Stock fuel pump ok on E85 cammed LS1?
05-19-2011, 09:43 PM
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Stock fuel pump ok on E85 cammed LS1? I have an 02 SS with a cam,long tubes, catback, and lid that dyno'd 383/367 on 91 octane with the stock injectors. Now I am running the bosch 36lb(3-bar)41lb(4 bar) injectors and got a tune set up to run E85. The tuner expects me to be at about the 400-420hp range depending on how well my car reacts to it. My question is will my stock pump with 51,000 miles be ok with for this horsepower range or will I have to buy a bigger pump? I really don't want to spend the money and go through the install if I don't have to.
05-20-2011, 07:39 AM
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From the searching I've done it says the stock pump is about maxed out at 500rwhp on a NA car running premium so 400-420 NA with E85 "should" be ok right?
05-20-2011, 08:48 AM
#3
You are going to be cutting it close.
I see a couple of scenarios.
Do your E85 tune and see how far it goes. If you make it, done. If not, you know you'll need to get a pump and tune again.
or
Go ahead an do the pump, probably looking about the cost of a pump+install = 1 dyno tuning session. (unless you have a dyno hook up). ...and then get tuned.
If you make it to your goal on the stock pump, you'll probably save a couple hundred bucks. ...but if you don't and end up having to purchase and install a pump and retune, then you'll be a couple hundred $$$ above the option of just doing the pump before.
Now, I'm sure there are other factors for you to consider, too.
I see a couple of scenarios.
Do your E85 tune and see how far it goes. If you make it, done. If not, you know you'll need to get a pump and tune again.
or
Go ahead an do the pump, probably looking about the cost of a pump+install = 1 dyno tuning session. (unless you have a dyno hook up). ...and then get tuned.
If you make it to your goal on the stock pump, you'll probably save a couple hundred bucks. ...but if you don't and end up having to purchase and install a pump and retune, then you'll be a couple hundred $$$ above the option of just doing the pump before.
Now, I'm sure there are other factors for you to consider, too.
05-20-2011, 12:46 PM
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Thanks! If I don't do a pump and run it this way other than the motor going lean and blowing up is there any other hint the pump is maxed out? I was thinking if the pump isn't keeping up shouldn't my duty cycle on HPTuners start lowering under full throttle? Right now on gas my duty cylce stays very consistent but I would think if the pump isn't keeping up they should lower or dip a ways right?
05-20-2011, 02:55 PM
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ah ****, well, I guess if they jump way higher than the about 80% duty cycle I should be at for e85 after the tune they are probably starved and trying to keep up?
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05-23-2011, 11:07 AM
#8
You can let them creep up to 90% or so, but I wouldn't suggest running them higher too much higher than that.
If you have a large enough injector for your power goals, and you are seeing IDCs increasing or going static, you are probably beyond what your fuel pump can manage. If you don't have a fuel pressure gauge, you might purchase/borrow one to keep an eye on what the fuel system is doing. You can't always monitor IDCs.
If you have a large enough injector for your power goals, and you are seeing IDCs increasing or going static, you are probably beyond what your fuel pump can manage. If you don't have a fuel pressure gauge, you might purchase/borrow one to keep an eye on what the fuel system is doing. You can't always monitor IDCs.
05-24-2011, 01:31 PM
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Your going to decide what is best for you of course but here is what I did so far.
My 02 Z06 is stock other then CAI and Corsa muffler. I wanted to run E85 and my logs last year showed the stock injectors running 94-100 at dragstrip on pump 93 Sunoco. Research lead me to less then ideal factory wiring on fuel pumps in general 18 gauge, so I added a Race tronix hotwire kit hooked up to the alternator output (~13.5 volts) which helped the IDC was ~94 on 25-30% ethanol by volume. Last week I finally got around to adding a Kenne Bell Boost a Pump and kept the dial that everyone throws out to dial in just enough voltage to see where my IDC was still good. This week with 33% and the dial set for 25% increase my IDC was 84% and the delivered torque log showed 31 ft lbs over my runs last year on 93 Sunoco!
You can change pumps, and you can change injectors or you can add a pump hot wire and a BAP and have fueling for 600-700 hp with the factory stuff. I was leary at first but was told by Kenne Bell that the fuel pump life will be good or better then stock with the higher voltage helping the pump push. The concept is not new as Dr Christopher Jacobs had a diagram in his electrical book on setting a set of relays with a 12 volt motorcycle battery and have it switch to 24 volts at wide open throttle. Dr Jacobs was an electrical engineer and very sharp mechanic as well. There is a whole section on EFI pumps and boost a pump on the Kenne bell site, good info.
The Racetronix kit was $70 for my car but some guys make them from 10 gauge wire and a relay, the BAP was $250 and installation not hard at all.
The e85 is just beginning!
Hope this helps.
Carlos
My 02 Z06 is stock other then CAI and Corsa muffler. I wanted to run E85 and my logs last year showed the stock injectors running 94-100 at dragstrip on pump 93 Sunoco. Research lead me to less then ideal factory wiring on fuel pumps in general 18 gauge, so I added a Race tronix hotwire kit hooked up to the alternator output (~13.5 volts) which helped the IDC was ~94 on 25-30% ethanol by volume. Last week I finally got around to adding a Kenne Bell Boost a Pump and kept the dial that everyone throws out to dial in just enough voltage to see where my IDC was still good. This week with 33% and the dial set for 25% increase my IDC was 84% and the delivered torque log showed 31 ft lbs over my runs last year on 93 Sunoco!
You can change pumps, and you can change injectors or you can add a pump hot wire and a BAP and have fueling for 600-700 hp with the factory stuff. I was leary at first but was told by Kenne Bell that the fuel pump life will be good or better then stock with the higher voltage helping the pump push. The concept is not new as Dr Christopher Jacobs had a diagram in his electrical book on setting a set of relays with a 12 volt motorcycle battery and have it switch to 24 volts at wide open throttle. Dr Jacobs was an electrical engineer and very sharp mechanic as well. There is a whole section on EFI pumps and boost a pump on the Kenne bell site, good info.
The Racetronix kit was $70 for my car but some guys make them from 10 gauge wire and a relay, the BAP was $250 and installation not hard at all.
The e85
is just beginning!Hope this helps.
Carlos
