No synthetic recomendation for the F-body?
03-30-2009, 08:02 AM
#1
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No synthetic recomendation for the F-body? Hey guys
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
03-30-2009, 09:43 AM
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I believe the oil temps on the vette tend to run higher due to a tighter engine compartment hence the rec for synthetic. Synthetics are good in F-bodies too.
03-30-2009, 09:52 AM
#3
Hey guys
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
Driving style.
Cost.
03-30-2009, 10:02 AM
#4
Hey guys
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
Just as a disclaimer, yes I searched.
The owners manual for my 2002 TransAm does not recommend synthetic oil unless your going to be running in very cold temps. However, the owners manual for the 2002 Corvette DOES recommend synthetic oil. How come? Based on the faq here, an LS1 is an LS1 is an LS1. So why the recommendation only for the 'vette? Maybe they think the vette would be raced more than a f-body? Just curious.
Put in 10W40 regular oil, manufacturer of your choice. Change it every 3,000 and you're engine will last just as long if not longer than if you use synthetic.
I just broke 100,000 miles with my 7 year old 427 stroker motor and it runs like the day I first started it up. All original parts, zero problems. One thing I do that most don't though, maybe it makes the difference, I do an engine flush at each oil change. I drain my old oil, pour 2 quarts of engine flush in with 2 quarts of oil/new oil still remaining in the pan, let it run for 5 minutes, then drain and refill with the new oil.
A/C Delco oil filter or ProLine Purolator. Don't waste your money on so-called exotic filters. More hype. 3,000 mile changes is your best protection.
03-30-2009, 02:15 PM
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I may just go with Valvoline maxlife 10w-30 when I change the oil this time around. Then I'll do a UOA and see how it comes back. GM does some stupid things sometimes. I'm willing to bet it's just a marketing thing like you guys said.
03-30-2009, 02:35 PM
#7
Synthetic oil is PROVEN better than conventional oil in every possible way, and all are beneficial to your engine. Synthetic oil has a lower coefficient of friction than convetional oil, which reduces frictional losses, improves power and efficiency, and reduces wear on internal engine components. It also has many more additives, which allow the oil to last longer and protect the engine better.
Synthetic oil also resists tempurature extremes much better than conventional oil does. Mobil 1 will pour out of the bottle at -57 degrees. Try that with regular oil, its molasses.
My other car has a GM 3800 Series II Supercharged. For the first 150,000 miles of its life it was run on conventional oil. Everyone knows those motors run HOT, especially if you run regular 87 octane. When I pulled the valve covers I had to scrape about an inch of sludge from the inside of the covers. Regular oil cokes up when it gets hot, and over the course of the engines life, thats the result. If the previous owner had run synthetic from day one it wouldn't have had any sludge problems.
Put in 10W40 regular oil, manufacturer of your choice. Change it every 3,000 and you're engine will last just as long if not longer than if you use synthetic
Last edited by Wesmanw02; 03-30-2009 at 02:42 PM.
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03-30-2009, 05:42 PM
#8
And the original poster does not have a heavily modded engine, maybe stock. Synthietic is a waste of money.
When you have a 427ci stroker or something similar pass 100,000 miles and still runs like brand new and with not a spec of varnish build-up or "gunk/sludge" inside anywhere.....you let me know.
People, like you and that 3800 series, just do oil changes which is very bad to do......you need to flush the old oil out completely each time...that is THE KEY. Thats why it got all sludged up and nasty. Maybe it would have gone to 200,000 miles and still be spotless inside like a few of my cars have.
Synthetics may be better for high dollar, expensive race motors or other exotic engines........not a stock or near stock, or even a nicely built LPE 427ci like mine...............certainly a waste for a stock LS1.
And the owners manual from GM says, DON'T USE SYNTHETIC.
Last edited by LS6427; 03-30-2009 at 05:51 PM.
03-30-2009, 05:57 PM
#9
More misinformation. The viscocity of oil that you should use is entirely dependent on the tolerances of your engine. Saying "just use 10W-40 in everything" is poor advice. If the motor was recently rebuild and has tight tolerances, putting in a high viscocity oil is pointless. LS1's are designed to use 5W-30 from the factory, and on a low mileage car, thats what I would use. I use Mobil 1 10W-30 in my car, because is higher mileage.
I do agree with you that 30 wt is good, I just like 40 wt. It has proven over the past 20 years to do perfectly.
More proof that too much emphasis by ordinary people with stock cars is being put into this subject.
You won't see me telling someone with a $20,000 454ci stroker motor on spray to use regular oil, because who knows what the builder did with that engine. Stock or near stock....its a no-brainer, and almost any normal oil will do the same job. Its firmly proven over the past 80 years.
03-30-2009, 07:26 PM
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I hope you're not serious. Thats one of the most ignorant statements I've heard in a long time.
Synthetic oil is PROVEN better than conventional oil in every possible way, and all are beneficial to your engine. Synthetic oil has a lower coefficient of friction than convetional oil, which reduces frictional losses, improves power and efficiency, and reduces wear on internal engine components. It also has many more additives, which allow the oil to last longer and protect the engine better.
Synthetic oil also resists tempurature extremes much better than conventional oil does. Mobil 1 will pour out of the bottle at -57 degrees. Try that with regular oil, its molasses.
My other car has a GM 3800 Series II Supercharged. For the first 150,000 miles of its life it was run on conventional oil. Everyone knows those motors run HOT, especially if you run regular 87 octane. When I pulled the valve covers I had to scrape about an inch of sludge from the inside of the covers. Regular oil cokes up when it gets hot, and over the course of the engines life, thats the result. If the previous owner had run synthetic from day one it wouldn't have had any sludge problems.
More misinformation. The viscocity of oil that you should use is entirely dependent on the tolerances of your engine. Saying "just use 10W-40 in everything" is poor advice. If the motor was recently rebuild and has tight tolerances, putting in a high viscocity oil is pointless. LS1's are designed to use 5W-30 from the factory, and on a low mileage car, thats what I would use. I use Mobil 1 10W-30 in my car, because is higher mileage.
Synthetic oil is PROVEN better than conventional oil in every possible way, and all are beneficial to your engine. Synthetic oil has a lower coefficient of friction than convetional oil, which reduces frictional losses, improves power and efficiency, and reduces wear on internal engine components. It also has many more additives, which allow the oil to last longer and protect the engine better.
Synthetic oil also resists tempurature extremes much better than conventional oil does. Mobil 1 will pour out of the bottle at -57 degrees. Try that with regular oil, its molasses.
My other car has a GM 3800 Series II Supercharged. For the first 150,000 miles of its life it was run on conventional oil. Everyone knows those motors run HOT, especially if you run regular 87 octane. When I pulled the valve covers I had to scrape about an inch of sludge from the inside of the covers. Regular oil cokes up when it gets hot, and over the course of the engines life, thats the result. If the previous owner had run synthetic from day one it wouldn't have had any sludge problems.
More misinformation. The viscocity of oil that you should use is entirely dependent on the tolerances of your engine. Saying "just use 10W-40 in everything" is poor advice. If the motor was recently rebuild and has tight tolerances, putting in a high viscocity oil is pointless. LS1's are designed to use 5W-30 from the factory, and on a low mileage car, thats what I would use. I use Mobil 1 10W-30 in my car, because is higher mileage.
03-30-2009, 07:29 PM
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Eh, I just use synthetic oil because I know it can't be worse than regular oil. Some people say that it isn't better, but it surely isn't worse. It's only a couple dollars more anyways. Buy the big pack at wal-mart.
03-30-2009, 07:40 PM
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Yep, the motor is stock. It's got some piston slap though. I'll be switching to a 10w-30 and see if it helps any.
Like I said, I'll try some maxlife in it and do a UOA when the oil life monitor pops up.
Like I said, I'll try some maxlife in it and do a UOA when the oil life monitor pops up.
03-30-2009, 07:47 PM
#13
I agree with LS6427, sort of. Synthetic oil doesn't break down like regular oil. It still does become acidic after sitting, however. The only benefit you get by using synthetic is that you can drive more miles on it without the oil breaking down.
My philosophy is: synthetic can't be worse that regular. Synthetic may cost twice as much, but you can go twice as long, making it a non-argument. I use synthetic because I only drive my T/A about 3000 mile a year (if that) and I change it right before I store it. I'm not changing oil regularly (like a DD), so I don't care about the extra cost.
Do what you're comfortable with.
My philosophy is: synthetic can't be worse that regular. Synthetic may cost twice as much, but you can go twice as long, making it a non-argument. I use synthetic because I only drive my T/A about 3000 mile a year (if that) and I change it right before I store it. I'm not changing oil regularly (like a DD), so I don't care about the extra cost.
Do what you're comfortable with.
03-31-2009, 08:52 AM
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True Statement: Synthetic oil is better than conventional oil, as a general rule.
Another true statement: Not very many people NEED the increased performance of synthetic oils.
On a cost/benefit question the extra cost is not warranted for normal cars. Better modern oils and "synthetic" oils that are no longer 100% pure synthetic stocks must be considered, as well.
5k mile intervals are no longer science fiction, but standard procedure. While you CAN go farther on synthetic oils between changes, for many people, doubleing their interval just winds up being 6k miles. And that's hardly a stretch.
I have used the thinnest generally available 5w-30 in my LS1 and the old 5w-40 M1 Truck & SUV, each with a UOA. The numbers were better with the thin 5w-30 than with the heavy M1. I've also used GC with the UOA. The numbers were better than the M1, and no better than the thin 5w-30. While this is only one LS1 out of hundreds of thousands, it shows that there are differences when different weights are used. Still, the difference in the UOA numbers, while decidedly different, weren't all that big. All the oils worked, none were horrible, and each did the trick. But one was a lot cheaper, easier to find, and gave numbers equivalent to GC.
As a bottom line, I would say that the key is not what weight, but how often you change it. Today, with any modern oil, 5k intervals will keep your engine running well. 3-5k if you are in a hot area or drive aggressively. Synthetic if you race or generally abuse your car. And synthetic at 3k mile intervals if you simply have money to burn
*None of this applies to strokers, turbocharged, supercharged, or otherwise heavily modified engines. Some may overlap, but is not intended to. If you have one of those, learn more if you don't already know enough. And I haven't seen many here that are there yet.
Another true statement: Not very many people NEED the increased performance of synthetic oils.
On a cost/benefit question the extra cost is not warranted for normal cars. Better modern oils and "synthetic" oils that are no longer 100% pure synthetic stocks must be considered, as well.
5k mile intervals are no longer science fiction, but standard procedure. While you CAN go farther on synthetic oils between changes, for many people, doubleing their interval just winds up being 6k miles. And that's hardly a stretch.
I have used the thinnest generally available 5w-30 in my LS1 and the old 5w-40 M1 Truck & SUV, each with a UOA. The numbers were better with the thin 5w-30 than with the heavy M1. I've also used GC with the UOA. The numbers were better than the M1, and no better than the thin 5w-30. While this is only one LS1 out of hundreds of thousands, it shows that there are differences when different weights are used. Still, the difference in the UOA numbers, while decidedly different, weren't all that big. All the oils worked, none were horrible, and each did the trick. But one was a lot cheaper, easier to find, and gave numbers equivalent to GC.
As a bottom line, I would say that the key is not what weight, but how often you change it. Today, with any modern oil, 5k intervals will keep your engine running well. 3-5k if you are in a hot area or drive aggressively. Synthetic if you race or generally abuse your car. And synthetic at 3k mile intervals if you simply have money to burn
*None of this applies to strokers, turbocharged, supercharged, or otherwise heavily modified engines. Some may overlap, but is not intended to. If you have one of those, learn more if you don't already know enough. And I haven't seen many here that are there yet.
03-31-2009, 11:43 AM
#15
True Statement: Synthetic oil is better than conventional oil, as a general rule.
Another true statement: Not very many people NEED the increased performance of synthetic oils.
On a cost/benefit question the extra cost is not warranted for normal cars. Better modern oils and "synthetic" oils that are no longer 100% pure synthetic stocks must be considered, as well.
5k mile intervals are no longer science fiction, but standard procedure. While you CAN go farther on synthetic oils between changes, for many people, doubleing their interval just winds up being 6k miles. And that's hardly a stretch.
I have used the thinnest generally available 5w-30 in my LS1 and the old 5w-40 M1 Truck & SUV, each with a UOA. The numbers were better with the thin 5w-30 than with the heavy M1. I've also used GC with the UOA. The numbers were better than the M1, and no better than the thin 5w-30. While this is only one LS1 out of hundreds of thousands, it shows that there are differences when different weights are used. Still, the difference in the UOA numbers, while decidedly different, weren't all that big. All the oils worked, none were horrible, and each did the trick. But one was a lot cheaper, easier to find, and gave numbers equivalent to GC.
As a bottom line, I would say that the key is not what weight, but how often you change it. Today, with any modern oil, 5k intervals will keep your engine running well. 3-5k if you are in a hot area or drive aggressively. Synthetic if you race or generally abuse your car. And synthetic at 3k mile intervals if you simply have money to burn
*None of this applies to strokers, turbocharged, supercharged, or otherwise heavily modified engines. Some may overlap, but is not intended to. If you have one of those, learn more if you don't already know enough. And I haven't seen many here that are there yet.
Another true statement: Not very many people NEED the increased performance of synthetic oils.
On a cost/benefit question the extra cost is not warranted for normal cars. Better modern oils and "synthetic" oils that are no longer 100% pure synthetic stocks must be considered, as well.
5k mile intervals are no longer science fiction, but standard procedure. While you CAN go farther on synthetic oils between changes, for many people, doubleing their interval just winds up being 6k miles. And that's hardly a stretch.
I have used the thinnest generally available 5w-30 in my LS1 and the old 5w-40 M1 Truck & SUV, each with a UOA. The numbers were better with the thin 5w-30 than with the heavy M1. I've also used GC with the UOA. The numbers were better than the M1, and no better than the thin 5w-30. While this is only one LS1 out of hundreds of thousands, it shows that there are differences when different weights are used. Still, the difference in the UOA numbers, while decidedly different, weren't all that big. All the oils worked, none were horrible, and each did the trick. But one was a lot cheaper, easier to find, and gave numbers equivalent to GC.
As a bottom line, I would say that the key is not what weight, but how often you change it. Today, with any modern oil, 5k intervals will keep your engine running well. 3-5k if you are in a hot area or drive aggressively. Synthetic if you race or generally abuse your car. And synthetic at 3k mile intervals if you simply have money to burn
*None of this applies to strokers, turbocharged, supercharged, or otherwise heavily modified engines. Some may overlap, but is not intended to. If you have one of those, learn more if you don't already know enough. And I haven't seen many here that are there yet.
I've been changing my oil on my cars for 20 years. And like most people here have asked about, and like almost weekly threads from people asking the question, "what are these tiny little powder-like metal shaving on my oil drain plug." It's normal wear of an engine throughout its life....metal shavings from the internals will never stop. All engines do it, wether a $200,000 Roll Royce engine or a Honda Civic or a Lincoln Town Car.
The longer those metal shavings build up between oil changes and the more time those shavings stay in the engine and keep circulating through it.....the more damage they will cause to all internal parts and the shorter the life of the engine you'll get.
Thats why the best protection anyone can possibly offer their engine....is 3,000 mile oil change intervals. No matter what oil is used. Keeping oil in the engine longer or using some special super-duper snythetic oil....will not stop an engine from shedding these tiny little metal shavings. They are still there. Why does an oil filter need to be changed, because it catches so much of this crap that it finally starts to get clogged. I don't want anything in my engine that can clog a filter.
I have a 100,000+ mile 427ci, heavily modded engine. Runs like day one when it was first installed) (not to mention every car I've ever owned with ridiculous mileage on them and zero failures). My oil pressure is 58psi on start and NEVER drops below 40, unless its really hot out and I start running hotter from having the A/C on in 95* weather in south Florida. Never replaced an oil pump or any other part internally in the engine. There's a reason its still 100% perfect, my engine gets 3,000 mile oil changes AND....my engine gets 100% flushed cleaned at every oil change before I put new oil in. Probably more important than 3,000 mile changes. **** starts to build up and stick and get gunked up in nooks and crannys throughout the engine throughout its life, as you drive these little chunks break free during driving and circulate throguh the engine again....I have NONE of that crap because I FLUSH it clean every time.
Its no coincidence every single engine I've ever owned just keeps on running and running like its new. My 427 engine is like a 4cyl Jap car, its never gonna stop.
Keep the metal shavings and toxic harmful gases out of your engine, and it will run forever. Synthetic oil will do absolutely nothing more for me. There is no way in hell I would ever let an engine of mine go past 3,000 miles without an oil change. If I owned a very expensive exotic type car, I would probably do 2,000 mile changes.
03-31-2009, 01:40 PM
#16
Here's my logic on the 5K-6K oil change intervals. Just not good IMO.
I've been changing my oil on my cars for 20 years. And like most people here have asked about, and like almost weekly threads from people asking the question, "what are these tiny little powder-like metal shaving on my oil drain plug." It's normal wear of an engine throughout its life....metal shavings from the internals will never stop. All engines do it, wether a $200,000 Roll Royce engine or a Honda Civic or a Lincoln Town Car.
The longer those metal shavings build up between oil changes and the more time those shavings stay in the engine and keep circulating through it.....the more damage they will cause to all internal parts and the shorter the life of the engine you'll get.
I've been changing my oil on my cars for 20 years. And like most people here have asked about, and like almost weekly threads from people asking the question, "what are these tiny little powder-like metal shaving on my oil drain plug." It's normal wear of an engine throughout its life....metal shavings from the internals will never stop. All engines do it, wether a $200,000 Roll Royce engine or a Honda Civic or a Lincoln Town Car.
The longer those metal shavings build up between oil changes and the more time those shavings stay in the engine and keep circulating through it.....the more damage they will cause to all internal parts and the shorter the life of the engine you'll get.
03-31-2009, 02:02 PM
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Drain plug magnets/Oil Filters > metal shavings.
Whether 3k or 10k intervals, both of those devices keep metal shavings out of the engine parts. Metal bits get flushed out and do not get back in. Kinda makes that a non-point. BTW, I've been changing my oils for over 30 years, so if your 20 is worth anything mine is worth 50% more. IMO.
You can change your oil at 3k miles. Or 2k miles. Many are doing well at 10k miles on some engines. Filters don't clog up at 3k or 5k miles, either. Unless you have a real sludge monster, filters, too, are a non-issue. You could change oil & filter every week if that's what floats your boat. The point is, you can do what you like but there is no precise, accurate, one-size-fits-all, go-past-and-die interval that is the best. 3k is sure not gonna hurt anything but your wallet, and many would gladly pay extra to not have to go learn more about oil. And they do just that.
Your choice, but 3k is not the new norm. It's the old norm. Yeah, it ain't gonna hurt anything, but it's like brushing your teeth ten times a day - there's a point where it just doesn't do any more...
And, yes, we know you have a highly modified 427 stroker that requires extra considerations. But, again, people like that are not what I'm talking about. Sludge monster engines, highly modified, extra stressed components, racing, turbo, s/c'd, etc. require different considerations. Each driver/engine/use type will require it's own oil change criteria, and some should use 3k mile intervals. But, there are many times more that just don't require it for a long-life engine. Oil works just fine, as do filters, after the oil looks like crap. Looking like crap is not a valid oil change criteria, but is one of the more popular indicators of the relentlessly **** or under-informed.
Whether 3k or 10k intervals, both of those devices keep metal shavings out of the engine parts. Metal bits get flushed out and do not get back in. Kinda makes that a non-point. BTW, I've been changing my oils for over 30 years, so if your 20 is worth anything mine is worth 50% more. IMO.
You can change your oil at 3k miles. Or 2k miles. Many are doing well at 10k miles on some engines. Filters don't clog up at 3k or 5k miles, either. Unless you have a real sludge monster, filters, too, are a non-issue. You could change oil & filter every week if that's what floats your boat. The point is, you can do what you like but there is no precise, accurate, one-size-fits-all, go-past-and-die interval that is the best. 3k is sure not gonna hurt anything but your wallet, and many would gladly pay extra to not have to go learn more about oil. And they do just that.
Your choice, but 3k is not the new norm. It's the old norm. Yeah, it ain't gonna hurt anything, but it's like brushing your teeth ten times a day - there's a point where it just doesn't do any more...
And, yes, we know you have a highly modified 427 stroker that requires extra considerations. But, again, people like that are not what I'm talking about. Sludge monster engines, highly modified, extra stressed components, racing, turbo, s/c'd, etc. require different considerations. Each driver/engine/use type will require it's own oil change criteria, and some should use 3k mile intervals. But, there are many times more that just don't require it for a long-life engine. Oil works just fine, as do filters, after the oil looks like crap. Looking like crap is not a valid oil change criteria, but is one of the more popular indicators of the relentlessly **** or under-informed.
Last edited by Mr Incredible; 03-31-2009 at 02:08 PM.
03-31-2009, 02:38 PM
#18
Drain plug magnets/Oil Filters > metal shavings.
Whether 3k or 10k intervals, both of those devices keep metal shavings out of the engine parts. Metal bits get flushed out and do not get back in. Kinda makes that a non-point. BTW, I've been changing my oils for over 30 years, so if your 20 is worth anything mine is worth 50% more. IMO.
You can change your oil at 3k miles. Or 2k miles. Many are doing well at 10k miles on some engines. Filters don't clog up at 3k or 5k miles, either. Unless you have a real sludge monster, filters, too, are a non-issue. You could change oil & filter every week if that's what floats your boat. The point is, you can do what you like but there is no precise, accurate, one-size-fits-all, go-past-and-die interval that is the best. 3k is sure not gonna hurt anything but your wallet, and many would gladly pay extra to not have to go learn more about oil. And they do just that.
Your choice, but 3k is not the new norm. It's the old norm. Yeah, it ain't gonna hurt anything, but it's like brushing your teeth ten times a day - there's a point where it just doesn't do any more...
And, yes, we know you have a highly modified 427 stroker that requires extra considerations. But, again, people like that are not what I'm talking about. Sludge monster engines, highly modified, extra stressed components, racing, turbo, s/c'd, etc. require different considerations. Each driver/engine/use type will require it's own oil change criteria, and some should use 3k mile intervals. But, there are many times more that just don't require it for a long-life engine. Oil works just fine, as do filters, after the oil looks like crap. Looking like crap is not a valid oil change criteria, but is one of the more popular indicators of the relentlessly **** or under-informed.
Whether 3k or 10k intervals, both of those devices keep metal shavings out of the engine parts. Metal bits get flushed out and do not get back in. Kinda makes that a non-point. BTW, I've been changing my oils for over 30 years, so if your 20 is worth anything mine is worth 50% more. IMO.
You can change your oil at 3k miles. Or 2k miles. Many are doing well at 10k miles on some engines. Filters don't clog up at 3k or 5k miles, either. Unless you have a real sludge monster, filters, too, are a non-issue. You could change oil & filter every week if that's what floats your boat. The point is, you can do what you like but there is no precise, accurate, one-size-fits-all, go-past-and-die interval that is the best. 3k is sure not gonna hurt anything but your wallet, and many would gladly pay extra to not have to go learn more about oil. And they do just that.
Your choice, but 3k is not the new norm. It's the old norm. Yeah, it ain't gonna hurt anything, but it's like brushing your teeth ten times a day - there's a point where it just doesn't do any more...
And, yes, we know you have a highly modified 427 stroker that requires extra considerations. But, again, people like that are not what I'm talking about. Sludge monster engines, highly modified, extra stressed components, racing, turbo, s/c'd, etc. require different considerations. Each driver/engine/use type will require it's own oil change criteria, and some should use 3k mile intervals. But, there are many times more that just don't require it for a long-life engine. Oil works just fine, as do filters, after the oil looks like crap. Looking like crap is not a valid oil change criteria, but is one of the more popular indicators of the relentlessly **** or under-informed.
Its the only difference in maintenance. They will never learn no matter how much I tell them. I think its funny when they complain at 40,000 miles of dropping oil pressure and engine noises...then a failure or a rebuild soon follows. While I'm still driving and beating the **** out of mine.
Bottom line:
One thing is for sure though, a car that gets 6,000 mile oil changes will last longer and run at its peak performance for longer....if it had 3,000 mile changes. Thats un-arguable.
There is no extra money spent, synthetic oil is rip off, so really synthetic oil users will probably spend more than me. And the engines do not and will never last as long. Its been proven too many times. So when the 6,000 mile guy needs a new engine or car....that money spending argument goes out the window, they just spent thousands extra.
But one thing I do see around here....alot of people are switching to regular oil over the years. They're finally getting it.
Last edited by LS6427; 03-31-2009 at 02:51 PM.
03-31-2009, 02:56 PM
#19
Synthetic is better for a variety reasons. One of the biggest is it flows easier when cold so it gets through your motor faster at start up. Start up is when most wear occurs. Go check out the bobistheoilguy site. He has done a ton of independant testing........
03-31-2009, 04:05 PM
#20
LS6427, you're arguing against the facts. Thats great that conventional oil works for you, but the truth of the matter is that Synthetic oil is better in every way.
Its a better lubricant, period. And everyone knows that the purpose of oil is to reduce friction and heat as much as possible. The molecules in synthetic provide a lower coefficient of friction, which means more power, better fuel economy, and most importantly less wear.
Oils have obviously changed a great deal in the time you've been changing oil. 3K oil changes are no longer the norm, and aren't necessary in most applications. Newer filter medias are much better and more efficient at filtering out contaminants, and magnetic drain plugs catch any stray metal particles. For example, Mobil 1 oil filters are 99.2% multi-pass efficient. Compare this to older, cheaper filters that are in the low 90's, which is probably what you use, based on your attiude of "good enough is fine". Things have changed for the better, there is no reason to resist it.
Ever see what happens to your claimed "good enough" conventional oil in a high performance turbocharged application?? Its a joke, because the oil cokes up and its game over. You pull the drain plug and sludge drips out. Synthetic is REQUIRED in most high performance engines for a reason, and its not only because it lasts longer.