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Old 08-11-2011, 03:47 PM   #1
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Default Vortech vs procharger

How come it seems like a majority of supercharger guys here use procharger over the vortech chargers? is there something i'm missing?


I want to piece my own kit together and build a custom front mount inter cooler and want to look at all options. I have seen a few vortech kits but was curious how they mount since the y-7 ysi chargers don't come in reverse rotation.. Also vortech themselves doesn't show a kit on their website, so i'm assuming someone is making the brackets to fit an f-body?
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Old 08-11-2011, 04:12 PM   #2
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The YSi is an amazing supercharger. the problem was Vortech shot themselves in the foot with there kit when the made it with a 800 CFM supercharger. RMCR has upgrade brackets for those who want a V1 to V-7 Supercharger.

I have seen several builds with over 1000 RWHP with a YSi supercharger.

They also offer a full bracket setup with cog drive. Here are some pics.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 08-11-2011, 05:46 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YSILT1 View Post
The YSi is an amazing supercharger. the problem was Vortech shot themselves in the foot with there kit when the made it with a 800 CFM supercharger. RMCR has upgrade brackets for those who want a V1 to V-7 Supercharger.

I have seen several builds with over 1000 RWHP with a YSi supercharger.

They also offer a full bracket setup with cog drive. Here are some pics.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
im curious to know how you guys got a fast 102 on there?
i mocked up my setup with a t trim and a 102/102 and the manifold hits the blower brackets......
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Old 08-11-2011, 05:55 PM   #4
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That is good to know and it is nice that you can use a cog drive on them. I goggled rmcr and they are 2 hours away from me. Thanks for the info and i will be hitting them up to see what they can do for me.

btw, are you able to close the hood on that thing? looks like it is pretty tall. Heck i already have clearance issues with my slp intake and hood! lol

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Old 08-11-2011, 07:28 PM   #5
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I have noticed the same thing and asked on many forums if anyone has tested both brands on similar engines. Say v7 ysi vs F1 on a similar engine.

To date no person has answered. I know both have there advantages but surely they must be close to each other in performance?

In Aus vortechs were the only option but now procharger are popping up.
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Old 08-11-2011, 11:36 PM   #6
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I'm pretty sure it doesn't fit under a stock fbody hood. Firebirds have more of a chance than camaros though. But I have read about people using k member spacers.
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Old 08-12-2011, 06:41 AM   #7
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KP on here got his old '98 T/A into the 8's in the 1/4 mile with a ProCharger D-1SC on a 347. The ProCharger blowers are well proven to work. Bob
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Old 08-12-2011, 09:56 AM   #8
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Good question and I would ask a few back to you; How much power are you trying to make? Is this a max effort build or street/strip?

Both Procharger and Vortech make great products. Procharger has been the leader in the heads up drag racing world. They have consistently had the quickest and fastest supercharged cars out there and the leader for the last 5years. Recently, Vortech has been making great strides and have a line blowers that are making serious power. These blowers may not be rated as high in CFM as Procharger but appear to be more efficient, ie, they discharge less heat and do not take as much power to turn. With Vortech's latest innovations this will force Procharger to make improvements which I am very excited about.

This really boils down to my question, what type of build is this and what power? Its like choosing between Pepsi and Coke, both have a great brand name and they will both satisfy your taste and needs.

Give me some more info and we can help. I currently run a Procharger F1R in a max effort 412" RHS block, All Pro head motor. You can find my build thread in this section by looking it up under my user name.

Good luck.
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Old 08-12-2011, 10:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
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I'm pretty sure it doesn't fit under a stock fbody hood. Firebirds have more of a chance than camaros though. But I have read about people using k member spacers.
It actually does all fit under the stock WS6 Hood. Only some of the under structure had to be removed.
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:29 AM   #10
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I essentially want to buy a bracket and head unit then assemble the rest of the kit myself. I also don't' want to cut the cross members or stand up the radiator or anything like that. Not that i can't, i just don't want to be cutting up the car. I want a bolt on kit that makes big power. this is just a weekend cruiser i'll take to the track to have some fun.

Was originally thinking a f1a would make a nice kit then started looking at the vortech chargers. Only thing i didn't like about the vortech's was you need to supply them with oil like a turbo. Guess its not that big of a deal.
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:45 AM   #11
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I essentially want to buy a bracket and head unit then assemble the rest of the kit myself. I also don't' want to cut the cross members or stand up the radiator or anything like that. Not that i can't, i just don't want to be cutting up the car. I want a bolt on kit that makes big power. this is just a weekend cruiser i'll take to the track to have some fun.

Was originally thinking a f1a would make a nice kit then started looking at the vortech chargers. Only thing i didn't like about the vortech's was you need to supply them with oil like a turbo. Guess its not that big of a deal.
I can get you a great price on a ProCharger head unit, and I sell most of the piece parts that are required at this link. http://shop.brutespeed.com/98-02-F-Body_c181.htm
For the J Bracket I recommend going with this one. http://shop.brutespeed.com/Aster-Aut...er-Bracket.htm Bob
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Old 08-12-2011, 11:47 AM   #12
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Oh, and if you want to see a copy of the ProCharger installation manual, send me an e-mail to brutespeed@gmail.com and I will e-mail it to you. Bob
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Old 08-12-2011, 12:30 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YSILT1 View Post
The YSi is an amazing supercharger. the problem was Vortech shot themselves in the foot with there kit when the made it with a 800 CFM supercharger. RMCR has upgrade brackets for those who want a V1 to V-7 Supercharger.

I have seen several builds with over 1000 RWHP with a YSi supercharger.

They also offer a full bracket setup with cog drive. Here are some pics.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
Nice set up, didn't know that existed for a F-Body.

Bob, is the 'man' for the Procharger stuff. He has been very helpful over the years.
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Old 08-12-2011, 12:53 PM   #14
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Quote:
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I essentially want to buy a bracket and head unit then assemble the rest of the kit myself. I also don't' want to cut the cross members or stand up the radiator or anything like that. Not that i can't, i just don't want to be cutting up the car. I want a bolt on kit that makes big power. this is just a weekend cruiser i'll take to the track to have some fun.

Was originally thinking a f1a would make a nice kit then started looking at the vortech chargers. Only thing i didn't like about the vortech's was you need to supply them with oil like a turbo. Guess its not that big of a deal.
self contained blowers can not be spun as hard if i remember correctly.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:05 PM   #15
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Quote:
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I essentially want to buy a bracket and head unit then assemble the rest of the kit myself. I also don't' want to cut the cross members or stand up the radiator or anything like that. Not that i can't, i just don't want to be cutting up the car. I want a bolt on kit that makes big power. this is just a weekend cruiser i'll take to the track to have some fun.

Was originally thinking a f1a would make a nice kit then started looking at the vortech chargers. Only thing i didn't like about the vortech's was you need to supply them with oil like a turbo. Guess its not that big of a deal.
There is nothing wrong with an oil supplying unit. I am going with a D1 and it has been proven to make good power with no issues.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericg69ss View Post
Good question and I would ask a few back to you; How much power are you trying to make? Is this a max effort build or street/strip?

Both Procharger and Vortech make great products. Procharger has been the leader in the heads up drag racing world. They have consistently had the quickest and fastest supercharged cars out there and the leader for the last 5years.
Good luck.


Sorry Eric, but i think you are wrong here. In the given realm of where Vortech operates, (f1r and lower) I'd say the Vortech is every bit as competitive. Where Procharger wins is in MARKETING.



If anything, the NMRA Renegade series proves that lb for lb, the YSi dominates when it comes to effeciency. Some contend that the higher cfm on a F1r is better than the slight difference over a YSi, but the YSi's effenciency has proven to have lower IAT's at comprable power levels.


Unfortunately, there is NO ANSWER for a F-2/F3/etc right now, and that's certainly something i'd hang my hat on if i were a procharger guy. I'd contend that anyone that runs a F1 or a high strung D1sc would run faster and cooler IAT's (non-intercooled) with a YSi.
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:50 PM   #17
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One leak and oops! How hot is the supercharger it is breaking down your motors oil. My oil got dirty faster. I have had Paxton too! Procharger had oil feed lines originally. I was done with superchargers. The guys at procharger talked me into one for the boat. It worked great not a problem. Then bought Ta with procharger. It has been great!
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Old 08-12-2011, 01:52 PM   #18
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I essentially want to buy a bracket and head unit then assemble the rest of the kit myself. I also don't' want to cut the cross members or stand up the radiator or anything like that. Not that i can't, i just don't want to be cutting up the car. I want a bolt on kit that makes big power. this is just a weekend cruiser i'll take to the track to have some fun.

Was originally thinking a f1a would make a nice kit then started looking at the vortech chargers. Only thing i didn't like about the vortech's was you need to supply them with oil like a turbo. Guess its not that big of a deal.
If that's what you want, then go Procharger all the way. The engineering has already been done to get it to work without a hitch. Use the Aster bracket that Bob linked to, along with an 8-rib setup and then it's a case of chosing how much blower you want.

Part of the appeal of the Procharger was the fact that so many people have done them from mild to wild, that if you run into troubles, someone probably has already been there, done that.

Guys are making consistently in the high 500 to 600 rwhp with D1's pretty easily and some guys are pushing them to upwards of 800hp. If you plan to go that high, I'm sure one of the F-series blowers would be a better bet.

I built my own kit doing just what you plan to do, buying the necesary peices and adjusting as needed, and I'm glad I did it that way as I enjoy working on my car as much as I do driving it. There were at least 2 dozen threads (with pictures) spelling out exactly what went where and what you needed.
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Old 08-12-2011, 02:10 PM   #19
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Tim:

This is not a right versus wrong debate. I was alluding to the things you have pointed out and while I did not use specific's I can elaborate.

1. In regards to Superchargers, Procharger has dominated the overall heads up drag racing scene for the last 5 years, ie, 275 Drag Radial, True 10.5, ODR, etc... It's not just marketing as the proof is in the pudding. Think Stevie Jackson, Jason Lee, Chris Evans...

2. NMRA Renegade is a great example but not everyone races Non Intercooled. The YSI has shown itself to be extremely efficient and I believe I was alluding to that when talking about Vortech. There is a reason why the YSI dominates the class because of its efficiency and lower IAT's.

3. Vortech is making strides with blowers to compete with the, F1R, F2 and F3's of the world. So far Procharger has dominated in that category but looking at equivalent data the Xi blower is showing itself to be competitive against the F1R. The Z Trim should be capable of competing with the F2. Furthermore, the new V28 123mm blower has been tested on Chris Alston Jr.'s 63 Outlaw 10.5 Nova and went 6.71 @ 212mph. He was running a F3 135 and the only change he made was switching blowers.

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...em.php?gik=553

The blower discharge temps on Chris Jr.'s car were dramatically lower than the F3 135 he was running. I won't say how much because that is our data.

Ultimately, I was trying to point out that both blowers perform well and its a personal choice that really depends on your application. I'm learning with right now with my F1R and I have 2 F2's sitting around I may play with. Also, my 4th Gen Build is going to be using a F3 but we plan on doing some testing of the Vortech as well. It will be interesting to see the side by side results from what I have already learned from others in our camp.

Sorry to hi jack the thread and I wish the OP luck getting the best and most of what he is looking for.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tim99ws6 View Post
Sorry Eric, but i think you are wrong here. In the given realm of where Vortech operates, (f1r and lower) I'd say the Vortech is every bit as competitive. Where Procharger wins is in MARKETING.



If anything, the NMRA Renegade series proves that lb for lb, the YSi dominates when it comes to effeciency. Some contend that the higher cfm on a F1r is better than the slight difference over a YSi, but the YSi's effenciency has proven to have lower IAT's at comprable power levels.


Unfortunately, there is NO ANSWER for a F-2/F3/etc right now, and that's certainly something i'd hang my hat on if i were a procharger guy. I'd contend that anyone that runs a F1 or a high strung D1sc would run faster and cooler IAT's (non-intercooled) with a YSi.
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Old 08-12-2011, 02:46 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ericg69ss View Post
Tim:

This is not a right versus wrong debate. I was alluding to the things you have pointed out and while I did not use specific's I can elaborate.

1. In regards to Superchargers, Procharger has dominated the overall heads up drag racing scene for the last 5 years, ie, 275 Drag Radial, True 10.5, ODR, etc... It's not just marketing as the proof is in the pudding. Think Stevie Jackson, Jason Lee, Chris Evans...

2. NMRA Renegade is a great example but not everyone races Non Intercooled. The YSI has shown itself to be extremely efficient and I believe I was alluding to that when talking about Vortech. There is a reason why the YSI dominates the class because of its efficiency and lower IAT's.

3. Vortech is making strides with blowers to compete with the, F1R, F2 and F3's of the world. So far Procharger has dominated in that category but looking at equivalent data the Xi blower is showing itself to be competitive against the F1R. The Z Trim should be capable of competing with the F2. Furthermore, the new V28 123mm blower has been tested on Chris Alston Jr.'s 63 Outlaw 10.5 Nova and went 6.71 @ 212mph. He was running a F3 135 and the only change he made was switching blowers.

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...em.php?gik=553

The blower discharge temps on Chris Jr.'s car were dramatically lower than the F3 135 he was running. I won't say how much because that is our data.

Ultimately, I was trying to point out that both blowers perform well and its a personal choice that really depends on your application. I'm learning with right now with my F1R and I have 2 F2's sitting around I may play with. Also, my 4th Gen Build is going to be using a F3 but we plan on doing some testing of the Vortech as well. It will be interesting to see the side by side results from what I have already learned from others in our camp.

Sorry to hi jack the thread and I wish the OP luck getting the best and most of what he is looking for.



O no, definitely not a right vs wrong! They are both bad *** blowers.

A couple things to note: Vortech has no business(currently) in OL 10.5, ODR, LS, or the likes. Their "performance market" ends IMO with x275 currently. I think you'd be suprised if you asked Stevie, Jason, or Chris if they think the Xi has more potential than their current S/c setup. Matter of fact, I know Jason's answer right now whether or not they are allowed to publically tell the answer or not.



I will say that a previous NMCA/NMRA racer has already gone 4.9's at x275 trim in Valdosta over a year ago. That was his 3rd pass on hoosier 275s. Same car got it done with less than 370c.i.

Many times at the x275 level, it's a matter of sponsorship than it is sheer performance. Something that Procharger is excellent at and Vortech is admittadely lacking.


There's more than one way to skin a cat. At x275 level, I'm just not 100% sold that Procharger is the pinnacle of performance. It is certainly the owner in the market for S/c though. I see it much like BS3. It's currently owns a stranglehold in heads up racing and it deserves respect, but doesnt nessecarily mean it's the "best".



If you're doing an F3....i'm not sure what Vortech has that could compete with a monster of that level! Other than a pair of XI's maybe?



Trust me, we are all too familiar with the Xi options and their results. I got to see it in action on a Dyno about 20min down the street from me last night.
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