Haans249

iTrader: (24)

I'm currently rewiring my LC-1's. I have a 6 wire and a 7 wire version. Before I was running both of them off of the vehicle harness for the rear o2 sensors. One hooked into each left and right bank rear o2, this way they switch on a off with the engine, switched power and heater ground. They are wired to spare male connectors. I've always been a little confused as to where to ground the green/white and white wires for the LC-1's. Before i just ran them all to the ground for the ciglighter, but eventually one of the LC1's would no longer work. The other still worked fine, hence now why I'm rewiring them. Where would be the proper place to ground those wires? Should I ground the green wire to the same place as the heater ground on the O2 bung, and then both whites to the EFILive analog ground? Is there a system ground on the stock O2 connector I can hook the whites to other than the heater ground?

This is a F-body 2001.

Thanks for any help!!
Adrian

Looks like i should be wiring the Blue and White at the same ground source, so both would run to the heater ground for the Stock o2?

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

Does anyone know where the heater ground for the stock O2's go to? Is it a fuse panel, PCM, or chassis ground? I haven't been able to find that information.

Should I just ground the blue/white/green wire to the heater ground part of the O2 sensors plug?

Doc

iTrader: (9)

blue = back of the head
green / white = datalogger (which gets ground via the data port when plugged in)

power from switchable source on fuse panel

Using the O2 sensor power / grounds is a fools paradise. Too much noise.

You will need to calibrate the analog inputs.

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

As it appears, going to scrap that idea.

In the newest manual, on page 6 it says "The BEST grounding scheme is all grounds (i.e., ECU, Gauges, LC1 heater, LC1 system, etc.) SOLDERED into a single lug and bolted to the engine block."

My old manual that came with the LC1 says that the system and analog ground should be grounded AWAY from the blue wire...wtf Innovate?

So it appears to be saying that you solder the blue, white, green wires together and then ground them all to the block.

As far as a switching 12V, what about the terminal on the driver's side of the engine bay, just north of the fuse panel? I currently have my stereo amp and racetronix fuel pump hooked to it. Would this matter to the LC1 as long as voltage stays 12-13v?

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

It won`t matter if you ground them all to the same point.
There is a lot of noise and the analog voltage will bounce a little.
Think about it, the PCM, airbag, ABS, and every thing else are all grounded to different point, and the engine is not a ground just floating in the engine bay.
It is grounded to the chassis with a scrawny ground strap.
Getting your power and ground from the NBO2`s is safe.
For 3 years i have had my LC1 power/ground from the rear NBO2 and
the analog power/ground and system ground (white) to the V2 (EFILive)
with no problem.
You are ok with having the white to the cig lighter ground.

Having an LC1 die is not uncommon but I highly doubt it is from how you have it wired.
Which one died BTW, the 7 or 6 wire?

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

Not sure which one it was that died. I'm not even sure if it did die or not, thats why I'm rewiring it. I'm going to just ground all wires to the block, and then switch power from the terminal. I'm going to run all wires using cutoff O2 connectors running into the console, so its like i'm adding to the wiring harness, and can easily pull the LC1 out if needed.

Not going to play around with wiring it any other way.

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

So, I checked over my car for a good way to hook this up.

In the fuse panel, on a 2001 F-body, there was a ETC part that was unused, and only had one connection in the fuse panel. Checked it out, and turns out its a switched 12V source! So, what I plan on doing is running the power from this part for BOTH my LC1's. Would this be ok?

Then, I'm going to run the Blue/White/Green wires all to the back of the head on the engine as stated to do in the new manual.

Hope this works!

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

It should be fine like that.
You might want to put a fuse inline.

Doc

iTrader: (9)

The digital to analog converter chip is the one that "dies." This is due in part to the massive amount of back fed voltage from the starter riding on the chassis. It won't kill it right off but after successive starts it will succumb to failure.

I can "fix" LC-1s for a small fee and can gurantee a quick turn around.

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

Where would I get a inline fuse from? I believe they require a 5amp fuse. Got a source online somewhere for a small inline i can use?

Thanks.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

You should be able to find an In-line Blade Fuse Holder locally.
Check out Radioshack, AZ, Napa, Walmart may have them.
They are $1.19 on Ebay with $8.77 shipping. LOL

Doc

iTrader: (9)

Just for reference this is what the 6 wire LC-1 looks like inside. You'll also note that this one has the blown diode protection ckt. Once the diode blows the DAC is next inline for destruction. It is not a Hollywood movie type explosion, rather after repeated back fed shocks from having the heater ground on the chassis. This explains the common phenomonom where "Hey the LC-1 was working just fine, then all of a sudden died," syndrom comes into play.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

Not to start an argument, but it seems that the LC1 is the only WBO2
that tends to have "ground" problems.
I personally think it is because of poor quality part that are installed in them
and/or poor workmanship.

I`m apt to think that because the engine gets it`s ground from the chassis
that the LC1 would still get that shock, I could be wrong though.
After all the are many things grounded to the chassis in these cars.
I`m not trying to argue, I`m just saying...
You should post up over at the Innovate Forum, you will definitely get some business.

Haans249

iTrader: (24)

No arguments.

I believe the block is grounded directly to the battery, not the chassis. I know there is ground straps that run from the harness to the block, and from the alternator to the chassis, but the main one I see is the one behind the starter that runs directly to the battery. Also, since many things ground to the chassis, it makes it a poor ground for precise electronics because it introduces lots of noise.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

Yes, but there is a ground strap from the block to the chassis not the alternator to chassis, the alternator i believe is grounded by the bracket to the block.
And the battery has a ground to the chassis as well.
Would`nt that transfer noise from the chassis to the block?
The NBO2`s are grounded from the PCM which is grounded to the engine.

If all noise can be eliminated I would like how.
This thread may get me onto a new project.

poolshark021

iTrader: (8)

The o2 heater ground circuit goes right to the back of the head. The sensor ground goes to the pcm.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

These are the same ground.
LS1 Ground Locations.doc

poolshark021

iTrader: (8)

Actually they are on different heads. G110 is on the right head and feeds the pcm, which in turn feeds the o2 sensor return. G112 is on the left head and directly feeds the o2 heater circuit.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

That should read driverside of the block, there are 3 wires to the same bolt. oops

What I`m saying is that everything is grounded either to the chassis or the engine block, the block and the chassis are connected together through the strap and the battery.
Would`nt anything that is grounded to the chassis transfer any kind of
surge or noise it has to the block and vice versa?

poolshark021

iTrader: (8)

I agree with you to a point. Basically a ground is a ground. I would be careful where am grounding the wideband heater though. I wouldn't want it going through the pcm first and then to the head. There is a reason the stock 02 sensors have seperate heater grounds that don't go through the pcm.