few questions about MTI's 427ci "Z07" package
07-08-2003, 04:21 AM
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few questions about MTI's 427ci "Z07" package Heya guys, I have a couple of questions about MTI's 427 "Z07" engine package that they offer.
1. When you get this package, do they have everything brand new, or do you use the same LS1 that you have (I read something about $20K + Core exchange, so I'm assuming you use the same LS1).
2. If they do use the same LS1, would it matter if it has alot of miles? I.E. Would the new package perform and last the same if one LS1 had 20K miles and another one had 120K miles?
3. How reliable is this package as far as lasting and not leaving you out or diying on you?
4. If you have alot of miles on an LS1 (say like 100k miles), would it be better off to just get a brand new LS1 (or used, but with 20K miles or so) and then do the Z07 package for reliability, or would the engine package replace everything and make it go back to an almost brand new engine?
5. Why does it advertise it as 427, but when people have it their cars, they say it's a 422...can someone please exlain this to me.
6. How long would the installation take, and is the $20k just for the engine package, or does it include installation, tuning, and other stuff?
That's pretty much all I have for right now...if I think of more, I'll edit it and notify you guys.
BTW, this is gonna be for a 99/00 Black FRC (Which are 6-speeds w/ 3.42 gear ratio).
1. When you get this package, do they have everything brand new, or do you use the same LS1 that you have (I read something about $20K + Core exchange, so I'm assuming you use the same LS1).
2. If they do use the same LS1, would it matter if it has alot of miles? I.E. Would the new package perform and last the same if one LS1 had 20K miles and another one had 120K miles?
3. How reliable is this package as far as lasting and not leaving you out or diying on you?
4. If you have alot of miles on an LS1 (say like 100k miles), would it be better off to just get a brand new LS1 (or used, but with 20K miles or so) and then do the Z07 package for reliability, or would the engine package replace everything and make it go back to an almost brand new engine?
5. Why does it advertise it as 427, but when people have it their cars, they say it's a 422...can someone please exlain this to me.
6. How long would the installation take, and is the $20k just for the engine package, or does it include installation, tuning, and other stuff?
That's pretty much all I have for right now...if I think of more, I'll edit it and notify you guys.
BTW, this is gonna be for a 99/00 Black FRC (Which are 6-speeds w/ 3.42 gear ratio).
07-08-2003, 06:55 AM
#2
Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci They will use whatever core they need to use. Your motor is just a donor motor. To make 427cid, the motor is resleeved and mileage has no bearing on the situation.
Most folks have the 422 buildup, because that was about the max bore size would allow for a while. Now the sleeves allow larger bore sizes, so the 427 is the new gig.
You could have it built with a tame cam that would drive every day just fine, or go with something nasty and idle like a race car.
Most folks have the 422 buildup, because that was about the max bore size would allow for a while. Now the sleeves allow larger bore sizes, so the 427 is the new gig.
You could have it built with a tame cam that would drive every day just fine, or go with something nasty and idle like a race car.
07-08-2003, 10:19 AM
#3
Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci Well, first off the folks at MTI are great at answering these sorts of questions. I enjoy talking to Rick there, but there are lots of other knowledgable folks there. 281-870-8787 Buuut... lets see...
1. They generally dont use the donor motor for the base of the new motor. Building the motor takes a couple weeks at least, depending on various factors, and it would be a pain to have your car sitting wihtout a motor that whole time. The parts they generally use that are the same are block/head castings/covers/brackets/accessories... and a few other things like sensors and tricial bits and pieces. For the most part, and wear part is replaced.
2. All wearing parts are replaced that I can think of. It would not matter at all how many miles the previous motor had on it if it was the right year (bolts to valvecovers, other little things) If your car is a 97-98, they may recommend moving to all 99+ bits.
3. Its as reliable as you ask it to be. Do anything on the far wildside like solid roller setups, something new and different, etc, and although MTI warrantees the motor, theres a slight risk. Otherwise, several people use 422/427s as their daily driver. I wish I could. MTI does of course warantee their stuff, adn I think that generally speaking, few on this board would worry about a Z07 setup installed by them leaving you stranded if you treated it well.
4. As I said in #2, it probably matters more what year it is, rather than how many miles. It may not even matter at all...call MTI
5. As Todd mentioned above, in the beginning the sleeves were 4.100 bore. with a 4" stroke, thats 422. Now the sleeves are 4.125" bore, and MTI can build the magical # 427 ci. Everyone wants a 427, even ford guys. Mopar guys though want a 426
6. The 2Xk$ is for everything. Drop your car off, pick it up with alot more power. As far as time-frame and duration, *cough* 281-870-8787. They keep their own appointment books
Since you have a 99 or 00 FRC, the year thing probably isnt an issue with the motor. Go see MTI. I dont think anyone has had a poor Z07 experience
chris
1. They generally dont use the donor motor for the base of the new motor. Building the motor takes a couple weeks at least, depending on various factors, and it would be a pain to have your car sitting wihtout a motor that whole time. The parts they generally use that are the same are block/head castings/covers/brackets/accessories... and a few other things like sensors and tricial bits and pieces. For the most part, and wear part is replaced.
2. All wearing parts are replaced that I can think of. It would not matter at all how many miles the previous motor had on it if it was the right year (bolts to valvecovers, other little things) If your car is a 97-98, they may recommend moving to all 99+ bits.
3. Its as reliable as you ask it to be. Do anything on the far wildside like solid roller setups, something new and different, etc, and although MTI warrantees the motor, theres a slight risk. Otherwise, several people use 422/427s as their daily driver. I wish I could. MTI does of course warantee their stuff, adn I think that generally speaking, few on this board would worry about a Z07 setup installed by them leaving you stranded if you treated it well.
4. As I said in #2, it probably matters more what year it is, rather than how many miles. It may not even matter at all...call MTI
5. As Todd mentioned above, in the beginning the sleeves were 4.100 bore. with a 4" stroke, thats 422. Now the sleeves are 4.125" bore, and MTI can build the magical # 427 ci. Everyone wants a 427, even ford guys. Mopar guys though want a 426
6. The 2Xk$ is for everything. Drop your car off, pick it up with alot more power. As far as time-frame and duration, *cough* 281-870-8787. They keep their own appointment books
Since you have a 99 or 00 FRC, the year thing probably isnt an issue with the motor. Go see MTI. I dont think anyone has had a poor Z07 experience
chris
07-08-2003, 07:06 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci
Well, first off the folks at MTI are great at answering these sorts of questions. I enjoy talking to Rick there, but there are lots of other knowledgable folks there. 281-870-8787 Buuut... lets see...
1. They generally dont use the donor motor for the base of the new motor. Building the motor takes a couple weeks at least, depending on various factors, and it would be a pain to have your car sitting wihtout a motor that whole time. The parts they generally use that are the same are block/head castings/covers/brackets/accessories... and a few other things like sensors and tricial bits and pieces. For the most part, and wear part is replaced.
2. All wearing parts are replaced that I can think of. It would not matter at all how many miles the previous motor had on it if it was the right year (bolts to valvecovers, other little things) If your car is a 97-98, they may recommend moving to all 99+ bits.
3. Its as reliable as you ask it to be. Do anything on the far wildside like solid roller setups, something new and different, etc, and although MTI warrantees the motor, theres a slight risk. Otherwise, several people use 422/427s as their daily driver. I wish I could. MTI does of course warantee their stuff, adn I think that generally speaking, few on this board would worry about a Z07 setup installed by them leaving you stranded if you treated it well.
4. As I said in #2, it probably matters more what year it is, rather than how many miles. It may not even matter at all...call MTI
5. As Todd mentioned above, in the beginning the sleeves were 4.100 bore. with a 4" stroke, thats 422. Now the sleeves are 4.125" bore, and MTI can build the magical # 427 ci. Everyone wants a 427, even ford guys. Mopar guys though want a 426
6. The 2Xk$ is for everything. Drop your car off, pick it up with alot more power. As far as time-frame and duration, *cough* 281-870-8787. They keep their own appointment books
Since you have a 99 or 00 FRC, the year thing probably isnt an issue with the motor. Go see MTI. I dont think anyone has had a poor Z07 experience
chris
1. They generally dont use the donor motor for the base of the new motor. Building the motor takes a couple weeks at least, depending on various factors, and it would be a pain to have your car sitting wihtout a motor that whole time. The parts they generally use that are the same are block/head castings/covers/brackets/accessories... and a few other things like sensors and tricial bits and pieces. For the most part, and wear part is replaced.
2. All wearing parts are replaced that I can think of. It would not matter at all how many miles the previous motor had on it if it was the right year (bolts to valvecovers, other little things) If your car is a 97-98, they may recommend moving to all 99+ bits.
3. Its as reliable as you ask it to be. Do anything on the far wildside like solid roller setups, something new and different, etc, and although MTI warrantees the motor, theres a slight risk. Otherwise, several people use 422/427s as their daily driver. I wish I could. MTI does of course warantee their stuff, adn I think that generally speaking, few on this board would worry about a Z07 setup installed by them leaving you stranded if you treated it well.
4. As I said in #2, it probably matters more what year it is, rather than how many miles. It may not even matter at all...call MTI
5. As Todd mentioned above, in the beginning the sleeves were 4.100 bore. with a 4" stroke, thats 422. Now the sleeves are 4.125" bore, and MTI can build the magical # 427 ci. Everyone wants a 427, even ford guys. Mopar guys though want a 426
6. The 2Xk$ is for everything. Drop your car off, pick it up with alot more power. As far as time-frame and duration, *cough* 281-870-8787. They keep their own appointment books
Since you have a 99 or 00 FRC, the year thing probably isnt an issue with the motor. Go see MTI. I dont think anyone has had a poor Z07 experience
chris
One last thing....
will the new motor include what your intake was? example, say I had the LS1 intake, would they give it back to me with an LS1 intake, Vice Versa.
So tell me this, you take an FRC, and a Z06...they're both gonna end up with the same performance right, or no because of the cams that's in the Z06? Can I just have that same cam in the FRC?
Oh, I don't currenlty have my FRC yet, I'm saving up for it.
07-08-2003, 07:34 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci A 427 motor w/o a core is $16,000 I believe. That does not include install or tuning or any of that other crap. I think the Z07 package even includes some bolt ons like exhaust, intake, and headers.
07-08-2003, 11:04 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci The ZO6 would have a very slight advantage over the FRC, because the head castings were LS6 castings while the FRCs were LS1. There is a bit of debate as to what thats worth, but its in my estimation 10-15 hp.
I *think* the car would have the same intake as whatever you delivered, BUT, you wouldnt skimp that 450$ on a 20k$ engine. It would be worth ALOT of power. Some 427 folks look into alternative (very expensive) intakes that potentially trade some of that great low and midrange torque for some high up peak HP. As far as I recall, the Z07 package is what you get if you drop an essentially stock car off. It gets cheaper if you have already modded the car to some degree.
chris
I *think* the car would have the same intake as whatever you delivered, BUT, you wouldnt skimp that 450$ on a 20k$ engine. It would be worth ALOT of power. Some 427 folks look into alternative (very expensive) intakes that potentially trade some of that great low and midrange torque for some high up peak HP. As far as I recall, the Z07 package is what you get if you drop an essentially stock car off. It gets cheaper if you have already modded the car to some degree.
chris
07-08-2003, 11:44 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci If you get the ZO7 akpwackage ut on your car its is absolutly(s) nothing esle that you can do to your car. That package has everything you need and nothing you dont.
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07-09-2003, 12:01 AM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci Oh yeh, last question I promise 
I heard No Mercy's Z06
and it sounded pretty lopey idling. Is this because of his cut-outs were open, or because of the type of cam he had? What kinda cam does he have anyone know?
What cam do they provide you with? And how would it sound with a cut-out closed right when MTI hands it to me? (I dunno what cam they provide you with)
BTW, thanx for the replise once again!
I heard No Mercy's Z06
and it sounded pretty lopey idling. Is this because of his cut-outs were open, or because of the type of cam he had? What kinda cam does he have anyone know?What cam do they provide you with? And how would it sound with a cut-out closed right when MTI hands it to me? (I dunno what cam they provide you with)
BTW, thanx for the replise once again!
07-09-2003, 12:54 AM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci
that vette "only" had the 422
the camshaft is mti's s1...244/244 .612/.612 112lsa
the camshaft is mti's s1...244/244 .612/.612 112lsa
How about with the same 112 camshaft that No mercy has but with the cut-out closed, will it give it the humming sound that I'm looking for instead of the loping noise?
Oh, how bad would it effect it if I move up the lsa to 114 in HP.
Edit: Will this pass emission, or does it depend on the camshaft?
Thanx.
07-09-2003, 08:52 AM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci The S1 is a radical cam even in a 7 liter. MTI has come up with a new cam 
the Z1 236/236 .585"/.585" on a 112 - but I believe you can order it on a 114. The R1 has a slight lope kind of stealthy, so the Z1 as you can see falls in between - just thought I would share some more options with you.
the Z1 236/236 .585"/.585" on a 112 - but I believe you can order it on a 114. The R1 has a slight lope kind of stealthy, so the Z1 as you can see falls in between - just thought I would share some more options with you.
07-09-2003, 10:31 AM
#13
Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci Personally, I prefer the 114 LS in a vette. I dont like much lope in a vette. I like lope in my Camaro SS, but in my vette, I liked a smooth sound that didnt shake the car. IMHO, vettes shouldnt shake. Given that, I got the MTI X1 cam in my 387. Its only 230/227. For a 427, I'd move that to a "Z1" on a 112 for a camaro, and a 114 for a vette.
07-09-2003, 08:27 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci
Personally, I prefer the 114 LS in a vette. I dont like much lope in a vette. I like lope in my Camaro SS, but in my vette, I liked a smooth sound that didnt shake the car. IMHO, vettes shouldnt shake. Given that, I got the MTI X1 cam in my 387. Its only 230/227. For a 427, I'd move that to a "Z1" on a 112 for a camaro, and a 114 for a vette.
I agree with you 100%...An F-body (Muscle car) should be lopey and shakey while a 'Vette (Sportscar) should be "humming" and not so lopey
.So I guess the Z1 cam is for me w/ 114lsa right. How much HP difference would I lose compared to the S1 cam?
Am I asking too many questions in one thread? LOL
Oh, last question I swear...Would this whole set-up (With Z1/114lsa and S1/112lsa cam) be able to pass emissions?
THANK YOU GUYS 10000000 X'S
07-10-2003, 09:52 AM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci I think you would lose only a slight bit of hp but gain substantially in idle quality and drivability.
Zerofactix, MTI is known for their re-sleeved 7 liter aluminum blocks, but they also build iron blocks for those who prefer that set-up.
Zerofactix, MTI is known for their re-sleeved 7 liter aluminum blocks, but they also build iron blocks for those who prefer that set-up.
07-10-2003, 10:51 AM
#17
Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci Oh, last question I swear...Would this whole set-up (With Z1/114lsa and S1/112lsa cam) be able to pass emissions?
We have no idea
07-10-2003, 01:16 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci Oh, last question I swear...Would this whole set-up (With Z1/114lsa and S1/112lsa cam) be able to pass emissions?
We have no idea
07-10-2003, 04:26 PM
#19
Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci I think they would assume you want the aluminum (like the stock engine) unless you specifically ask for Iron. THe standard Z07 package is Aluminum block.
Wether thats safe is all about the cylinder sleeves, which i think are fine and great. THe internals (forged, I think either way) arent related to whether the block is iron or not. In the end, MTI will give you great internals either way. The Z07 that just won the One Lap of America is essentially a veyr normal Z07 package. I assume you arent going to beat on it like they beat on that car
chris
Wether thats safe is all about the cylinder sleeves, which i think are fine and great. THe internals (forged, I think either way) arent related to whether the block is iron or not. In the end, MTI will give you great internals either way. The Z07 that just won the One Lap of America is essentially a veyr normal Z07 package. I assume you arent going to beat on it like they beat on that car
chris
07-10-2003, 10:39 PM
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Re: few questions about MTI's 427ci For what its worth i just ran into and was talking to for awhile at a local chicagoland chevey show, to one of the employees who works for the one lap of america Z07 owner and he was there with the car and that Z07 motor uses the awesome and very expensive C5R block. That Z07 car that one the one lap is AWESOME and the car is an 02 electron blue Z06 which looks like a trans am racer with its racing wing, etc. Also, it is true that MTI normal's Z07 motor is a resleeved alum. block and if you want an ironblock 427 like they built me then you just have to simply tell them that. I went with the ironblock b/c i like the extra strength of that block but wish it could be bored out as much as the resleeved alum block which now is being bored out to 4.125 and with the 4.00 crank is achieving 427 beautiful cubic inches!
Call MTI, they will build you what you want and will take care of you and stand behind their product 100%. You can't beat their 2 year 24K mile on their superstroker motors which you get if they do the install and tuning of their built motor! Best of luck!!
MTI 427 Roadster
Call MTI, they will build you what you want and will take care of you and stand behind their product 100%. You can't beat their 2 year 24K mile on their superstroker motors which you get if they do the install and tuning of their built motor! Best of luck!!
MTI 427 Roadster
