TEA head users
12-21-2012, 01:12 AM
#1
TEA head users So I recently aquired a set of 03 ZO6 243 castings off the Corvette Forums
from a fella in Las Vegas, NV. They were in great shape w/40,000 miles on
them....no bent hollow stem valves or anything. I removed the yellow springs
in case someone needs a set for a budget build, then cleaned them as best I
could. I opted to send them to Total Engine Airflow after a few phone calls &
questions for Mike. Great guy and had patience with all my concerns....
They left Wed. via USPS and since TEA is closed next week for the holidays
I won't expect to see them back till mid January. I'm pretty excited to get
their Stage 1 job which reuses my LS6 valves...ends up right around 222cc
on intake volume with a hand blended bowl to valvejob transition and .660
lift dual springs w/Tit retainers. Total of about $1200 of which 325 is the
spring kit....seems about the goin' rate. Their low and midlift flow numbers
seem really good for a factory casting and I look forward to the improvement
over my DIY 241s that have done well for two years. My compression ratio
will remain at 10.8 ish so any improvement in power will simply be the cylinder
head swap only........What results have other TEA users had with the 243s ??
from a fella in Las Vegas, NV. They were in great shape w/40,000 miles on
them....no bent hollow stem valves or anything. I removed the yellow springs
in case someone needs a set for a budget build, then cleaned them as best I
could. I opted to send them to Total Engine Airflow after a few phone calls &
questions for Mike. Great guy and had patience with all my concerns....
They left Wed. via USPS and since TEA is closed next week for the holidays
I won't expect to see them back till mid January. I'm pretty excited to get
their Stage 1 job which reuses my LS6 valves...ends up right around 222cc
on intake volume with a hand blended bowl to valvejob transition and .660
lift dual springs w/Tit retainers. Total of about $1200 of which 325 is the
spring kit....seems about the goin' rate. Their low and midlift flow numbers
seem really good for a factory casting and I look forward to the improvement
over my DIY 241s that have done well for two years. My compression ratio
will remain at 10.8 ish so any improvement in power will simply be the cylinder
head swap only........What results have other TEA users had with the 243s ??
12-21-2012, 01:43 AM
#3
and alot like the Lunati gold duals that I have now only w/Ti retainers. I'm
sure a bunch of different vendors sell the same boxed product. Ever notice
how every beehive with the exception of the PSI Maxlifes....PAC, Comp, etc.
has the same dimensions, specs, load pressure, etc,. I recently found some
surface enhanced behives from Manley that seem real badass. Like .650"
lift and 380 open pressure. However I'm lookin for about 150 seat and 350-
360 open for my hollow valve and .595/..598 cam combo
12-21-2012, 10:03 AM
#6
Thanks Joe....you also helped my decision to choose TEA as your car runs
real well. Your torque band is sweet where from 2800-6500 was over 325 rw
foot/lbs.. I'm curious to see what torque my little EPS 218/226 will have. I
had over 300 rwtq from 2600-6300 with my DIY241s and I was able to shift
at 68-6900 because of the wider 117 lobe sep and my hollow LS6 valves. This
swap should be a true factory head casting change, the compression ratio,
valves, and springs will all be the exact same. From my weak 246/200 modded
241s to TEA stage 1 CNC 243s. Car will also be on the same exact chassis
dyno (Speed Inc.) hopefully eliminating any extraneous variables which could
skew the power results. I have no specific goal other than a higher trap speed
next year when I hit the track....current best is 119.85 mph
real well. Your torque band is sweet where from 2800-6500 was over 325 rw
foot/lbs.. I'm curious to see what torque my little EPS 218/226 will have. I
had over 300 rwtq from 2600-6300 with my DIY241s and I was able to shift
at 68-6900 because of the wider 117 lobe sep and my hollow LS6 valves. This
swap should be a true factory head casting change, the compression ratio,
valves, and springs will all be the exact same. From my weak 246/200 modded
241s to TEA stage 1 CNC 243s. Car will also be on the same exact chassis
dyno (Speed Inc.) hopefully eliminating any extraneous variables which could
skew the power results. I have no specific goal other than a higher trap speed
next year when I hit the track....current best is 119.85 mph
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12-21-2012, 12:57 PM
#9
I'm interested to see how the Stage 1s work. That's a good comparison to Ai 226 heads with the stock valves, even though the Ai seem to make power on part with the Stage 2 TEAs.
I'm trying to decide between these three: Livernois Stage 3s, TEA Stage 2s, and Ai 226s. Both the Livernois and TEA have a lot less PtV clearance than the Ai 226s would have, but the Livernois S2 and TEA S1 should have plenty of clearance, but I don't know how they perform compared to their big brothers.
I'm trying to decide between these three: Livernois Stage 3s, TEA Stage 2s, and Ai 226s. Both the Livernois and TEA have a lot less PtV clearance than the Ai 226s would have, but the Livernois S2 and TEA S1 should have plenty of clearance, but I don't know how they perform compared to their big brothers.
12-21-2012, 09:38 PM
#10
I'm interested to see how the Stage 1s work. That's a good comparison to Ai 226 heads with the stock valves, even though the Ai seem to make power on part with the Stage 2 TEAs.
I'm trying to decide between these three: Livernois Stage 3s, TEA Stage 2s, and Ai 226s. Both the Livernois and TEA have a lot less PtV clearance than the Ai 226s would have, but the Livernois S2 and TEA S1 should have plenty of clearance, but I don't know how they perform compared to their big brothers.
I'm trying to decide between these three: Livernois Stage 3s, TEA Stage 2s, and Ai 226s. Both the Livernois and TEA have a lot less PtV clearance than the Ai 226s would have, but the Livernois S2 and TEA S1 should have plenty of clearance, but I don't know how they perform compared to their big brothers.
but the valves being a tad larger requires a bit different bowl/chamber work.
The runner volume differences are minimal. I had asked him about running the
stg 2 intake port since I found that Katech sells a 2.10" hollow valve that we
could turn down to a 2.04". That seems to be a popular thing for Trick Flow
guys to do is turn down LS3 valves. The 2.04 being about the largest for a
3.90" (unshrouding)..but Mike talked me out of doing that as he said the head
would flow bench a little better but probably not show up on the dyno. I'm
guessing due to my small 218 intake lobe, LS6 intake, and factory air box IN.
I certainly don't need to worry about PTV issues.......
12-21-2012, 10:45 PM
#12
Also I think there is something to be said for the shape of the valve after
turning it from 2.165" down to 2.04.....125" diameter or .0625" material ground
off. Back up the valve where the original back cut probably was is now the
new 45 deg. margin (seat).....I'd guess at least 8-10 cfm improvement based
on the tulip shape helping air/fuel get around the edge better and into the
smaller 3.90" bore/chamber....Ever take several different shaped valves and
hold them under a running faucet and study the water's flow pattern ??? It's
quite interesting !!!!! Better yet take an exhaust valve and hold it in the path
of the running water (at the face) to simulate the gasses....then take another
exhaust valve and radius or chamfer the edge oposite the seat and hold it
under water again.....the flow pattern changes dramatically...goofy but neat
12-21-2012, 11:17 PM
#14
Yeah 218 is no problem. I'd consider a bigger cam if I were you. I've talked to different folks. If you keep overlap around 2 degrees or less, you'll have a cam that drives very nice. That's something like a 228/232 114 or 230/234 115... Enough to make plenty of power but drive much nicer than a lot of the popular cams that have 18 degrees of overlap or whatever and barely make any more power at the expense of almost all driveability.
I talked to Mike today. He said the difference between the Stage 1 and Stage 2 is about 7-10HP and Stage 2 is about 12HP off from TFS 215s. I thought the Stage 2s were closer to the TFS 215s after talking to Tooley. Either way, I think the TEA Stage 2s are about as good as anything you can buy except for the TFS 215s. But the LS3 valves is definitely something I'd do.
I still like Ai and will consider them (as anyone should with stock castings they can send in), but I think the TEA Stage 2s with turned down LS3 valves is the way to go for folks who might not have true Z06 243s. With your hollow-stem valves, I'd stick with the Stage 1 and talk to Advanced Induction as well. Their heads seem to put out the same power as Stage 2 TEAs with the smaller valve.
I talked to Mike today. He said the difference between the Stage 1 and Stage 2 is about 7-10HP and Stage 2 is about 12HP off from TFS 215s. I thought the Stage 2s were closer to the TFS 215s after talking to Tooley. Either way, I think the TEA Stage 2s are about as good as anything you can buy except for the TFS 215s. But the LS3 valves is definitely something I'd do.
I still like Ai and will consider them (as anyone should with stock castings they can send in), but I think the TEA Stage 2s with turned down LS3 valves is the way to go for folks who might not have true Z06 243s. With your hollow-stem valves, I'd stick with the Stage 1 and talk to Advanced Induction as well. Their heads seem to put out the same power as Stage 2 TEAs with the smaller valve.
12-22-2012, 11:17 AM
#16
Yeah 218 is no problem. I'd consider a bigger cam if I were you. I've talked to different folks. If you keep overlap around 2 degrees or less, you'll have a cam that drives very nice. That's something like a 228/232 114 or 230/234 115... Enough to make plenty of power but drive much nicer than a lot of the popular cams that have 18 degrees of overlap or whatever and barely make any more power at the expense of almost all driveability.
I talked to Mike today. He said the difference between the Stage 1 and Stage 2 is about 7-10HP and Stage 2 is about 12HP off from TFS 215s. I thought the Stage 2s were closer to the TFS 215s after talking to Tooley. Either way, I think the TEA Stage 2s are about as good as anything you can buy except for the TFS 215s. But the LS3 valves is definitely something I'd do.
I still like Ai and will consider them (as anyone should with stock castings they can send in), but I think the TEA Stage 2s with turned down LS3 valves is the way to go for folks who might not have true Z06 243s. With your hollow-stem valves, I'd stick with the Stage 1 and talk to Advanced Induction as well. Their heads seem to put out the same power as Stage 2 TEAs with the smaller valve.
I talked to Mike today. He said the difference between the Stage 1 and Stage 2 is about 7-10HP and Stage 2 is about 12HP off from TFS 215s. I thought the Stage 2s were closer to the TFS 215s after talking to Tooley. Either way, I think the TEA Stage 2s are about as good as anything you can buy except for the TFS 215s. But the LS3 valves is definitely something I'd do.
I still like Ai and will consider them (as anyone should with stock castings they can send in), but I think the TEA Stage 2s with turned down LS3 valves is the way to go for folks who might not have true Z06 243s. With your hollow-stem valves, I'd stick with the Stage 1 and talk to Advanced Induction as well. Their heads seem to put out the same power as Stage 2 TEAs with the smaller valve.
I wanted 20 degrees more than a stock cam with an unoticeable idle. This car
being a Fiftieth Anniversary edition that my 9 yr. old daughter will 1 day own
(she claims in only 7 yrs.) I don't want it to become like all my other cars that
started out mild and ended, well completely rediculous.
Clearly Chris1313 proved the TF215s with the 2.04 hollows are about as good
as it gets (523 rw and 9.8 sec ets). But by the time you do the valve upgrade
and powdered guides for stock rockers your up close to or over 3 grand. Plus
the heads are cosmetically noticeable...whereas I'm staying stock castings &
only a few gearheads will notice the 243/241 change. Other than that my
engine bay looks unmolested save for the XSPower headers which actually
look nicer than the rusty manifolds. It's impressive that the TEA stg 2s are so
close to an aftermarket head which has the advantage of being rolled over
to the 13.5 degree valve angle....MAST even went another 1.5 to 11 deg.
Sure AI stuff does look really nice and I've yet to see one build that doesn't
make mad power but the whole e-mail contact only seems weird...I guess if
he is a one man operation but service to me is a phone call (human on the
other end) and Mike answered several questions (3 calls) and was always
straightforward and patient....don't see that too much anymore. I really
appreciated the service from Geoff @ EPS with my cam choice 2yrs. ago and
I'll no doubt call Texas Speed for my GM mls gaskets and TTY head bolts as
they were great to deal with a few yrs. ago as well.
Lastly I know I could make more power with a larger cam or stg 2/3 heads or
whatever but my goals for this is to compare a true casting swap (plus CNC)
and have my car trap 123-124 yet still maintain over 30 mpgs. I'd be shocked
if it even makes 400-410 rwhp but don't really care either way.
12-24-2012, 03:32 PM
#19
It's interesting that tooley recommended the light ls3 valves to you guys. I talked to him back in October about a set of the older TEA stage 2.5s (big 2.055 & 1.575 valves) that I bought earlier this year. I told him I plan on 90% street driving and he said the ls3 valves wouldn't be worth it. I'm guessing that is because he is assuming I would be going with a fairly mild cam. From what he told me you only stand to gain more power if your valve events are out of control. Simply going to a light weight valve won't gain you anything if your current valve train is stable enough to control events as is.
What cams did you guys tell him you would be using?
I'm also curious if anyone has any cam recommendations for the older stage 2.5s that I have? Sorry to thread jack.
What cams did you guys tell him you would be using?
I'm also curious if anyone has any cam recommendations for the older stage 2.5s that I have? Sorry to thread jack.
12-24-2012, 04:07 PM
#20
It's interesting that tooley recommended the light ls3 valves to you guys. I talked to him back in October about a set of the older TEA stage 2.5s (big 2.055 & 1.575 valves) that I bought earlier this year. I told him I plan on 90% street driving and he said the ls3 valves wouldn't be worth it. I'm guessing that is because he is assuming I would be going with a fairly mild cam. From what he told me you only stand to gain more power if your valve events are out of control. Simply going to a light weight valve won't gain you anything if your current valve train is stable enough to control events as is.
What cams did you guys tell him you would be using?
I'm also curious if anyone has any cam recommendations for the older stage 2.5s that I have? Sorry to thread jack.
What cams did you guys tell him you would be using?
I'm also curious if anyone has any cam recommendations for the older stage 2.5s that I have? Sorry to thread jack.
free cam suggestion/thread hi-jack......LOL