TableLeg

I currently am rebuilding my standard L33 5.3 engine and have the 799 heads off.

They are going for decoking, repainting and new 3 angle valve seats and matching valves plus the smallest amount of refacing to ensure a flat sealing surface.

I am currently keeping the standard L33 cam only for the duration of my vehicle registration to keep within emission requirements. Then after I plan to swap out the cam for something in the region of a 224 or 228.

As I have the heads off I figured it would make a lot of sense to fit new springs now so that I don't have to take the heads off again in the future when I come to do the cam change.

I have been reading a lot of posts and basically it seems that for a cam in the range I am looking at the main choices are Comp 918's, Pac 1218's and 1518's and then the Brain Tooley valve sets.

It seem's the 918's and the 1218's are nearly the same price. 1518's are almost the same as Brian Tooley dual spring set with Titanium retainers
http://www.briantooleyracing.com/650...retainers.html

I haven't heard anything bad said about the BT stuff and unless I'm missing something that's a great price for a set of duals complete with Titanium retainers and locks etc.

However, whilst I accept it appears to be a good deal I am aware that it could be overkill for my setup.

The problem is I just don't know and I hope some of you experts could give me some advice.

Am I right in thinking that using Titanium retainers helps to lighten the mass of the rocker gear?
I believe this to be true but then this must be offset by the extra weight of the second inner spring? How does the mass of dual springs with Titanium retainers compare to a single beehive with Steel?

Sorry for all the questions. I have read a lot of the technical info on here by some of the experts but whilst it is clearly excellent information it is sometimes very in depth and difficult to fully understand how it applies to all situations.

I hope somebody can please give me some advice?

Thanks in advance.

Brian Tooley Racing

iTrader: (13)

There are pro's and con's to both spring setups.

The beehive springs are light, lighter than even dual springs with a titanium retainer. However the beehive springs haven't proven to be 100% reliable when used with lift in the .600+ range.

The dual Platinum springs I sell are great for higher lift applications where maximum reliability is required, but they are overkill for a stock cam.

If you plan to keep your lift below .580" in the future, then I would go beehive, if you plan to run over .600" then go with the dual springs for sure.

You might consider the PAC 1211X springs also, they have more pressure than the 918/1518 and seem to be a better design.

http://www.briantooleyracing.com/625...e-springs.html

TableLeg

Thank you very much Brian for the reply.

The cam I propose using is circa 0.580" to 0.610".

This therefore puts the lift in the middle of your suggestions. Based on this would you still recommend the 1211x?

Are the 1211x Nitrided for added longevity like the 1518?

And can these be used with stock retainers and locators?

Thanks again.

DEFYANT

I recommend just listening to Brian lol.

Brian Tooley Racing

iTrader: (13)

If you run a conservative ramp speed cam then I think .610" would be okay, something like the Comp HUC lobes. However if you're going to run short duration and .610" lift, then the ramp speed will be fairly high.

I'm not sure what heat treat process the 1211X springs go through, but I believe there are better processes for durability than nitride.

They can be used with stock retainers and locators/seals.

I recently had a guy break an aftermarket beehive spring with a GM LS9 cam in 1500 miles. However when I checked the GM LS9 cam on the Cam Pro, the peak velocity was as high as a Comp XE-R lobe. So a lobe can be conservative lift and still have a fast ramp speed if the duration is short.

Blackpanther99

iTrader: (8)

I got Brian Tooley's '650 spring kit Brian is the man soo listen to his advise!

TableLeg

Thanks once again Brian for the reply, I appreciate you taking the time to help.

The cams I have been looking at (Texas Speed 224) has XE-R lobes as far as I know. Given the fast ramps on these cams does that alter your opinion on which springs to use?

PREDATOR-Z

I've used xe-r and xfi with beehives and no issues. Stock valves with Tit. retainers to keep things as light as possible.
Things to consider with beehives:
1- You will check valve spring pressures once a year on all of them regardless how many miles or hours you run them.
2- Install at proper height for cam profile and try to get consistency throughout the valvetrain. Check coilbind.
3- Always warm the engine to operating temperature before beating on them, especially in colder weather.Most broken singles I've seen were fire and drive without warmup. Beehives are brittle when cold.

The benefits mainly are better stability at higher rpm (better harmonic control) if installed correctly and a couple extra Hp.

Brian Tooley Racing

iTrader: (13)

Something of interest, we just engine dyno tested my Platinum dual springs against some popular aftermarket beehive springs. We assumed the beehive springs would make more power but they actually made the exact same power. I was surprised by that, I assumed the increased pressure of the dual springs would be a parasitic power loss, but in back to back testing it was not. The test was a stock LS3 longblock with over .600" lift cam.

SOHCNightmare

I was just wondering this the other day when my friend was discussing his valve spring setup. Good to know.

TableLeg

Thanks Guys

The above raises a question for me though. If the effect of using single beehive's v's Platinum duals is virtually the same and the cost is not that much different either, does it not make more sense to use duals for nothing more than the extra protection should a spring break?

???

SteelCityYaga

Regarding points 1 and 3.

What is the best tool to check spring pressures for F-Bodies?

When you say fire and drive, do you mean, start engine, immediately slam into gear and take off within 15 seconds, or should a couple of minutes be observed (say until coolant temps are 130 to 150*F)?

xRaTeD

If you are going to repaint the heads look in dispersant coatings

TurboBuick6

iTrader: (2)

it's always a good idea to let components warm up a little bit.

TableLeg

Thanks xRaTeD for the tip.

That looks sweet

SteelCityYaga

I agree and adhere to PREDATOR-Z's recommendation - I just want it out there for the public to view.