Head studs ?
12-14-2012, 01:09 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Head studs ? Which are best...or best value ?
Regular 11mm ARP studs and 12pt nuts ( are these 8740 or whatever they call them ? )
11mm ARP2000 or Pro-Series, are they any different ?
Other materials or brands in 11mm fitment ?
Or stepping up, machining for 1/2" studs. But then again just the basic ARP stud, or are there better alternatives ?
Given the 11mm threads are unlikely to pull anyway, would a high spec 11mm stud be better than a low spec 1/2" stud ?
Regular 11mm ARP studs and 12pt nuts ( are these 8740 or whatever they call them ? )
11mm ARP2000 or Pro-Series, are they any different ?
Other materials or brands in 11mm fitment ?
Or stepping up, machining for 1/2" studs. But then again just the basic ARP stud, or are there better alternatives ?
Given the 11mm threads are unlikely to pull anyway, would a high spec 11mm stud be better than a low spec 1/2" stud ?
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12-14-2012, 03:57 PM
#4
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Thread Starter
Price isnt really important. Just wondering what the difference actually is.
I have the regular black ARP studs on mine and have no problem with them. But with a view to a bigger blower next year, and I'm having a new block prepared very soon.
If there is an 11mm upgrade over the normal ARP, then it would be a sensible idea.
Obviously 1/2" are bigger everywhere which is a good thing, despite the cost of the work and drilling the heads. But then they are the normal material again.
Ive heard of better 11mm studs, but cant actually seem to find any listed for sale, or any info on them.
I have the regular black ARP studs on mine and have no problem with them. But with a view to a bigger blower next year, and I'm having a new block prepared very soon.
If there is an 11mm upgrade over the normal ARP, then it would be a sensible idea.
Obviously 1/2" are bigger everywhere which is a good thing, despite the cost of the work and drilling the heads. But then they are the normal material again.
Ive heard of better 11mm studs, but cant actually seem to find any listed for sale, or any info on them.
12-15-2012, 12:41 PM
#5
On The Tree
I personally went with the pro-comps. Lot of guys using them without issue and price is an issue for me.
12-15-2012, 12:45 PM
#6
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Thread Starter
Most normal studs seem to quote 190,000psi tensile strength or something like that.
But there are other materials where they quote 260k. Even the L19's as you say dont seem to be advertised. But from what I understand, there are ones equivalent to L19, but not as fussy in terms of handling. But where are they ? lol
But there are other materials where they quote 260k. Even the L19's as you say dont seem to be advertised. But from what I understand, there are ones equivalent to L19, but not as fussy in terms of handling. But where are they ? lol
12-15-2012, 02:23 PM
#7
TECH Apprentice
Are you looking for the A-1 Fasteners.
http://www.a1technologies.com/index_flash.php
Is that what you are referring too?
BTW, I have ebay(KMJ) studs(torqued with oil over their spec), and have been over 1000hp on them, and have had ARP bolts break when I was tightening them(with their lube @ their spec). So you never know.
http://www.a1technologies.com/index_flash.php
Is that what you are referring too?
BTW, I have ebay(KMJ) studs(torqued with oil over their spec), and have been over 1000hp on them, and have had ARP bolts break when I was tightening them(with their lube @ their spec). So you never know.
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12-15-2012, 03:11 PM
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On The Tree
12-15-2012, 03:13 PM
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I just ordered the set from alper motorsports....they seem to be similar to the KMJ ones. Also, are rated at 190k psi tensile strength....others have used them with no issues.
I can report back once I get them in...
I can report back once I get them in...
12-15-2012, 03:25 PM
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I used the KMJ. My thinking is this...do we really think that ARP are the only people who can make a bolt or stud that's strong? Paying for the name. I am not 1000hp but I have to be at least 800 or more to the wheels.
12-15-2012, 03:38 PM
#12
I have used all three of the ARP's studs and 1/2" head studs as well. The ARP 2000's ($450-500 when i bought last set a couple of years ago) are what I use. The 1/2" are a pain in the *** if you want to use a GM gasket as they won't fit. Not a problem if you decide to use Cometics. GL! I don't use anything cheap when it comes to fasteners on my High HP builds. But everyone had to do what they want. Oh and the cost of the 1/2" ones goes up as it was about $450 total for the machine work and studs GL!
12-15-2012, 03:43 PM
#13
On The Tree
After doing some reading i understand what you mean about the L19s being "fussy". 260,000 psi tensile strength but they come in special waxed paper and need to be oiled to avoid hydrogen contamination? Also on arp's site the talk about strength goes up and toughness goes down (ie: brittle). I know nothing about metalurgy but maybe these are a bit excessive for the average boosted need?
12-15-2012, 04:21 PM
#14
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Thread Starter
I have used all three of the ARP's studs and 1/2" head studs as well. The ARP 2000's ($450-500 when i bought last set a couple of years ago) are what I use. The 1/2" are a pain in the *** if you want to use a GM gasket as they won't fit. Not a problem if you decide to use Cometics. GL! I don't use anything cheap when it comes to fasteners on my High HP builds. But everyone had to do what they want. Oh and the cost of the 1/2" ones goes up as it was about $450 total for the machine work and studs GL!
But therein is my query. So there is a regular ARP, and an ARP2000 ?
What's the difference ? I cant find any info on ARP's website.
But of course there will be many manufacturers of studs etc ARP is just the most popular brand. Ive been quoted approx $1000 for supply/fit 1/2" studs. I dont mind that really. I do mind the supporting work I'd need to get done locally, ie drill the heads. And now it's been mentioned, sorting the HG holes for the larger studs.
So really...it's hard to justify if there is a fancy drop in 11mm stud that may actually be superior to a bog standard 1/2" stud anyway.
12-15-2012, 04:29 PM
#15
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Thread Starter
Are you looking for the A-1 Fasteners.
http://www.a1technologies.com/index_flash.php
Is that what you are referring too?
BTW, I have ebay(KMJ) studs(torqued with oil over their spec), and have been over 1000hp on them, and have had ARP bolts break when I was tightening them(with their lube @ their spec). So you never know.
http://www.a1technologies.com/index_flash.php
Is that what you are referring too?
BTW, I have ebay(KMJ) studs(torqued with oil over their spec), and have been over 1000hp on them, and have had ARP bolts break when I was tightening them(with their lube @ their spec). So you never know.
12-15-2012, 07:50 PM
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arp 2000 good studs, arp l19 better studs but handling issues when you in stall them or with water,
arp age 625 plus the best stud you can buy i think other then top fuel stuff. its almost a SS so NO handleing issues. used on diesels alot when you want to go over 80 psi of boost
arp age 625 plus the best stud you can buy i think other then top fuel stuff. its almost a SS so NO handleing issues. used on diesels alot when you want to go over 80 psi of boost
12-15-2012, 09:12 PM
#17
On The Tree
http://www.performancetrucks.net/for...-625-a-498012/
Looks like the custom age 625+ might be what youve been looking for.
Looks like the custom age 625+ might be what youve been looking for.
12-16-2012, 05:04 AM
#18
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I think that info is worth a repost here. It would be interesting to see the clamp/load specs of these 625 studs compared to a regular 1/2" stud
I sent a e-mail over to ARP asking about L19's for pre-03 LS engines. My response from ARP.
"Rob,
We are now making them out of CA625 material. It is a superior material and more durable than L19. The part number is 234-4313. L19 is a custom order.
Best regards,
Alan Nichols
Sales & Technical"
These are not listed in the 2011 ARP catalog. My research:
Standard ARP 8740 chromoly Fastener Tensile Strength 190,000-200,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force= 13,470lbs)
L19 is 220,000-230,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force= 15,060lbs)
Custom Age 625+ is 270,000-280,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force not listed on site)
In comparison, 1/2 studs in ARP 8740 are rated at 18,515 Preload lbs/Clamp force.
Other good info. PER ARP installation instructions on LS Engines, 8740 is to be TQ'd to 80lb's. L19 is 90lb's, Custom Age is 100lb's.
Looks like a new option for big boosters looking to stick with a 7/16 stud and be close to the same playing field as the 1/2 stud setups. :hmmm: Your looking at around $350 give or take for ARP 8740, the best i've found on Custom Age 625 is $750 give or take. I'm not sure what the P/N is for the 04+.
Source for my info:
ARP 8740 for 03 and earlier LS:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4316.pdf
ARP2000/L19 ONLY for 04 and newer:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4319.pdf
CA625/Custom Age 625 03 and earlier:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4313.pdf
Their add is jack up saying 1993 lol, that's a early LS!
"Rob,
We are now making them out of CA625 material. It is a superior material and more durable than L19. The part number is 234-4313. L19 is a custom order.
Best regards,
Alan Nichols
Sales & Technical"
These are not listed in the 2011 ARP catalog. My research:
Standard ARP 8740 chromoly Fastener Tensile Strength 190,000-200,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force= 13,470lbs)
L19 is 220,000-230,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force= 15,060lbs)
Custom Age 625+ is 270,000-280,000psi (Preload lbs/Clamp force not listed on site)
In comparison, 1/2 studs in ARP 8740 are rated at 18,515 Preload lbs/Clamp force.
Other good info. PER ARP installation instructions on LS Engines, 8740 is to be TQ'd to 80lb's. L19 is 90lb's, Custom Age is 100lb's.
Looks like a new option for big boosters looking to stick with a 7/16 stud and be close to the same playing field as the 1/2 stud setups. :hmmm: Your looking at around $350 give or take for ARP 8740, the best i've found on Custom Age 625 is $750 give or take. I'm not sure what the P/N is for the 04+.
Source for my info:
ARP 8740 for 03 and earlier LS:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4316.pdf
ARP2000/L19 ONLY for 04 and newer:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4319.pdf
CA625/Custom Age 625 03 and earlier:
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4313.pdf
Their add is jack up saying 1993 lol, that's a early LS!
12-16-2012, 05:13 AM
#19
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Thread Starter
And some googling..., it's certainly one option.
http://arpcatalog.com/i/4/800/234-4314r.jpg
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4314.pdf
Found one retailer selling them for $730, Graveyard Motorsports. Summit have them at $746
Although Summit list the info as 190kpsi, and they call them Pro-Series, as well as stating CA625
http://arpcatalog.com/i/4/800/234-4314r.jpg
http://arpinstructions.com/instructions/234-4314.pdf
Found one retailer selling them for $730, Graveyard Motorsports. Summit have them at $746
Although Summit list the info as 190kpsi, and they call them Pro-Series, as well as stating CA625
12-16-2012, 05:48 AM
#20
What are you guys torqueing down the head studs to?????? 85,90 100 FT,LBs???? KMJ's, Pro2000, ARP standards. L19's
To recommendation?? Or more with aluminum heads or cast iron. I heard if you over torq you can wrap the heads is this possible? If it recommends 85 can this be torqed to say 93ftlbs???? Without bad effect's.
To recommendation?? Or more with aluminum heads or cast iron. I heard if you over torq you can wrap the heads is this possible? If it recommends 85 can this be torqed to say 93ftlbs???? Without bad effect's.