The Alchemist

iTrader: (19)

I agree with EA with finding the best power/money ratio upgrades. Personally, I know I had some power in an undersized air filter, also, I have some belt slip issues that need to be addressed etc.

But the bigger point of this thread was when/if you need a new impeller, the options come into play, and if there is a better option than an impeller designed by procharger x years ago, then why not chose that option.

Now it doesn't make sense to spend $500 on an impeller to gain 30-40hp if you're leaving that much power or more on the table with a better intercooler or bigger air filter.

DavidBoren

Alchemist and EA, you are both very correct that it does not make sense to worry about the impeller if you have other **** to square away. Intercoolers, piping, and definitely camshaft selection will all play a huge role in the overall performance of any combination.

I would love to see the before and after pressure map of one of these JB impellers. Or a before and after pressure map of the Steve Morris internal CNC Pro Volute. But finding any ProCharger pressure maps is damn near impossible.

E.A.

I can say why I wouldn't chose that option...

Because when it comes to something that gets used in temps ranging from (-35 to underhood temps of 250+ degrees) and spins upwards of 70,000k rpm. The last thing I want to do is tighten up tolerances that obviously are there for a reason. No matter if we are talking a ProCharger, Vortech, Paxton, or Turbo....

If this power gain was from the following:

- A fresh design of impeller for more CFM.
- The same (or better) boost curve. (good luck with that vs. a D1SC)
- The same or looser tolerances.
- A fresh different volute design

Then I would be impressed,....

But selling something with tighter tolerances to sneak out just a few minute ponies (at the sacrifice of longevity)... not really my cup of tea. That would rank right up there with removing the gear oil out of my Strange rearend, to save on drag.








And I am telling you, there are soooooo many terrible cams out there, and terrible intercooler combos its almost mind bending. Its amazing that something as simple as intercooler pressure drop is literally almost unheard of when asking about a persons combo.

Maps are for hiking...
The track tells all, and there are plenty of data points on peoples supercharged combos to know whats the right blower to run no matter what brand. (Aka, who goes fast at the track, not post counts on the forum)

And maps = garbage, as soon as someone throws a POS "China-bay" intercooler into the mix, or a "Grumpy Uncle Stage 2 ultra lope" cam LOL. So unless your lost in Colorado, the track and data are the best place to dial in a combo.

Blown06

iTrader: (32)

What I would like to see is some back to back testing with the stock impeller, both aftermarket impellers and then a Morris modified pro-volute with his bell using a stock impeller.

He stated a while back that he does have a cnc program for the d1sc volute........but I've never heard of anyone (3 party unbiased consumer) post any results.

DavidBoren

I emailed Steve Morris prior to making this thread. I asked for results of his internal CNC Pro Volute on the D1SC, and if he has ever done the internal CNC milling in conjunction with an aftermarket impeller. The reply said they no longer offer the internal milling on the D1SC size cases. They still offer it for the F-series blowers, though. And they had nothing to share about aftermarket impellers.

EA, I absolutely understand what you are saying about the intercooler and cam. Every time I hear someone ask a cam question, I always tell them to seek advice from the professionals. I point most everyone to Martin Smallwood and preach about Cam Motion cores quite a bit, and I have absolutely no interest in a Grumpy Uncle Stage 2 ultra lope cam. I generally prefer smaller cams, and I literally couldn't give half a **** about "lope", at all, ever. I understand the merits of overlap in a cam, but I care infinitely more about performance and driveability over the noise the exhaust makes when idling.

Intercooler and intake pipe sizing are both topics I have to research more before pulling the trigger on anything. If I could ever find a way to afford one, I would like to use a Lingenfelter A2W intake manifold. That would allow the blower to be plumbed directly to the throttle body, with the absolute shortest and straightest piping possible. If the cost of a proper A2A intercooler becomes even mildly comparable to the Lingenfelter intake, then I will probably just save for the intercooled intake. From what I have seen, though, most A2A setups are quite a bit cheaper.

PS. That maps are for hiking comment almost made me spray coffe out of my nose. Track results are the best meter of performance, for sure. I just personally prefer to see any data available. I like being provided with information. Be it lab results like static vacuum flowbench numbers, or different dyno results that vary from dyno to dyno, or pressure maps from different blowers/turbos, I just like having information to study and draw my own conclusions from. I very often verify lab data against any available track results I can find related to whatever I am studying. The track is absolutely where the real proof is, but I still find lab data interesting and helpful.

Blown06

iTrader: (32)

I was just saying, Morris has supposedly make some ridiculous power with his modified d1sc on the dyno. So much so, that I can't see an aftermarket volute competing with that. I could be wrong though.