Thule

i got the patriot ls6 stageII heads. 59cc, my cam is the 226/226 585 112LSA,

i just think this cam is to small,

i want the ms4,

Can i use it? do i have to flycut?

i got the patriot gold double spings, 7.400" chromoly push rods, ls7 lifters, that should be fine for the ms4 rigt?

how much hp gain will i see?

do you recomend any other cam in sam range as the magic sticks?

thanks

brad8266

iTrader: (23)

Id be flycutting with the magic stick. Since the patriots achieve desired chamber CC by welding instead of milling they dont sacrifice PTVC nearly as much as milled heads. As always be sure to measure PTVC once the engine is together to ensure good margins.

Thule

yeah i know the best thing would be to flycut, but still that is what i am trying to avoid, this is a brand new motor with brand new 6.0l multy layer head gaskets and katech head studs, i want to avoid to take the heads of,

an thats why i ask, can i use the MS4 without flycutting,

mudflap1989

iTrader: (4)

You can ask all that you want and you will get many different answers, this is something that others cannot answer for you, you have to answer it yourself. On a stock motor, the MS4 has about 0.050"-0.060" of clearance on the intake, so if it was me I would flycut even with a stock motor. There are way too many unknown variables in this equation to answer. If you really want to know, buy the cam, put it in, measure clearance, if it is acceptable, run it, if not then take it out and sell it and buy a smaller one or flycut.

You said that it is a new motor, does it have valve reliefs?

Thule

sorry, what is valve reliefs? ( sorry im europeian, need translation)

when i bougth the head/cam package i was told that the 226/226 cam was almoast as "big" as i could go with 59cc heads, so i took it, but latley i have both seen cars with same heads and much bigger cams, and people telling my that with welded chambers i can go as big as i like,

then i kepped on buying stuff, and now i have bougth big injectors, FAST90 NW90 racetronix fuel system and more, and think with the 226/226 i am not getting the hp's that i could,

i am not goin to rip the motor apart agen after building it from scratch, so i am curius about how big i can go,

chae

iTrader: (8)

I was told by Jon at Texas Speed that the Magic Stick 3 is the largest possible cam that will work with PRC Stage 2.5 CNC ported cylinder heads. I'm not sure on the combustion chamber size because I believe it varies for a given stage and also isn't listed on their website (from what I saw anyways). I believe it is somewhere in the range of 59-64cc, (but some have received heads milled to as much as 67cc). I would think that these would be comparable (59-64 cc wise) to what you are running, so I would assume that the MS3 is the biggest you could run.

Personally I would look into something more along the lines of a 228/228 112 LSA cam or maybe even a 228/232 112 LSA cam. These options still make great power (-10 rwhp from a 236/242 112 LSA), with a better usable powerband starting at just above 2000 rpm (2200 I believe) instead of the 2600 rpm where the MS3 and similar duration cams begin to shine.

I also suggest looking into some local cam set-ups, riding in a few local cam cars, etc. to get an idea on the power, idle quality, driveability, etc. Good luck

Thule

i live in iceland, there are no local cam cars

i think 228 112LSA is a little to small to upgrade from 226 112LSA,

but yeahh, the ms3 sound ok though, should do it for me over 450wrhp i woul think

thanks dude,

open for opinions

Thule

open for opinions

chae

iTrader: (8)

You could always go with a G5X2 (232/240 duration .595"/.608" lift 112/114 LSA) or the G5X3 (too bad they don't actually advertise the specs). Both are put out by LG Motorsports.

SLP4CamaroSS

iTrader: (16)

go with a g5x1 112lsa if u dont wnat to rev up to high if u do get a g5x3 112lsa i love mine it drives like stock its all in the tune my cold/hot starts fire up like stock and no surging or anything. if u get those heads make sure you get stock valves and no milling. i measured my ptov i got stock heads and it was .070 intake and .110 exhaust what is recommanded is .080 and .100

JPH

iTrader: (2)

IMO, i would run a larger cam than what patriot recommended, because i used there stage 2 heads once, and only once and was not impressed with hp/trq results. if you insist on using them, i would run 228+intake/230+exhaust and no more than .610 lift on both. good luck man.

Thule

thanxk

i allready got the motor in my sign, FAST90 NW90, svo injectors, racetronix system,STAGEII heads 59cc, and more... thats why i think the cam is just to small for the rest of the combo,

i want to rev to 7k, i think that should be okey with my katech rod and head studs,

this g5x3 and the other cam sounds realy good,

how much gain will i see over the patriot cam?

i want it big

mudflap1989

iTrader: (4)

[QUOTE=Thule]sorry, what is valve reliefs? ( sorry im europeian, need translation)[QUOTE]
Valve reliefs are "notches" that are cut in the piston. Do you have stock pistons or aftermarket pistons?

Thule

the pistons along with the crankshaft are about the only thing left stock in the motor

mudflap1989

iTrader: (4)

I would suggest something about like a torquer v2 or v3 I don't think that you run a MS4 without flycutting, MS3 maybe? But you really need to check clearances. Some people would run a bigger cam, but I don't like to run tight PTV clearances.

Your best bet is to really be ready to flycut, there are always differences in motor and there are too many variables to say whether you will need to flycut or not.

Thule

yeah, i sended gunnar@patriot email, i will take his thougths wery siriusly,

yeah those v and v3 are interesting,

i just want to go over 450rwhp, and than i would be realy happy,