Cross

iTrader: (10)

I have tried everything, even paid a shop who told me the Autozone Opti was bad (I could buy it ok, its AZ) so I bought a Brand NEW, never installed MSD Opti off a local member. Came in the box and everything. Made sure it was dead on with the oval hole and the dowel pin, everything put on and it will not start still....

I can smell fuel but I took the plug wire off at the coil and still no spark.

I hate my car right now.

FrankSS

iTrader: (18)

try replacing the coil... could be the problem

saad94

try to start from replace cheap like spark plugs if is not the problem maybe coil as FranskSs said.

riceburnerZ28

iTrader: (20)

it maybe the coil or my favorite the ignition module. U should first determine if theres a signal being signal from the opti to the ecm, then that would eliminate the opti ! And check for fault codes

Cross

iTrader: (10)

Maybe if I include the link to the other thread you can see what we have tried. Might have been a good idea.

We have replaced the ICM Nothing.
Tested the Coil Nothing.

However when we did the plug in the new opti off the car and connect it then spin the back with the KOEOff it sparked.... and I smell fuel so its telling the injectors to pulse.

I guess I will go buy the Module and Coil again... I have 2 modules here and I doubt since both cars were running before that they are both bad now. So I will try that.

The coil tested good but I found MSD ones for 45.00 so why not.

I just need to do the tests yet again... yay.

Paul Bell

iTrader: (9)

Checked your fuses? Good grounds? Probed the weatherpack plugs for voltage where it's supposed to be? Checked all the plugs even back to the PCM? VATS system acting up?

Cross

iTrader: (10)

This is everything we did with the old "New AZ Opti"

------START--------
Ok so I swapped my New (As in new rebuilt and modified LT4 with 3000 miles max on it) motor from My 96 Camaro to My 94 Formula.

I swapped the Coil and ICM.
I swapped the Knock Sensor.
I did not touch the wiring the 94 was running a stock LT1 before we did it and the Camaro was running (Although REALLY Rich) in the 96.
The ECU's were not swapped.

I have checked there are no codes according to my AutoXray.
The Security Light does not stay on.
There are no blown fuses.

I did get a weird sound like a tooth or two came off the flywheel o.O started sounded dead but I had it tested, put it back in same thing, moved the rear wheels and suddenly everything was fine....

I did the tests showed for checking voltage etc and came to believe it was the Opti so I replaced everything, Its all new. Put it back together and nothing.... it just cranks and cranks but does not start.

I put my Spark Tester on Plug #1... nothing. Never lights up at all.

I do have fuel as I can smell it but I have not done a fuel spec test yet. (Besides checking for voltage pulses)



WTF!!!! Both cars were fine before we did the swap now it hates me.

The only thing that's not even worth mentioning in my opinion is the ground strap that goes from the ICM to where ever you choose to mount it broke and I did not replace it. That's it. (This was not present on the Camaro its an extra strap from the bolt closest to the Fender well on the Mount Post for the ICM and Coil to the Head and it goes to the body)

I removed all the EGR and AIR stuff, all brackets, all lines all that is left is the connectors and I am just completely LOST.

I also removed anything related to the AirBag System I could find not sure that would cause this but I am mentioning it either way.

Can ANYONE PPPLLLEEEAASSEE Tell me WTF I am over looking?

----Update----

OK I did everything here:
http://www.mainstreamtopics.com/foru...p?showtopic=78

I failed the following (I checked beyond the first fail because its a new Opti)
The first thing we will do is verify the optical sensor is working correctly. And here is how..

Unhook 1 fuel injector connector. With your test light check for pulsing ground on the NON PINK wire while cranking the engine (different years use different color wires but all year have pink wires for the positive voltage side of the connectors) The other choice you have is to use the noid light (noid light AZ OEM part number 25143), plug the noid light into the connector and crank the car. The light should flash..

Do you have a flashing ground while cranking?

Yes, the optical sensor is sending the signal and should be ok, continue to test the ignition system.

No, the optical sensor is not working see testing opti section. My Result, However I tested at the PCM side of the wire connector at the Passenger side VC... its hard to get down to test where it requests.

That lead too;
If you failed the injector pulse test we must make sure that all the power is getting to the opti.

With the test light and the car on KOEO, unplug the opti connector at the optispark and test for hot at the red wire at the opti. do you have hot?

If yes. Next step My Result again I tested at the connector on the VC.

if no, the pos feed comes from the computer. Check that the PCM is sending the signal, if not then you might have a faulty PCM


Next, using a multi meter on volts scale, test the red/black and purple/white wires for 5 volts. Do you have 5 Volts?
Yes, next step 6 Volts on Each
No, The 5 volt reference is provided by the PCM, possible PCM failure or PCM power feed problem


Next, test the pink/black wire for ground. Do you have ground?
Yes, then the optical sensor is not working and is probably bad. based on the other tests run this is causing your no spark condition. It’s time to replace your opti. You can also check for corrosion or damage to the opti connector and replace as needed. This was my Result but as I said I just today put in the new Opti. While getting a new Opti that's bad is possible I am not buying it just yet.

No, the ground is provided by the PCM, possible PCM failure or PCM power feed problem.

--------------End of first batch of tests--------------

So because I felt it could not be the Opti I did the rest of the tests and ran into problems here:
Next we will see if the coil and ICM are causing the no spark.
First on the ICM connector with KOEO check for hot (93-95) on the Pink/Black and white/black wires or (96-97) on the Pink and Dark green wires. Do you have hot?

Yes, next step Yes I did.
No, (93-95) Check for hot at the pink wire a the ign coil. If you have power at the coil, but not at the ICM, The coil is shorted and preventing power from reaching the ICM. Replace the coil and retest. If you do not have hot at the coils pink wire, check the 10 amp Ign fuse. Repair as needed and retest.
(96-97) If you are missing hot on both wires at the module, check the 10amp ign fuse, Repair and retest. If you are missing hot only on the dark green wire, but not he pink wire, the coil has shorted and is preventing the voltage from reaching the module and must be replaced.

Next check for ground on the black wire. do you have ground?

Yes, next step Yes I did.
no, repair ground

next test for a pulsing ground at the dark green wire(96-97) or the White/black wire (93-95) at the coil coming from the ICM. Do you have a pulsing ground?

Yes, next step
No Replace the ICM *note, I have seen a bad coil burn up an ICM. It might be a good time to replace or upgrade your coil* Because of this I grabbed the other Coil and ICM and tested mixing them and completely changing them... still the same results and still no Spark.


next with your test light check for hot on the Pink wire at the coil. do you have hot?
Yes, Replace your coil *note, High resistance from bad plug wires can burn out coils. You can Ohm test plug wires or replace them if wanted* Because of this I grabbed the other Coil and ICM and tested mixing them and completely changing them... still the same results and still no Spark.

No, Check and repair ign fuse and retest

---------End of Tests here---------

So while doing this I obviously added that Ground Strap which did nothing... and I found these wires that I am not sure what they are too but they were just wrapped with electrical tape. It was like this when the prior owner got the car and I drove in the car I knew it ran... just no idea if these were to the Air System or what.
1 Black wire and 2 Tan and White wires that seem to be just one cut wire...
(I tested them and the Black grounds but it kicks on a relay in the fuse box I an hear it and the ground is faint the test light goes off and on. The two tan and whites ground out well.)
Ok with a voltage meter the following has been found:
Car off the Tan and White are Ground no volts and the Black has no volts.
Key on Engine off Tan and white are Ground and the Black has 12V.
Cranking the Tan and White have 6.5 Volts and Black has 12V.
They seem to be linked to the ABS as they click that Relay (Tan and White)



Its out of the same spot as the MAF, Coil and ICM Connectors and its 3 wires supplying 2V.

----More updates----
So I got my new MadZ28 Ecu and hopped maybe that would change it... nothing. (I have not redone the electrical but I am sure nothing has changed. I will look shortly.

This has to be something small I over looked when reinstalling the motor. What other connections, Grounds etc could I have over looked that would cause this? I really need the help guys this needs to be back up and running tomorrow as I do not have a ride (Or at this point a wife) anymore.

---Yet more updates and Pics added---
Ok I tried a new ICM no change, tested the coil its coming up good. I was going to buy an MSD coil tonight but it looked used and broken... Autozone.

---More to add---
The White wire coming off the PCM thats supposed to tell the ICM to spark is supposedly supposed to be at 12v... mine is at 9-9.5v.

Any idea's?
--------END---------

Now I am running through the tests right now for signal with this new Opti... I tried my other ICM and nothing.

So it was not an easy ICM swap and I doubt both cars which had working ones could have gone bad too. So I just have to keep looking.

I will report my findings with the standard no start tests shortly.

Cross

iTrader: (10)

Ok out of the two ICM's one was sendingf no voltage the other does so theres one thats good.
(Going by the informastion here:
next test for a pulsing ground at the dark green wire(96-97) or the White/black wire (93-95) at the coil coming from the ICM. Do you have a pulsing ground?

Yes, next step
No Replace the ICM *note, I have seen a bad coil burn up an ICM. It might be a good time to replace or upgrade your coil*


next with your test light check for hot on the Pink wire at the coil. do you have hot?
Yes, Replace your coil *note, High resistance from bad plug wires can burn out coils. You can Ohm test plug wires or replace them if wanted*)

I get that pusling ground now but the coil wire has .10v on it so it would mean bad if I am reading this right. So I am going to go grab that MSD Coil now.

However the module thats sending the signal is the 96 one, that should not cause a problem on my 94 right?

383lt1impala

iTrader: (33)

if u have an msd box remember to connect it to the battery when i changed my opti i was like wtf! 3 days went by and i was **** im a moron i connected and vroom vroom.

Cross

iTrader: (10)

nope just the opti is msd, just got my new stock coil lets see what haapens.

Cross

iTrader: (10)

new coil, good icm nothing.

Running the tests again

the_merv

iTrader: (88)

I'm still leaning torward a break in your wiring bro..I've had it happen..that's why I say it. I'd do a continuity test on all your wires, pin them from the Connector to the PCM.

BTC

I haven't read the entire thread, but are you sure there aren't issues with the MSD Opti?

IronOutlaw

iTrader: (4)

ok i dont know if this will work on these cars but on my dads mustang and my volkswagen we took a hotwire and ran it from the positive side of the battery to the positive side of the coil to get spark. This told us the coil and distributor were good and it was something else in the wiring.

I would be leaning towards the wiring also.

Cross

iTrader: (10)

Now the Coil is bad and the ICM is bad.... this keeps changing and is making me mad.

Cross

iTrader: (10)

I will start playing with that then.. I hate tracing wires though.

the_merv

iTrader: (88)

^^ It's a bitch, but sometimes you got to do it..

Cross

iTrader: (10)

alright the ICM has power and gorund but there is no pulsing ground tot he coil... now its the ICM again... damit but the coil is good now

Cross

iTrader: (10)

Ok I have hot at the pink coil wire and no pusling ground at the coil... which means bad ICM with the no pulse and bad coil with the 12v at the coil on pink if I am reading this right... I am so confused

355z28

iTrader: (8)

are all the wires good and tight in the plugs? on of the pins didnt fall out of the plug when you unpluged it during the engine swap did it? that would cause it to get little or no connection at all on your ICM or coil, or opti.