rademan11

I've searched every key word combination I can think of and no luck.
So here is what I've got........

2001 Camaro SS, 70,000 miles, Auto
I've owned it 8 week, driven it probably 6 times (only 1 speeding ticket).
I've probably tried to start it a dozen time due to starter problem.
It only seems to do it after the car has sat, 24 hours/4 days, no problems that day once car starts.
Turn the key and nothing.
All lights work, everything has power but not a sound out of the starter.
This will happen one, two maybe three times then it fires off like no problem.
I tried both keys, same result.
Security light stays on solid until car does start then it goes out.
I'm under the impression it would blink if it was a "key/security issue".

I took car to my regular mechanic (I'm 50, rather pay than fight fixing it myself).
Good guy, knowledgeable but not an expert on Camaros.
He has told me that there is no power to the starter when it acts up.
He is testing the car more often than I was, he tells me it will start on second try every time.
He has also told me that if he holds the key in the start position when it is trouble some, it will turn over/start after holding the key in start for 15/20 seconds.

The starter relay was replaced.

Is there a fuse after the ignition key and before the starter?
He told me the following but I could have it wrong so unless it make sense, dismiss it as incorrect.
I believe the mechanic told me when the starter will not turn, there is no power at the fuse, 15 amp fuse?
Again, I could have this part all wrong about the fuse.
I apologize.

Any help appreciated.
Thanks
David

rademan11

Any body have any ideas?
I know other people have this problem.
Has no one fixed it?
Thanks

mich2112

iTrader: (9)

Did you ever figure this out. I have the same issue. Replaced the battery, cleaned the terminals, replaced the starter. I found it had a anti-theft device spliced into the 10 gauge yellow wire that is under the dash going to the ignition switch. Removed that POS and spliced the wires back together. Also pulled the starter relay and one of the spades was black/tarnished. Cleaned that and reinstalled and still have the problem. Next step for me is new starter relay, then the last chance is the ignition switch on top of the column. I have been avoiding that due to having to drop/remove the column to properly access. After that if it still exists I am out of ideas.

peterpar

Here's a post that may help you determine if you have a VATS problem. Go to reply #10 and download the pdf showing the layout of the starter relay socket. Follow the instructions checking for power at the relay. If you have no voltage between the dark green and Yel/Blk wires, there is no ground path through the BCM because the keys resistor value was not read.

jaycoy65

iTrader: (5)

Yes it was the ignition cylinder

mich2112

iTrader: (9)

One difference between his situation and mine. My security light goes out like normal.

I did the pin 30 voltage check and got 11.78 volts, did the pin 85 and got the same delayed reaction for voltage I get when I try to start it normally. After sitting it takes a second or two to kick in, then subsequently it starts right up until it sits overnight or longer.

Turing it back to off, then back on it reacts almost immediately.

At this point I don't see any other cause than the switch on the column...not what I wanted to find.....

Only 50k miles, but 16 years old.

Would you concur with my diagnosis? Like I said I have a new starter, new battery, clean battery terminals and the security light does not stay on or flash. It the same every time like a connection warms up and makes proper contact, but after cooling down it goes back to delay start.

peterpar

When you checked for voltage at pin 85 (dark green wire), did you check between pin 86 (yel/blk wire) or a chassis ground? Reading voltage between pins 85 and 86 should confirm the ignition switch is reading the resistance of key and allowing the BCM to energize the coil of the starter relay when the key is turned to the start position. Also, when you checked for voltage, had the car been sitting for a period of time or had it been running recently?

mich2112

iTrader: (9)

No I wanted it to be sitting so the delayed starting condition would happen. Strange thing was when the switch was off I got 0 volts to ground from pin 85, but when turned to "on" it registered slight voltage (according to my wife - assistant). Then turned to start and it took a few seconds to go to 11 volts. Turned back to off and back to start and it registered voltage quickly. Same condition I get normally.....first turn is delayed, subsequent works. I did not check 86. So I should get voltage between 85 and 86 when the key is turned to start....correct? Could the delayed voltage on 85 still be caused by the chip or the chip reader in the ignition cylinder?

I really appreciate you taking the time to help!

Thanks, Mike Jones

peterpar

You should have voltage between pins 85 and 86 when the ignition switch in the start position. This should verify the key chip is recognized and allowing a ground path through the BCM to the starter relay coil and that the contacts of the ignition switch is allowing a 12 volt power source to the other side of the relay coil which will energize the coil, closing the relay contact to energize the starter solenoid. The chip contacts are in the key switch on the column, the ignition switch is located at the base of the steering column and operated by a rod from the key switch. The fact that voltage is not instantaneous at the relay when the ignition is in the start position may be indications of a poor contact in the switch at the column base. You might want to check that the switch at the column base is properly secured and not able to physically move when the rod from the key switch is activated. If the switch is loose, this may help explain the voltage reading in the on position and the delay in the start position.

peterpar

Out of curiosity, can you identify what number the black/tarnished relay post was? Also did you replace the relay?

mich2112

iTrader: (9)

I believe it was 87.

I have a new relay on the way (AC Delco).

I also ordered a new switch just in case so I don't have to wait for parts. I am going to order a PT289 harness as well.

Really not looking forward to dropping/removing the column for that stupid switch.

I have a feeling that I'm going to find a melted connector (the blue one)...if the starter relay doesn't work.

I also ordered the correct resistor to by-pass the key reader just to take that out of the picture as well.

So many variables involved with the car starting....

I just saw the last sentence you added about a loose switch...very good point...I will check that as well.

nflow

Any update on whether or not this problem was solved?

HorsePower Junkie

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