Go Back   LS1TECH > CHASSIS, SUSPENSION, APPEARANCE > General Maintenance & Repairs
Sign in using an external account
Register Forgot Password?
Search

General Maintenance & Repairs
Leaks | Squeaks | Clunks | Rattles | Grinds
Sponsored by
Gearstar Performance Transmissions

Welcome to LS1Tech.com!
Welcome to LS1Tech.com.

You are currently viewing our forum as a guest, which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our community, at no cost, you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is free, fast and simple, join LS1Tech.com today!


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-30-2012, 05:51 PM   #1
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
bigbomber5's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: OKC
Posts: 370
Default Bad effects from MCCC?

Hey everyone
Next weekend I'm gonna take my car in to have the top end engine cleaning service done. Last week I was talking to the mechanic at the shop (very reputable) and he recommended I do the cleaning after running my car so rich for the past couple months and bc it has 114k miles. I asked if he was using MCCC and he said no, but something else but I don't remember ( not Seafoam, he laughed when I brought that up).

My question is I hear of all the great results using MCCC and similar products, but what bad effects could doing this possibly cause? I just want to know, both good and possibly bad, that may happen before I do this.

I already have new spark plugs, wires, and fuel filter that will be put on after the cleaning is done. If there is something else that needs possible changing just let me know.

Thanks and I appreciate your input!
bigbomber5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2012, 05:59 PM   #2
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: ny
Posts: 320
Default

it all depends on how dirty everything is. ive heard of people needing new injectors after. so it really depends on the caR generally if you run the car alot and put good gas in(i dont mean 93 i mean clean gas) everything should be in pretty good shape
__________________
2000 camaro, v6, auto, m90 supercharged, true duals, koni's/bmrs and misc other stuff.... low 13's. now that i can beat them im gunna join them
bwkmaro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2012, 06:08 PM   #3
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
bigbomber5's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: OKC
Posts: 370
Default

By clean gas do you mean no ethanol? Since I've personally owned the car, 8 months, I've only put in 91 with no ethanol.
I never thought of the injectors needing to be changed possibly, thanks for the insight
bigbomber5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2012, 06:13 PM   #4
TECH Senior Member
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 9,164
Default

lol......

Top end cleaning has nothing to do with the fuel injectors. It can't hurt them in any way.

bigbomber5,

A very very small number of people have had 02 sensor issues after a good MCCC cleaning. Some said they got fouled spark plugs. I have no idea how a spark plug can get fouled from a cleaning though. I have used it and dozens of people I know personally and not one person has ever had a single issue.

If you have old 02 sensors or can get some old 02 sensors.....pop them in during the cleaning as the engine just has to sit and idle. Or if your rear 02 sensors happen to be tuned out, swap them with the front ones for the cleaning. Then swap them back. Maybe even unscrew the front ones, let them hang, do the cleaning and then screw them back in. NOT SURE if that would cause any issue, I don't see why it would. But ask in the "PCM" section. If they say its ok to just sit and idle.....do that and you'll be sure nothing will happen to the 02 sensors. If you have new spark plugs to go in later....you're good there.
Fuel filter has nothing to do with a top end cleaning, you can change that any time.

If you don't have MCCC already....you might not find it. I recommend Yamaha Outboard Engine Combusion Chamber Cleaner. Find it any Yamaha Outboard dealer.

.
__________________
1998 WS6 T/A, AES 390ci fully forged iron block, LS6 intake, LS1 heads, 239/235 .600/.600 114 lsa, 1 7/8" Grot LT's, 3" w/Magnaflow, 4L60E, Strange 12 bolt, Baer brakes, Hotchkis STB, UMI PH Bar, LCA's w/relocation brackets, SFC's, LG G2 Super Springs. Hals FR, Bilsteins RR, 275/315.

427ci stroker died at 173,000 miles...what a great engine that was, built by the late, great - Dave DiLuca...RIP...
-Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well DANCE.
LS6427 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2012, 06:23 PM   #5
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
bigbomber5's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: OKC
Posts: 370
Default

Good info. I'm sorry I forgot to mention I also have new O2 sensors to swap out afterwards.
bigbomber5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-30-2012, 06:41 PM   #6
TECH Senior Member
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 9,164
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbomber5 View Post
Good info. I'm sorry I forgot to mention I also have new O2 sensors to swap out afterwards.
Then let her rip.........Yamaha stuff is badass.....

.
__________________
1998 WS6 T/A, AES 390ci fully forged iron block, LS6 intake, LS1 heads, 239/235 .600/.600 114 lsa, 1 7/8" Grot LT's, 3" w/Magnaflow, 4L60E, Strange 12 bolt, Baer brakes, Hotchkis STB, UMI PH Bar, LCA's w/relocation brackets, SFC's, LG G2 Super Springs. Hals FR, Bilsteins RR, 275/315.

427ci stroker died at 173,000 miles...what a great engine that was, built by the late, great - Dave DiLuca...RIP...
-Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well DANCE.
LS6427 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2012, 08:34 PM   #7
Save the manuals!
Garage is empty, add now
 
wssix99's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 7,038
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LS6427 View Post
Then let her rip.........Yamaha stuff is badass.....

.
I'm sure the Yamaha dealer told you that...

What evidence do you have that the Yamaha cleaner is "better" than anything else and what evidence do you have that its appropriate to put a marine product in a regular car engine?


bigbomber5 - There's a lot of goodness in doing a carbon cleaning, but there are some pitfalls related to doing this on an older engine. Some manufacturers recommend against it because the deposits it cleans may be "gumming" up seals and gaskets. If one cleans this stuff out, some say that it can cause gasket leaks.

On my car, I've rolled the dice with great results.

Here is a good thread with some quantifiable info on this stuff. Essentially, its all (Seafoam, MCC, etc.) very similar: GM Top Engine Cleaner vs. Seafoam vs. ???

In the end, the method which you use to apply the cleaner will probably do more for you than the actual product you choose.
__________________
Black 1999 Firebird Formula WS6; M6

Please DO NOT send PMs for questions that can be answered in the forums!
wssix99 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-31-2012, 11:11 PM   #8
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
SupahRich's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 14
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: High Point, NC
Posts: 335
Send a message via ICQ to SupahRich Send a message via AIM to SupahRich
Default

I have yet to use MCCC, I usually find SeaFoam on sale at Advance when I just happen to want to use it . I've had nothing but great results from using it... ran it through my '99 T/A, '94Z, the '98 T/A I currently own and my '02 JGC Overland. Can't tell you if it's a placebo effect or not, but it seems like the motor runs better after a good treatment. My '98 has nearly 250K miles on it and smoked like a diesel about to blow when I treated it 2 years ago. I'd just purchased the car and was going to change the plugs/wires anyway so I figured I may as well run some SeaFoam through it.

The stuff has bound to work decent... as I mentioned above, the car smoked like crazy the first few brief WOT runs after letting it set. The car actually disappeared in a cloud of dark gray smoke with the first hard blip of the throttle lol. Guess that means a lot of carbon was dislodged some how or another, the car still runs just a smooth 2 years later.
__________________

'98 T/A - MTI Lid, TSP Rumbler, Smoothie Q, B&M Ripper, 6LE Front Diffuser, Machined Face C6 Z06's, CETA, Corsa Clones, McNord Overlay, HID's, 5th Gen Brembos

Awaiting Install: BHP Built 347, Full Chromoly Front Suspension, Ported FAST 95/95, N2O Outlet Direct Port, Monster Stg 3
SupahRich is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2012, 03:52 PM   #9
TECH Fanatic
Garage is empty, add now
 
great421's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 1
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,156
Default My $0.02 (WARNING: Anecdotal evidence only)

My step-father (a GM, ASE certified Master Mechanic) told me GMís Top Engine Cleaner and Chryslerís MCCC both work quite well, much better than Sea-Foam; and if you let the stuff penetrate overnight (vs. 5 to 15 minutes like the can states) the results improve even more.

So, my wifeís car had a hot / hard-starting issue which had not been resolved using Sea-Foam (which soaked overnight), but it was resolved using MCCC.

One could possibly argue that the S/F treatment provided the primary cleaning, and then the MCCC (a week later) finished the job, so take my story for what itís worth, anecdotal evidence only.
__________________
1996 Green Firebird

383 LT1 to go with the following - M6 LT4 Clutch Mikronited 3.73s Full UMI Rear Suspension 2002 Speedlines a Hybrid Meth kit and an STS kit pushing (only) 11 lbs of boost!
great421 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2012, 06:14 PM   #10
Save the manuals!
Garage is empty, add now
 
wssix99's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 7,038
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by great421 View Post
My step-father (a GM, ASE certified Master Mechanic) told me GMís Top Engine Cleaner and Chryslerís MCCC both work quite well, much better than Sea-Foam; and if you let the stuff penetrate overnight (vs. 5 to 15 minutes like the can states) the results improve even more.

So, my wifeís car had a hot / hard-starting issue which had not been resolved using Sea-Foam (which soaked overnight), but it was resolved using MCCC.

One could possibly argue that the S/F treatment provided the primary cleaning, and then the MCCC (a week later) finished the job, so take my story for what itís worth, anecdotal evidence only.
The chemicals in all of them are very similar. The key difference is delivery. TEC and MCCC are both delivered at the top end in a concentrated manner, right where they are needed. Seafoam delivered at the tank. By the time it gets to the top end, it has been dilluted and some of it has reacted with deposits in the tank/lines, reducing its concentration even more.
__________________
Black 1999 Firebird Formula WS6; M6

Please DO NOT send PMs for questions that can be answered in the forums!
wssix99 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2012, 08:10 PM   #11
TECH Senior Member
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 9,164
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wssix99 View Post
I'm sure the Yamaha dealer told you that...

What evidence do you have that the Yamaha cleaner is "better" than anything else and what evidence do you have that its appropriate to put a marine product in a regular car engine?
Never talked to a Yamaha employee.....I know 3 people who have bought it and tried it, 1 friend did it with me there.

Its exactly like MCCC and just as good.

Next time ask how I know........don't guess. Just beleiveing what some jackass at a parts store says about THEIR product......is stupid. Don't do that.

.
__________________
1998 WS6 T/A, AES 390ci fully forged iron block, LS6 intake, LS1 heads, 239/235 .600/.600 114 lsa, 1 7/8" Grot LT's, 3" w/Magnaflow, 4L60E, Strange 12 bolt, Baer brakes, Hotchkis STB, UMI PH Bar, LCA's w/relocation brackets, SFC's, LG G2 Super Springs. Hals FR, Bilsteins RR, 275/315.

427ci stroker died at 173,000 miles...what a great engine that was, built by the late, great - Dave DiLuca...RIP...
-Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well DANCE.
LS6427 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-01-2012, 08:12 PM   #12
TECH Senior Member
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 2
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Florida
Posts: 9,164
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SupahRich View Post
I have yet to use MCCC, I usually find SeaFoam on sale at Advance when I just happen to want to use it . I've had nothing but great results from using it... ran it through my '99 T/A, '94Z, the '98 T/A I currently own and my '02 JGC Overland. Can't tell you if it's a placebo effect or not, but it seems like the motor runs better after a good treatment. My '98 has nearly 250K miles on it and smoked like a diesel about to blow when I treated it 2 years ago. I'd just purchased the car and was going to change the plugs/wires anyway so I figured I may as well run some SeaFoam through it.

The stuff has bound to work decent... as I mentioned above, the car smoked like crazy the first few brief WOT runs after letting it set. The car actually disappeared in a cloud of dark gray smoke with the first hard blip of the throttle lol. Guess that means a lot of carbon was dislodged some how or another, the car still runs just a smooth 2 years later.
1) You did nothing to the front 6 cylinders, NOTHING.
2) The smoke people get from using SeaFoam to clean the top end if from all the SeaFoam that pools inside the intake.
3) Placebo....is that the engine runs so much better....it doesn't.

.
__________________
1998 WS6 T/A, AES 390ci fully forged iron block, LS6 intake, LS1 heads, 239/235 .600/.600 114 lsa, 1 7/8" Grot LT's, 3" w/Magnaflow, 4L60E, Strange 12 bolt, Baer brakes, Hotchkis STB, UMI PH Bar, LCA's w/relocation brackets, SFC's, LG G2 Super Springs. Hals FR, Bilsteins RR, 275/315.

427ci stroker died at 173,000 miles...what a great engine that was, built by the late, great - Dave DiLuca...RIP...
-Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well DANCE.
LS6427 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2012, 11:35 AM   #13
Save the manuals!
Garage is empty, add now
 
wssix99's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 5
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 7,038
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LS6427 View Post
I know 3 people who have bought it and tried it, 1 friend did it with me there.

Its exactly like MCCC and just as good.
That's the thing, its really hard to quantity people's or friends' testimonials. I know three people who bought shake weights and swear by them, but... I don't think I'll be purchasing one.

Do you have an MSDS for the Yamaha cleaner? (I looked and it seems that they are only provided by dealers and aren't available online.) The MSDS will give the actual chemistry for the product and can allow parallels to be drawn to MCCC, TEC, and Seafoam.
__________________
Black 1999 Firebird Formula WS6; M6

Please DO NOT send PMs for questions that can be answered in the forums!
wssix99 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2012, 12:34 PM   #14
TECH Apprentice
Garage is empty, add now
 
bigbomber5's Avatar
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: OKC
Posts: 370
Default

Thanks for all the input guys!

I didnt think of this before, but should I change my oil after doing this? I would hate to have to change out a 600 mile batch of Mobile1...
bigbomber5 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2012, 08:45 PM   #15
Registered User
Garage is empty, add now
 
Trader Rating: 0
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbomber5 View Post
Thanks for all the input guys!

I didnt think of this before, but should I change my oil after doing this? I would hate to have to change out a 600 mile batch of Mobile1...
Before you contaminate your fresh oil, if you are doing this because the car is running rich, have you checked that the computer is getting the proper signal from the engine coolant temperature sensor as to when it reaches running temp and it can stop enrichening the Air/Fuel mixture? That is an easy thing to check with a meter, and cleaning up the contacts isn't usually so hard either.

I use Seafoam all the time and do a half hour soak to clean o2 sensors with it. It is also a great thing to soak connector ends in to clean up corrosion, a quick dab of diaelectric grease on the connector will keep furhter corrosion away too.

p.s. After doing piston soaks (for sticking rings) with Seafoam and MCCC, I would say MCCC seems way stronger.

hth
Steve
oldpitpony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-15-2012, 08:45 PM
LS1Tech
Pontiac Firebird




Paid Advertisement
Reply

Tags
add, car, cleaner, engine, fuel, hard, hurt, injectors, leak, mccc, seafoam, starting, tank, treatment, wifes, z06


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Advertising - Terms of Service - Privacy Statement - JOBS
Emails & Contact Details