breaking up under load need ideas.
06-21-2014, 01:46 PM
#1
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breaking up under load need ideas. not sure where to put this because i dont know where the problem is stemming from.
forged 347 ls6 AFR heads turbo cam about 9.6 CR mid frame 78 everything is new. E85
car is usually hard to start and some times won't even start. when it does and the idle actually smooths out it will free rev in park just fine..
put the car in gear and put a load on it and it starts to break up.
has new cam and crank sensors. new plug wires new spark plugs NGK bref7s or what ever the no7 is.. was just messing with it and thinking it is fuel related e85 scale wide band reads around 10.0 idle if i remember right. once its in gear it goes up to 10.6 but i think thats maxing it out. could that be the issue now? not getting good fuel? Ryne at CMS is the one that did the base tune and tried to get it up on the dyno but couldn't figure out the problem i have since found a bad plug wire and threw some cheap ones on just to fix that issue
someone give me some idea no codes thrown. everything seems right
forged 347 ls6 AFR heads turbo cam about 9.6 CR mid frame 78 everything is new. E85
car is usually hard to start and some times won't even start. when it does and the idle actually smooths out it will free rev in park just fine..
put the car in gear and put a load on it and it starts to break up.
has new cam and crank sensors. new plug wires new spark plugs NGK bref7s or what ever the no7 is.. was just messing with it and thinking it is fuel related e85 scale wide band reads around 10.0 idle if i remember right. once its in gear it goes up to 10.6 but i think thats maxing it out. could that be the issue now? not getting good fuel? Ryne at CMS is the one that did the base tune and tried to get it up on the dyno but couldn't figure out the problem i have since found a bad plug wire and threw some cheap ones on just to fix that issue
someone give me some idea no codes thrown. everything seems right
06-21-2014, 02:15 PM
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its the auto meter elite gauge. it wont start its heat up until it gets running and see the higher voltage from the alt. i think i can turn that off though..
06-21-2014, 02:36 PM
#6
What brand wideband and how did you change it to the "e85 scale". If you truly have the WB02 set to the E85 scale it should read lower than 10.0. Sounds like you have it on gas scale and 10.0 is dead rich on that senor/gauge. It' probably breaking up due to it being dead rich. there is no load on the engine in neutral, this is probably why it free revs fine. Do you have the correct map sensor selected? Is it working properly? Sounds like the load table VS MAP sensor is way off. You need a way to view all the parameters and make sure they are all what they should be.
What do the plugs look like after a decent amount of idle time?
IMO if you paid someone for a base tune and it runs like yours is running, I'd take it back to him. Obviously he didn't tune it correctly.
What do the plugs look like after a decent amount of idle time?
IMO if you paid someone for a base tune and it runs like yours is running, I'd take it back to him. Obviously he didn't tune it correctly.
06-21-2014, 02:48 PM
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its the auto meter elite wide band here is the instructions for setting it now that i think about it i dont remember seeing anything about the save cancel
To Change your Stoichiometric AFR setting:
When the current Stoichiometric set point is displayed, press SELECT (+) to increase your Stoichiometric AFR setting, and mODE (-) to decrease your Stoichiometric AFR setting.
After you have selected your new Stoichiometric set point, the gauge will flash your new set point 5 times on the display and then the SSD will display “S C” for Save/Cancel.
To confirm your new Stoichiometric setting, press mODE (-). This will save your Stoichiometric set point changes and return the gauge to Real-Time mode.
To cancel the changes and return to your previous set point, press SELECT (+). This will cancel the Stoichiometric set point changes and return the gauge to Real-Time mode.
ill look in to that. for sure now that i read that AGAIN.. but there has been no money exchanged yet aim looking at buying HPtuners myself and just tuning it on my own '
To Change your Stoichiometric AFR setting:
When the current Stoichiometric set point is displayed, press SELECT (+) to increase your Stoichiometric AFR setting, and mODE (-) to decrease your Stoichiometric AFR setting.
After you have selected your new Stoichiometric set point, the gauge will flash your new set point 5 times on the display and then the SSD will display “S C” for Save/Cancel.
To confirm your new Stoichiometric setting, press mODE (-). This will save your Stoichiometric set point changes and return the gauge to Real-Time mode.
To cancel the changes and return to your previous set point, press SELECT (+). This will cancel the Stoichiometric set point changes and return the gauge to Real-Time mode.
ill look in to that. for sure now that i read that AGAIN.. but there has been no money exchanged yet aim looking at buying HPtuners myself and just tuning it on my own '
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06-22-2014, 11:14 AM
#8
I would just leave the wb in gas scale. 14.7 for idle/cruise and 11.00 im boost.
The wb prolly converts lambda into afr values. 1.0 is stoich for all fuels so just leave it on gas scale. Doesn't matter if your running 93, diesel, ethanol, alcohol etc when your mixture is stoich the wb will display 14.7
As for your actual running issue it is more than likely that base tune isn't close enough for your setup.
Had my car "professionally" tuned on e85 with a rear mount turbo. Never would start even if I held the key it would just keep cranking. I would have to crank it 2-3 times then it would chug to life.
Sent my tune to someone to look at and my injector data was way off. Had him send it back with correct injector data and the first fire up I did this year after re assembling the motor, untuned the motor fired right off the first try soon as I hit the starter.
The wb prolly converts lambda into afr values. 1.0 is stoich for all fuels so just leave it on gas scale. Doesn't matter if your running 93, diesel, ethanol, alcohol etc when your mixture is stoich the wb will display 14.7
As for your actual running issue it is more than likely that base tune isn't close enough for your setup.
Had my car "professionally" tuned on e85 with a rear mount turbo. Never would start even if I held the key it would just keep cranking. I would have to crank it 2-3 times then it would chug to life.
Sent my tune to someone to look at and my injector data was way off. Had him send it back with correct injector data and the first fire up I did this year after re assembling the motor, untuned the motor fired right off the first try soon as I hit the starter.
Last edited by 95bowtie; 06-22-2014 at 11:20 AM.
06-22-2014, 11:54 AM
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yea I'm going to reset the gauge, i also ordered HpTuners so ill have a better idea of what going on.
no the tuner spent most of the day trying to do everything he could but no dice, i have since found a broken plug wire and fixed that but I'm sure it was only part of the issue.
he as told me that he did some crazy stuff to try and get it going. so he is unsure where the tune is at right now. probably just need to bring things back in line and go from there
no the tuner spent most of the day trying to do everything he could but no dice, i have since found a broken plug wire and fixed that but I'm sure it was only part of the issue.
he as told me that he did some crazy stuff to try and get it going. so he is unsure where the tune is at right now. probably just need to bring things back in line and go from there
06-22-2014, 12:27 PM
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load the stock tune back in, and fire it up... Change the injectors to what they are. It should run even with E85 in the tank. Mine did... I filled her up on E with the stock tune, left stock injectors in too, and drove to the tuner, back when i did my GTO.
06-22-2014, 12:33 PM
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ha i dont even have that file stock was so long ago. i think a friend does have an old file though i just have to get it from him
06-23-2014, 05:06 PM
#14
I think 95bowtie mentioned this, but every single wideband ever made reads in lambda, and then all that occurs inside the gauge, is if it is setup to run on gas, it multiplies by 14.63 (ish), if it is setup to read e85, it multiplies by 9.7 (ish). I have my AEM set up to read exactly lambda. That way there is never a question on what fuel I am on, or anything like that. I look for 0.77-0.79 in WOT, and 0.97-1.00 while cruising.
