get. On the other hand what happens if the blower maxes out at say 60 lb/min and the turbo throws 65 lbs/min of air at it?
I guess it's all in the parts chosen and how they're setup to work together. I know the mustang guys do this kind of stuff and get good results, so it definitely can work. I'm sure it's going to be a lot of fun to tune!
I guess it's all in the parts chosen and how they're setup to work together. I know the mustang guys do this kind of stuff and get good results, so it definitely can work. I'm sure it's going to be a lot of fun to tune!
03-14-2009, 12:06 PM
#6
It's like this, say the blower flow 1000 cfm max. That's at NA air pressure, now you feed that blower with 15psi air above NA, you've just doubled what the blower can flow to 2000cfm. Everything flow rated, is done at NA air pressure of about 14.7 psi, double the air intake pressure, double the flow rating. Make since?
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03-14-2009, 01:13 PM
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Last months hot rod had an article on SVT Cobras with a twin turbo kit on them, I cant remember who makes the kit. Power under the curve was pretty ridiculous 
. Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.
So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
. Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
03-14-2009, 01:51 PM
#10
Last months hot rod had an article on SVT Cobras with a twin turbo kit on them, I cant remember who makes the kit. Power under the curve was pretty ridiculous . Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.
So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
. Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
03-14-2009, 02:19 PM
#12
Last months hot rod had an article on SVT Cobras with a twin turbo kit on them, I cant remember who makes the kit. Power under the curve was pretty ridiculous . Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.
So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
. Hot rod did say though with that much power it was borderline scary to drive them on the street with street tires. I was wondering why no one really does this on our LS1's.So what is the reason we dont see this more on our cars? Cost or just a better way of doing it with all turbo or sc?
03-14-2009, 03:17 PM
#13
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It's shouldn't become a restriction, it doesn't know what ambient air pressure is, if its being feed air that is already compressed to 7 psi, it going to compress it another 7-8 psi and spit it out the bottom at about 14-15 psi. That's the theory behind it any way. Lots of talk on here about how a compound boost setup like this would work, but no one that I have seen as ever actual done it and proven what actually happens, until now .
.Im no guru correct me if im wrong.
03-14-2009, 05:12 PM
#14
A positive displacement blower will make the same psi at the given engine rpm depending on the pully size, displacement & ambien pressuret. So if you increase the ambient pressure at the blower your going to be doubling the psi depending on how much the turbo is compressing? Won't that mean really hi AIT's and less density = more cylinder pressure= detonation? This setup seem that it will work better with a alky powered car. Do you think the meth kit is enough?
Im no guru correct me if im wrong.
Im no guru correct me if im wrong.
These new TVS's blower are a much more efficient 4 lobe, high helix blower and have much lower IAT's then the old MP112's.
I think IAT will be in-check just fine with this setup. I can always reattach the current A/A the turbo has now, if needed, but I don't think it will need it. And the less infront of the blower the better.
My whole purpose of this build is to have a nice streetable truck with a high boost potential and no real lag. And cuz it will look cool,
03-14-2009, 05:33 PM
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It's not doing any more compressing that as it would be with out the turbo feeding it. If the inlet air is already 8psi from the turbo, it has already been heated and cooled with the meth, then it is only adding another 8psi to it, not compressing from 0 to 16 so shouldn't create any more heat than it normally would compressing air from 0 to 8 psi.
These new TVS's blower are a much more efficient 4 lobe, high helix blower and have much lower IAT's then the old MP112's.
I think IAT will be in-check just fine with this setup. I can always reattach the current A/A the turbo has now, if needed, but I don't think it will need it. And the less infront of the blower the better.
My whole purpose of this build is to have a nice streetable truck with a high boost potential and no real lag. And cuz it will look cool,
These new TVS's blower are a much more efficient 4 lobe, high helix blower and have much lower IAT's then the old MP112's.
I think IAT will be in-check just fine with this setup. I can always reattach the current A/A the turbo has now, if needed, but I don't think it will need it. And the less infront of the blower the better.
My whole purpose of this build is to have a nice streetable truck with a high boost potential and no real lag. And cuz it will look cool,
Hell yeah it will look cool.
03-14-2009, 06:36 PM
#17
If you were using a twinscrew with their internal compression you might have a winner, but feeding an air mover (TVS or not it is not a compressor) hot air is just going to thrash the air even more without any additional boost and stack up superheated air in the manifold.
If you want to play around, can you figure out how to have the TVS feed the inlet side of the turbo compressor, then send it through a big A2A and on into the motor? The T76 will probably be a bit small for that setup but the idea has a lot more potential.
You are not going to get 'double boost' out of your original idea, and temps are going to be crazy.
Props for trying something different, just needs some more thought.
Jim
If you want to play around, can you figure out how to have the TVS feed the inlet side of the turbo compressor, then send it through a big A2A and on into the motor? The T76 will probably be a bit small for that setup but the idea has a lot more potential.
You are not going to get 'double boost' out of your original idea, and temps are going to be crazy.
Props for trying something different, just needs some more thought.
Jim
03-14-2009, 07:58 PM
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It's not doing any more compressing that as it would be with out the turbo feeding it. If the inlet air is already 8psi from the turbo, it has already been heated and cooled with the meth, then it is only adding another 8psi to it, not compressing from 0 to 16 so shouldn't create any more heat than it normally would compressing air from 0 to 8 psi.
These new TVS's blower are a much more efficient 4 lobe, high helix blower and have much lower IAT's then the old MP112's.
I think IAT will be in-check just fine with this setup. I can always reattach the current A/A the turbo has now, if needed, but I don't think it will need it. And the less infront of the blower the better.
My whole purpose of this build is to have a nice streetable truck with a high boost potential and no real lag. And cuz it will look cool,
These new TVS's blower are a much more efficient 4 lobe, high helix blower and have much lower IAT's then the old MP112's.
I think IAT will be in-check just fine with this setup. I can always reattach the current A/A the turbo has now, if needed, but I don't think it will need it. And the less infront of the blower the better.
My whole purpose of this build is to have a nice streetable truck with a high boost potential and no real lag. And cuz it will look cool,
Saw your other posts and I agree: I haven't done it, the only time I've actually seen it work is on diesel trucks and such (the new ford 6.4s end up at 50psi with a reflash, compound dumdumdum!)
http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...i_exhaust.html
I know its a mustang, but check out the article. Stock pulley on a cobra will do 9-10psi.
Last edited by themachasy; 03-14-2009 at 08:20 PM.
03-14-2009, 08:20 PM
#20
Well, the blower is gonna do it's thing cuz its a fixed displacement air mover and the turbo with the WG will be what determines the total boost. I will be able to keep an eye on what the turbo is actually making boost wise, and how much back pressure there is before the turbo, as I have gauges on order for them.
I'm gona try it with out the A/A first and then if need, I can easily hook it back up.
It's just a fun science experimental 
I'm gona try it with out the A/A first and then if need, I can easily hook it back up.
It's just a fun science experimental