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Old 06-24-2009, 11:20 PM   #1
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Default CA Carb Legal "Long Tube" Headers?

i was not aware that anyone made CA smog legal tube headers until i stumbled across this while searching the air resource boards database for ls1 products. when i did a search on the edelbrock website it seems like the whole "TES" line up is just shortys.

here it is:
http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-215-42.pdf

weird.
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Old 06-24-2009, 11:34 PM   #2
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I think california refers to anything that is not a cast manifold as a "long tube" header. There are a few shorties and one or two mids that are floating around carb legal.
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Old 06-25-2009, 12:34 AM   #3
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yeah those arent LTs. they are just shorties with a ypipe
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Old 06-25-2009, 01:12 AM   #4
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i'm not sure why everybody thinks you need a Y-pipe to pass smog . . . if you don't move the cats from the original position you're all good!!!!! i have 3" true duals and my manifolds and cats, just passed smog visual and tailpipe but yes that letter refers to shorty headers
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Old 06-25-2009, 01:14 AM   #5
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well for us LT1 guys our cats are in the y pipe. so we're f****d
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:12 AM   #6
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i'm not sure why everybody thinks you need a Y-pipe to pass smog . . . if you don't move the cats from the original position you're all good!!!!! i have 3" true duals and my manifolds and cats, just passed smog visual and tailpipe but yes that letter refers to shorty headers
F-body up to 2000 had y-pipe cats. In 2000 they switched to the ones that come right off the manifold. You can probably get away with putting the 00+ cats on a 98 or 99 car, but LT1s get screwed either way.
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:33 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rai View Post
i was not aware that anyone made CA smog legal tube headers until i stumbled across this while searching the air resource boards database for ls1 products. when i did a search on the edelbrock website it seems like the whole "TES" line up is just shortys.

here it is:
http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/de...o/D-215-42.pdf

weird.
I tried to find a set of Long Tube headers for CA, they don't exist in smog legal form, only tube shorties are avail from what I found. And I was told they weren't worth the trouble for the lack of gain you get.
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:42 AM   #8
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So basically for us guys in Cali it not worth putting headers on our cars? What if I put LT on anyway? I wonder if the police would try to look under the car?
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Old 06-25-2009, 11:50 AM   #9
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F-body up to 2000 had y-pipe cats. In 2000 they switched to the ones that come right off the manifold. You can probably get away with putting the 00+ cats on a 98 or 99 car, but LT1s get screwed either way.
yep you can smog it as a 00-02 if you pull the equipment from a 00-02 and say your engine went bye bye and you wanted to upgrade to the engine and smog equipment from a 00-02, 92 can even drop in a 02 LS1 engine and smog equipment and be totally legal as long as they let the ref know about it
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Old 06-25-2009, 01:37 PM   #10
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"So basically for us guys in Cali it not worth putting headers on our cars?"

I disagree. I think a well constructed set of short tube headers would be well worth the effort. I have a 3rd gen but my car is doing very well with smog legal short tube headers. Should be in the 11's shortly. Almost there now.
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Old 06-25-2009, 03:21 PM   #11
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"So basically for us guys in Cali it not worth putting headers on our cars?"

I disagree. I think a well constructed set of short tube headers would be well worth the effort. I have a 3rd gen but my car is doing very well with smog legal short tube headers. Should be in the 11's shortly. Almost there now.
shorties will work but they wont get you the power LT's will and to most people on here they say it's a wast of money yet they'll go spend $1200 on the FAST manifold and TB

what are the mods on your car?
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Old 06-25-2009, 04:16 PM   #12
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Shorties may be a "waste" on a stock motor, but that doesn't mean they're worthless. Shorties scavenge higher in the RPM range than longtubes. That's why longtubes show much better gains - they don't flow any better than shorties but they scavenge much lower in the RPM range, showing larger gains much sooner. Shorties become advantageous if the motor is turning higher RPM's or needs more flow than manifolds can give. If you have heads and a cam and are spinning at 6800+ rpm's, shorties can show gains. Same thing in supercharged applications. I wouldn't bother on a stock motor to put shorties, but when engine mods are increased and you need more flow and turn higher RPM's, shorties can give you significant gains over stock manifolds. It's all about what your future plans are.
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Old 06-25-2009, 05:22 PM   #13
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but CA it's harder than anywhere to run LT's and not worry about a fine from the state ref
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Old 06-25-2009, 06:31 PM   #14
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Quote:
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but CA it's harder than anywhere to run LT's and not worry about a fine from the state ref
Yep, you hit the nail right on the button!
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Old 06-25-2009, 07:02 PM   #15
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Quote:
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but CA it's harder than anywhere to run LT's and not worry about a fine from the state ref
Longtube headers are illegal in every state. Any set of headers that movies the catalytic converters is illegal. California is just the only state that explicitly looks for them. If CAFE laws are nationalized, which is what Nobama wants to do, then every state will have to deal with CA's stringent inspection requirements. If Nobama has his way, everyone will be putting their stock manifolds back on and ripping out any cam bigger than a TR224. Keep an eye out guys, the end of the muscle car era is dawning.
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Old 06-25-2009, 08:31 PM   #16
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Longtube headers are illegal in every state. Any set of headers that movies the catalytic converters is illegal. California is just the only state that explicitly looks for them. If CAFE laws are nationalized, which is what Nobama wants to do, then every state will have to deal with CA's stringent inspection requirements. If Nobama has his way, everyone will be putting their stock manifolds back on and ripping out any cam bigger than a TR224. Keep an eye out guys, the end of the muscle car era is dawning.
yep i was gonna say that lol
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Old 06-25-2009, 09:08 PM   #17
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Did someone get busted recently...? If you did, can you say what happened...?
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Old 06-30-2009, 10:26 PM   #18
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I'm bringing my long tubed, cammed, nitroused, polluting SOB car back to Cali in January. It's worth it to pay a little extra every so often for smog. Does it suck??? Hell yes! Or... I've thought about forging my motor and installing a Pro Charger, but that's a lot of money. It's more fun to be illegal.
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Old 07-02-2009, 02:46 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChocoTaco369 View Post
Longtube headers are illegal in every state. Any set of headers that movies the catalytic converters is illegal. California is just the only state that explicitly looks for them. If CAFE laws are nationalized, which is what Nobama wants to do, then every state will have to deal with CA's stringent inspection requirements. If Nobama has his way, everyone will be putting their stock manifolds back on and ripping out any cam bigger than a TR224. Keep an eye out guys, the end of the muscle car era is dawning.
just because there may be gov't regulation doesn't mean you can't get around it......
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Old 07-02-2009, 03:57 PM   #20
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Yes.. and just cause you can get around it, doesn't mean you will not get fined for removing or modifying FED Regulated Emission equipment.

Due to the fact that the Cat must be at the required distance from the engine port, there will never be a Full LT header. The Best you can do and be legal is a Short that pertty much bolts to the factory location and equipment.

The Fed requlations overrides any and all state laws and regulations. Just cause the state laws and regulation dose not explicitly state it, doesn't mean you can do something to get around it.

This also goes for the SMOG test, just cause they don't test or look for it, doesn't mean you can do away or modify it per the Fed Laws.

Just my 2cents...
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Old 07-02-2009, 03:57 PM
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