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This is the second thread I’ve started on this build. I can’t really put my finger on why I took down the first one so I’ll just say “it didn’t feel right” and leave it at that.
Platform
The car is a 2011 Camaro 2SS 6 Speed Convertible which I purchased new in March 2011. The exterior is silver with a black top and the interior is black leather.
Modification History
I’d been planning from the very beginning to modify the car. I wanted a late model hot rod that could deliver performance, comfort and dependability. I was considering doing a big cubic inch motor. So, I contacted a local shop in Memphis called Dynospeed and spoke with the owner, Josh Elam, about what I wanted to do. During that initial conversation Josh suggested a supercharger and after a short time we decided on a 2.9 Liter Whipple. The guys at Dynospeed installed the blower and a set of Kooks 1 7/8 headers with no catalytic converters. They did a great job and the car responded jumping from the bone stock 380 RWHP to 600 RWHP with the 3.875” pulley running 10 pounds of boost. I was happy except that every time I drove the car I thought my ears would bleed. Two months later I asked Dynospeed to put a set of cats on the car. What was I thinking?
After a short period of time I contacted Josh at Dynospeed about doing a cam. This discussion resulted in a round of upgrades that included a custom Comp Camshaft, Comp 26926 valve springs, Push Rods, Yella Terra Rockers, Injector Dynamics ID850s and a Lingenfelter Twin Pump Fuel System. In addition, since they were already back there doing the fuel system, they went ahead and installed a set of BMR Trailing Arms and Toe Rods. After overcoming a rocker arm issue (ended up ditching the YTs) the car put down 651 RWHP.
Not long after that, the clutch was upgraded to LPE’s MAX ZX Twin LS9 clutch and the brakes were treated to Brembo Cross Drilled Rotors, Hawk HPS Street Pads and a set of Braided Brake Lines. Other, piece meal modifications included a full 3” Kooks exhaust system, ARH frame brace, ZR1 map sensor, CAI cold air kit and a weighted TWM shifter ball. I also went to a set of ZL1 replica Satan Black wheels 20x9 front and 20x10 rear, as well as, flat black Camaro lettering, SS emblems and tail light bezels.
Car is fun to drive. Top down on a cool day….. awesome…. and it looks good too.
Tick Performance Extreme 377 (Preamble)
I’ve had the car over three years and I’ve decided to do some more upgrades. I’d like to take the car up to around the 750 RWHP level without methanol. When I made the decision to do this I was convinced that I wanted a 416. My thought was that the added cubes would allow me to keep the boost about the same and, besides that, I thought that it would be really cool to put a set of Emblem Pros 416 numerals on the cowl. I spoke with Josh at Dynospeed and he suggested a stock cube motor with better heads and forged internals. I asked if Dynospeed built there own engines and he said they did not but suggested a couple of engine builders. They are a good group of guys at Dynospeed but I really wanted the build and installation to be done by the same shop. Soon thereafter, I began searching for a different shop. I checked a few and decided to go with Tick Performance. They were very honest and up front about cost and I really felt comfortable with them… they’re good people. At any rate, like Dynospeed, Tick suggested a 377. I’d bet I asked Martin and Jonathan five different times if they were sure about me not needing a 416. Patiently, and repeatedly, they stated that while I could reach my goal with both motors, the 377 was a better choice.
Tick Performance Extreme 377 built by Jonathan Atkins The decision has been made and the car is at Tick as I type this. I delivered the car on Monday, October 20th and I am set to pick it up on Monday, November 10th. The car is getting a Tick Performance Extreme 377 with a few upgrades, as well as, a set of DSS 1000 hp axles. Parts breakdown listed below:
LS3 block machined to 4.070” bore
Callies Dragonslayer 3.625” stroke crankshaft
Compstar 6.125” connecting rods
Premium Bearings
Wiseco Pistons with Premium Rings (10 to 1 compression)
Custom Camshaft built to Martin Smallwood’s specifications
Katech C5R Timing chain
ARP Head Studs and Main Studs
Advanced Induction Ported LS3 Heads
Trunion Upgraded LS3 Rockers
BTR Springs
Comp Pushrods
Morel 5206 Lifters
Ported Oil Pump
Whipple 10 Rib Pulley Kit with ATI 6% Overdrive Damper
Car should be even more fun to drive..... Hope to see some Dyno numbers soon!!
Here are some pictures of Mike's new motor tucked into its new home!!!
All so important "supercharged badges!"
The camshaft I chose for Mike's engine is one that I have had great luck with in other 1.9-2.3 liter positive displacement blower applications. With Mike's engine having a larger blower I upped the overlap slightly in comparison to the smaller blowers I have used this camshaft with. Adding overlap to the camshaft when the blower is capable of supplying the airflow demand the added overlap creates means more power!
227/243 .624/.627 115.5+4 are the chosen camshaft specifications. This should give Mike a great balance of driving manners, power under and above the curve, rock solid valve train stability/reliability and a great idle note to boot.
I think we're going to need a smaller pulley Mike! This was done on 11psi.
Doesn't look like it has even made peak power yet. As we turn the blower faster that power peak will come down in RPM some as demand from the blower goes up. This is why I pushed a 3.622" stroke so hard. This thing is no where near done making power with the 2.9 Whipple and I bet the blower would make at least 20psi before it's done in terms of airflow.
That's incredible Martin. I wasn't sure how much extra boost we were going to get out of the 6% OD damper so I was conservative on my pulley selection. Jonathan emailed me and said he'd like to run 15 pounds of boost to get to between 750 and 800 rwhp on a conservative tune. Wow!! He'll be ordering the appropriate pulley to make that happen (3.375 I imagine). I am glad I heeded your advice on the cubic inches.
Pulley is ordered, but unfortunately we missed their cut off time for getting the pulley out today for overnight delivery.
It will not be here until Friday. Ordered a 3.375" and we're going to try to see if the 95.25" belt you brought with you will work with the smaller pulley. It was much too short for the larger 3.75" pulley on it now.
I honestly believe if you wanted it to, that this combination would make 900rwhp on blower alone.
I honestly believe if you wanted it to, that this combination would make 900rwhp on blower alone.
900 rear wheel horsepower
That number is just staggering..... and so cool. Incredible.
Let me know if you have any issues with the pulley and belt delivery and whether or not it throws a wrench in the Monday pickup. I can probably stay in Mt. Airy another night if I need to if you guys need another day.
Awesome Martin. Tell Jonathan and everyone at the shop "great job" and I appreciate their hard work.
Why a 377, I was thinking a 408? The reason I ask is that I messed up my #7 rod or piston-don`t know yet. But I plan on putting forged rods and piston in. I have a 2013 ZL1 making 700rwhp and 694trq at wheels and I spray meth. This was a stock block with stock heads. Your Car looks good, look forward to hearing from you. Thanks!
Why a 377, I was thinking a 408? The reason I ask is that I messed up my #7 rod or piston-don`t know yet. But I plan on putting forged rods and piston in. I have a 2013 ZL1 making 700rwhp and 694trq at wheels and I spray meth. This was a stock block with stock heads. Your Car looks good, look forward to hearing from you. Thanks!
I very seriously considered doing a 416. 4.070” bore x 4” stroke rotating assemblies are readily available. That said, I also thought about doing a 406 (4.070 x 3.9), 398 (4.070 x 3.825), and a 390 (4.070 x 3.750). The cranks for these displacements are fairly common but the pistons not so much. We did not want to get in to ordering custom pistons. So the choice was either a 3.625" stroke or a 4" stroke.
The reason I did not go with the 4” stroke is answered by Martin below.
Last edited by FLYZNTN; 11-07-2014 at 05:07 PM.
Reason: Martin is far more qualified than I.
Longer stroke engines generate more piston speed for a given RPM. More piston speed means more CFM demand from the piston. This means the piston demands more airflow from the induction system(in this instance the induction is attached to a blower) at a given RPM versus a shorter stroke.
This means that for a given amount of pressure, the longer stroke moves more airflow, and for the same amount of pressure a shorter stroke moves less airflow.
A longer stroke engine will max the blower out at a lower boost pressure than a shorter stroke engine. If you've ever looked at a compressor map you'll know that to move a specific amount of airflow you need a certain amount of pressure. If the amount of airflow you need to move to make the power you want requires a pressure higher than what a longer stroke engine will allow to be made, due to moving more airflow at a lower pressure, why would you build the longer stroke engine?
Even though the longer stroke moves more airflow at a lower pressure, if you can't make more pressure to move more airflow you've maxed the blower out and no more power will be made. The only way to make more pressure and move more airflow is with a shorter stroke, at least in this instance.
Sounds about right. Problem is I've done a ton of stroker upgrades throughout the years and keep the same exact blowers on the car with the same pulleys. The difference on the dyno sheets is the low/midrange power.
With a root's style blower there is less of a gain compared to centrificals but there is still a difference.Then you add the off boost gains.
Well, at this point, it's all academic. I'm running out of fuel.....
Jonathan states "The AFR starts to lean up at around 5500 rpms and is verified by fuel pressure drop on the data log. Pressure drops from 62 to around 45 by the end of the pull. Voltage during the log doesn't drop below 14.6 volts, and since Lingenfelter suggests not boosting the controller more than 14.8 volts I'm not sure that would even benefit us at all."
A new fuel system is not in the budget. The above pull was running 13.5 pounds of boost. We are going to back it down to 11.5 and leave it at 700 RWHP. I'm a little disappointed but not really surprised. Going in I thought we might run in to a fuel issue. I was hoping that we might be able to voltage boost but I don't want to go beyond what Lingenfelter recommends. It is what it is.
I've got a good foundation in place for the future. Next year, when I upgrade the rear end, I'll redo the fuel system and shoot for 850 RWHP.
It was no shot at you guys. Just went by what I see. Your setup is very stout and will rip.
Fuel is a bitch in these cars. The LPE kit doesn't hold what you think it would. I like the squash dual setup with feed/return lines. Would hold your power no problem.
It was no shot at you guys. Just went by what I see. Your setup is very stout and will rip.
Fuel is a bitch in these cars. The LPE kit doesn't hold what you think it would. I like the squash dual setup with feed/return lines. Would hold your power no problem.
No biggie Slowhawk. I'm not offended or anything. Yes, the squash is what Jonathan and Martin both recommended when it became obvious that the LPE pumps weren't going to cut it. I kicked it around but we've kind of run in to a time crunch, as well as, a money crunch. The pump itself I could probably do but the PTFE feed and return lines pretty much doubles that price and installation is labor intensive.... gonna have to wait
Just about every big inch combo I've seen or cammed with anything under a 2.9L blower just hasn't made the power I felt it was capable of. Yes they made more power at idle up to around 2500-3000rpm, but every 377" motor with the same blower I've seen or cammed blew it out of the water past that. The big motors just cannot peak past 6000-6200rpm where as the short stroke motors can raise that peak to 6400-6600rpm or higher with the right camshaft.
These things make such ridiculous torque anyways that a slight reduction in torque comparing the big motor to the smaller motor would probably make it easier to launch, hook up and bring more power in faster. At least on the size tire you can easily fit on a 5th gen Camaro.
600rwtq for 3500rpm from 3000rpm to 6500rpm is killer torque! If it hadn't been running out of fuel it may of made a bit more on 13psi. We could of put a little more timing in it and continued to tune on it at that boost level and extract every last bit of power. Notice how at 6600-6700rpm as it starts to go leaner power rolls over and quits climbing. Definitely wanted more fuel there.
I still think that if you were to put a pulley on this blower that would make 18-20psi that 900rwhp would be easily obtainable.
We are definitely going to turn it up some more. I'll probably pick up the 3.125" pulley to hit 15 psi. Whipple says that pulley should do 16 but it seems like in my application we're getting about a pound less than what Whipple was getting on there stock test mule. I'll be in touch over the coming months and we'll figure out a schedule. I'm going to try to sell some of my used stuff and see what I can get for it. I'll replace the LPE dual fuel pumps then I'll be selling it and a set of 63 pound injectors. That would be a good setup for a somebody. Perfect for one of the NA guys.
11-01-2014, 11:13 AM
Tick Extreme 377 
