headers and A.I.R. system removal question
12-07-2007, 11:13 PM
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headers and A.I.R. system removal question from what i've been reading, it seems like tha A.I.R. system is pretty useless. i want to remove the A.I.R. system out of my car, but still be environmentally friendly (if thats even possible??) i have a few questions if anyone can pls help.
1.would it be pointless to get Race LT headers but still get a catted Y?
i hate that stinky exhaust smell! but after i get headers, i plan to get a tune to tune out the SES light for the AIR system and rear 02's but i still want to run catts.
is that possible and or pointless?
2.after the tune, will my SES light come on because the 02 sensors and the catts aren't warmed up fast enough due to the A.I.R. system removed?
3.will i lose any MPG?
what if i got LT's, a catted Y and removed my Slowmaster muffler. so just straight pipes split into 2 after the y pipe.
4.would i gain any performance in doing that? - also, how loud will that be? hopefully someone has a similar set up and can give some input
1.would it be pointless to get Race LT headers but still get a catted Y?
i hate that stinky exhaust smell! but after i get headers, i plan to get a tune to tune out the SES light for the AIR system and rear 02's but i still want to run catts.
is that possible and or pointless?
2.after the tune, will my SES light come on because the 02 sensors and the catts aren't warmed up fast enough due to the A.I.R. system removed?
3.will i lose any MPG?
what if i got LT's, a catted Y and removed my Slowmaster muffler. so just straight pipes split into 2 after the y pipe.
4.would i gain any performance in doing that? - also, how loud will that be? hopefully someone has a similar set up and can give some input
Last edited by VtecDis; 12-07-2007 at 11:20 PM.
12-07-2007, 11:25 PM
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IMO the A.I.R. system is useless. Running a off road Y-pipe or catted is just personal opinion. After you get the car tuned for only having the single O2's and no A.I.R. system your SES light should not come back on. I have had my long tubes on the car for about 3 months now and they are also the race style and have not had the SES light come back on after tuning the car.
12-08-2007, 12:21 PM
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If you get it tuned you should not be getting an SES light. I did not notice any drop in mpg. I dont know how loud it would be without the muffler because I have a magnaflow. How can you get away with removing AIR in cali? Im worried I removed my stuff and Im in PA.
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12-08-2007, 06:20 PM
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its all about who u know buddy
lol, no seriously, i COULD tell them its for racing and i still need to get it registered...? besides, from what my friends tell me...all the details like check engine light and the visual passing, and other emission systems in our cars shouldnt matter as long as i pass the sniffer---EDIT---but that also depends on the shop thats testing you.
obviously? lol
is that a serious question?
Last edited by VtecDis; 12-08-2007 at 08:58 PM.
12-09-2007, 01:35 AM
#9
sorry I meant USE, because they do an extensive test and make sure you are in compliance. But if its who you know then it doesn't matter.
Forget the cats, and the AIR(you'll loose about 20Lbs in the front of the car) and it will look better under the hood too.
Forget the cats, and the AIR(you'll loose about 20Lbs in the front of the car) and it will look better under the hood too.
12-09-2007, 10:36 PM
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20 lbs? wow that much?! i actually still want to keep the cats because i dont like that stank exhaust smell. i remember it wasnt as bad before i gutted my cats
12-10-2007, 12:49 AM
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Any shop that does a ca inspection properly will fail your visual reguardess of the 240 sniffer. The AIR system is pointless to remove in my opinion because your horsepower loss is is under one hp and actually so far to the right after the decimal that it is just rediculous, not to mention removal of the air system will render your cats nearly useless since they are directly interconnected systems.
12-10-2007, 01:18 AM
#12
Any shop that does a ca inspection properly will fail your visual reguardess of the 240 sniffer. The AIR system is pointless to remove in my opinion because your horsepower loss is is under one hp and actually so far to the right after the decimal that it is just rediculous, not to mention removal of the air system will render your cats nearly useless since they are directly interconnected systems.
12-10-2007, 01:34 AM
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lol.
i think what he meant to ask was can you RUN them in cali... and of course, the answer woudl no, you wouldnt pass instpection with them.
but... there's always a way around that.
isn't cali's law the cat's have to bein the factory location or some dumb ****?
ne ways to answer your question, sure you can remove the AIR system and run cats.
but... if you run cats, and thre obII compliant, there's no reason to tune out your rear o2's ... they wouldnt get tripped, unless your cats were faulty, or you want to run cutouts b4 the cats.
as far as whoever mentioned that teh hp gains from removing the AIR setup nets you nothing.. don't forget the weight loss, from teh most crutial area, the front of the car. i mean cmon people relocate there battery from the front of the car to the back of the car... every little bit helps... plus as previously mentioned it defintily cleans up the clutter in the engine bay...
you will not get an SES light for removing teh Air if you have it tuned out.
as far as mpg go, alot of people experience there car running rich after a header intall, which could hurt mpg, but everyone differs, and its not goign to be dramatic... esp if you get a tune.
... what you said about having your muffler removed and just running pipes from your cats... i think that would be a little much, but that all differs, it would be close to a setup with Long tubes + catted y + slp loudmouth 1... if you can find some sound clips you may get an idea of that.
for point 4.. the "performance gain" are you referring to adding LT's and catts's? or the difference between an ORY and a Catted y... i think most people say, as an ave, the cats eat up like 3-4 rwhp, but dont quote me, and of course that woudl depend on your power level and mods.
i think what he meant to ask was can you RUN them in cali... and of course, the answer woudl no, you wouldnt pass instpection with them.
but... there's always a way around that.
isn't cali's law the cat's have to bein the factory location or some dumb ****?
ne ways to answer your question, sure you can remove the AIR system and run cats.
but... if you run cats, and thre obII compliant, there's no reason to tune out your rear o2's ... they wouldnt get tripped, unless your cats were faulty, or you want to run cutouts b4 the cats.
as far as whoever mentioned that teh hp gains from removing the AIR setup nets you nothing.. don't forget the weight loss, from teh most crutial area, the front of the car. i mean cmon people relocate there battery from the front of the car to the back of the car... every little bit helps... plus as previously mentioned it defintily cleans up the clutter in the engine bay...
you will not get an SES light for removing teh Air if you have it tuned out.
as far as mpg go, alot of people experience there car running rich after a header intall, which could hurt mpg, but everyone differs, and its not goign to be dramatic... esp if you get a tune.
... what you said about having your muffler removed and just running pipes from your cats... i think that would be a little much, but that all differs, it would be close to a setup with Long tubes + catted y + slp loudmouth 1... if you can find some sound clips you may get an idea of that.
for point 4.. the "performance gain" are you referring to adding LT's and catts's? or the difference between an ORY and a Catted y... i think most people say, as an ave, the cats eat up like 3-4 rwhp, but dont quote me, and of course that woudl depend on your power level and mods.
Last edited by 98_Formula; 12-10-2007 at 01:42 AM.
12-10-2007, 11:08 AM
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If I lived in CA I would NOT remove it. Your not alwasy going to be able to con someone into passing your car, and contrary to what many on this board think, these inspectops DO know what they are looking at and what your LS1 Camaro should look like under the hood. Aside from removing a few hoses from the engine compartment it does nothing for you. The hoses weight almost nothing and the pump is maybe 5 lbs.
Moving the cats farther back in your y pipe won't hurt the efficiency too bad. (most trucks have their cas farther back than that) They will take a little longer to come up to temp, this is another reason to keep the AIR system.
Re'
Moving the cats farther back in your y pipe won't hurt the efficiency too bad. (most trucks have their cas farther back than that) They will take a little longer to come up to temp, this is another reason to keep the AIR system.
Re'
12-10-2007, 12:51 PM
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A lot of people have said keeping the cats with headers gives the exhaust a better sound, less rasp.
I thought in Cal the rule that causes header problems is you can't move the cats from the stock location and can't change the cats from stock. So the only legal header choice is the shorty type that bolts to the sock cats.
I thought in Cal the rule that causes header problems is you can't move the cats from the stock location and can't change the cats from stock. So the only legal header choice is the shorty type that bolts to the sock cats.
12-10-2007, 03:12 PM
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A lot of people have said keeping the cats with headers gives the exhaust a better sound, less rasp.
I thought in Cal the rule that causes header problems is you can't move the cats from the stock location and can't change the cats from stock. So the only legal header choice is the shorty type that bolts to the sock cats.
I thought in Cal the rule that causes header problems is you can't move the cats from the stock location and can't change the cats from stock. So the only legal header choice is the shorty type that bolts to the sock cats.
thats another reason i want cats again. i dont like the rasp sound my current set up is making. stock manifolds, straight pipes, and flow master exhaust....and u ARE right on the stock cat location law.
12-10-2007, 06:48 PM
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but if i tune out the rear 02's and still run cats, i should be ok right? i just dont like seeing a the SES light.
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12-10-2007, 08:05 PM
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Well I hope your incorrect on that one because I got my rear O2's tuned out about a month ago and I'm up for inspection this month. It may be different in CA but in MA they check for OBDII errors and the OBDII 'system tests' or whatever you call them. I have a code reader and they all pass at the moment.