harmonic balancer install: Can it be done after timing cover and w.p. are torqued on?
#1
On The Tree
Thread Starter
harmonic balancer install: Can it be done after timing cover and w.p. are torqued on?
final stages of my cam install and oops I got out of order using Ls1howto printed off in three packets. Problem: I have my front cover and water pump already torqued on (and probably over did the rtv on the front cover on whole thing). I now read the cam install packet and don't you know it reads hand tighten the F.C. and use the longer bolt to pull harmonic balancer to align the F.C. before final TQ of the F.C.
Simple question: Can I reinstall the harmonic balancer after front cover has been installed?
The only issue I see coming is a poor seal if I push on further. However if I backtrack then probable leaky water pump and Front cover as all that rtv will probably pose an issue.
p.s. I know the longer bolt reinstall is not recommended, thats just the way it is.
Simple question: Can I reinstall the harmonic balancer after front cover has been installed?
The only issue I see coming is a poor seal if I push on further. However if I backtrack then probable leaky water pump and Front cover as all that rtv will probably pose an issue.
p.s. I know the longer bolt reinstall is not recommended, thats just the way it is.
#2
TECH Addict
iTrader: (88)
Hope you didn't use too much rtv, you don't want it to goop and drip inside the engine cuz it can break off and clog crap up..
With that being said you can get a measuring tape and make sure that the crank snout is centered in the front cover hole left to right.. I've done it a couple times this way..
But honestly I would pull it off and check and make sure you didn't get rtv inside and buy a new gasket and do it the right way..
And don't use the bolt method, not worth it if you strip the threads in the crank and then you are at a standstill with the build..
With that being said you can get a measuring tape and make sure that the crank snout is centered in the front cover hole left to right.. I've done it a couple times this way..
But honestly I would pull it off and check and make sure you didn't get rtv inside and buy a new gasket and do it the right way..
And don't use the bolt method, not worth it if you strip the threads in the crank and then you are at a standstill with the build..
#3
That's MISTER MODERATOR
iTrader: (9)
The easiest way to align the timing cover with the oil pan is with the timing cover hung loosely on like four bolts, fully install the damper then evenly tighten both sides of the oil pan. Then tighten the timing cover bolts. The only RTV you might need is just a thin schemer where the timing cover meets the oil pan.
You'll need to loosen the cover & pan. And no, don't use a bolt for the damper. Do you wanna be that one in five that effs up his crank?
You'll need to loosen the cover & pan. And no, don't use a bolt for the damper. Do you wanna be that one in five that effs up his crank?
#4
On The Tree
Thread Starter
sigh, car has become a money pit. reby parts and one time use tools..
-sloppy mechanics makes it look so easy and fun. the opposite of this laborious stressful job of diy hotrodding has become. /rant
thanks for the tip on measuring, completely did not consider it being that easy possibly. crosses fingers, btw I find it hard to believe a front cover could be misaligned when the oil pan and ~10 bolts around it are tightened. I will find out soon enough.
-sloppy mechanics makes it look so easy and fun. the opposite of this laborious stressful job of diy hotrodding has become. /rant
thanks for the tip on measuring, completely did not consider it being that easy possibly. crosses fingers, btw I find it hard to believe a front cover could be misaligned when the oil pan and ~10 bolts around it are tightened. I will find out soon enough.
#5
TECH Addict
iTrader: (88)
sigh, car has become a money pit. reby parts and one time use tools..
-sloppy mechanics makes it look so easy and fun. the opposite of this laborious stressful job of diy hotrodding has become. /rant
thanks for the tip on measuring, completely did not consider it being that easy possibly. crosses fingers, btw I find it hard to believe a front cover could be misaligned when the oil pan and ~10 bolts around it are tightened. I will find out soon enough.
-sloppy mechanics makes it look so easy and fun. the opposite of this laborious stressful job of diy hotrodding has become. /rant
thanks for the tip on measuring, completely did not consider it being that easy possibly. crosses fingers, btw I find it hard to believe a front cover could be misaligned when the oil pan and ~10 bolts around it are tightened. I will find out soon enough.
You should be fine, but if you have a leak you can re adjust quickly..
At least you've learned and will know next time if you plan to remove it again..
#6
On The Tree
Thread Starter
i measured it with cheap calipers i found at home. Its hard to get in there right but looks like its offset by no more than .10 of a inch, im pretty satisfied. however i clearly didnt think the install through and forgot washers, put the long bolt thru tightened it till it stopped. and then i was shocked when the balancer fell off as i tugged it to check it was started..hehe learning curve
perhaps one of you has a used installer for sale?
perhaps one of you has a used installer for sale?
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#10
On The Tree
Thread Starter
you said so. I Stripped the first crank threads. Lesson to pass to others is do not use a thrust bearing with the stock bolt. The crank snout is not threaded all the way and loosing the extra 1/2in of threads is what does it. I am confident without any extra washers/bearing this would not have happened.
for those curious how it happened:
I rented a harmonic balancer from advance auto. the rental has a long threaded main shaft which accepts small thread adapters. The adapter is too short to reach any crank threads.
Instead I used a longer bolt + thrust bearing and got the harmonic balancer on. And with only 1/4" left to be flush with crank I switched out he thrust bearing for stacked washers. The washers bent out of shape before pulling the balancer on any notable distance. Time to switch my friends breaker bar, It only goes to 150ftlbs. Using this set to 140ftlbs +old balancer bolt thrust bearing (for safety I thought to myself) I reached 140ftlbs without issue. Only problem I had was I was driving the car up my wheel chocks by hand in first gear, chose to put it into 6th.
The damage happened in an instant without warning. Back to breaker bar + stock balancer bolt + thrust washer I got ~120 degrees more pull and with a loud snap the breaker fell off. I thought just the extension I was using snapped but the bolt came out without resistance still holding ~4 threads in it from the crank snout. Again using hand tools, without any warning slips/noises. Learn from your mistakes.
for those curious how it happened:
I rented a harmonic balancer from advance auto. the rental has a long threaded main shaft which accepts small thread adapters. The adapter is too short to reach any crank threads.
Instead I used a longer bolt + thrust bearing and got the harmonic balancer on. And with only 1/4" left to be flush with crank I switched out he thrust bearing for stacked washers. The washers bent out of shape before pulling the balancer on any notable distance. Time to switch my friends breaker bar, It only goes to 150ftlbs. Using this set to 140ftlbs +old balancer bolt thrust bearing (for safety I thought to myself) I reached 140ftlbs without issue. Only problem I had was I was driving the car up my wheel chocks by hand in first gear, chose to put it into 6th.
The damage happened in an instant without warning. Back to breaker bar + stock balancer bolt + thrust washer I got ~120 degrees more pull and with a loud snap the breaker fell off. I thought just the extension I was using snapped but the bolt came out without resistance still holding ~4 threads in it from the crank snout. Again using hand tools, without any warning slips/noises. Learn from your mistakes.
#11
Staging Lane
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What is the fix for pulling threads out of the crank? Do you have to replace the crankshaft?
I am on my first LS build and I know where you are coming from on tools. I have purchased quite a few, one of which was the Hawk harmonic balancer installer which has so far proven very useful. Colorado Speed was the only place I saw selling it and I want to say i saw that they have a special on this site.
I am on my first LS build and I know where you are coming from on tools. I have purchased quite a few, one of which was the Hawk harmonic balancer installer which has so far proven very useful. Colorado Speed was the only place I saw selling it and I want to say i saw that they have a special on this site.
#12
On The Tree
Thread Starter
I have purchased pn mahw'14220 its listed as a gen3 ls XL harmonic ballancer bolt from techstar massive inc.. It is not TTY and said to be 10mm longer. I stripped out 4 threads myself and the 10mm is said to reach further essentially giving the destroyed threads back. My two bolts still thread in fine so it was a clean break away.
I went this route as I am not comfortable taking a drill to retap the crank for a helicoil. its personal preference if you want to "do it right" then drill/helicoil; for me with the engine still in the car its too big a risk to run astray and cause more damage.
p.s. I figure if this does not work I can always helicoil after and still use this stronger bolt. It is a nice piece of kit just received today
I went this route as I am not comfortable taking a drill to retap the crank for a helicoil. its personal preference if you want to "do it right" then drill/helicoil; for me with the engine still in the car its too big a risk to run astray and cause more damage.
p.s. I figure if this does not work I can always helicoil after and still use this stronger bolt. It is a nice piece of kit just received today