California Turbo legal issues....Resolved!!!!
02-25-2009, 11:21 PM
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California Turbo legal issues....Resolved!!!! As some of you may know, ive been trying to pinpoint exactly what California says is, and is not legal, when it comes to Turbocharging. I found info on sniffer tests, CARB numbers, all kinds of things. But i couldnt find what was actually required, and i didnt get a solid answer out of my three threads on here either. Well i contacted a state emissions rep, who runs his own shop and he gave me a great answer. First of all, this is the email i sent him;
Hi i had a question for you, since you have so much experience with ca emissions. What are the regulations regarding aftermarket turbo systems? I mean, i have a 96 WS6 Trans Am. Im looking at a STS rear mount turbo system which has CARB numbers. Theyre indented right into the pipes themselves. So is that all i need to be street legal in Ca? Do i just bolt it up and bring you my car to smog? Are the CARB numbers all i need to smog and register my car? Do i have to see a referee or anything? Should i just bring you my car and pay you to install it, does it have to be installed by an ASE certified mechanic?............... -Josh
This is what i got back;
Hey Josh
There is requirements on the emissions levels as well as the CARB label. The carb label is good enough for the visual section of the smog test, but the emissions still have to meet the requirements on exhaust gas levels. I can install them for yoif you want. I just can't guarantee your emissions will be perfect afterward. Did the system come with software? You will probably need to adjust fuel delivery for the added boost. Also california's referee service isn't available at this time (just to let you know what's up), the budget screwed them. I am more than happy to install the turbo kit for you. Give me a call to set up a free estimate.
I know, i know. Not everything's answered. But after an hour, he then sent me this email;
Hey Josh
I checked on that turbo setup and it should make your car one of the cleanest burning on the road. You nox emissions will be good enough to pass smog as well. Give me a call when you get it. Also as long as you only run 5-8 pounds of boost your stock set up will be sufficient. If you go any higher you will lean out meaning not enough fuel and it will devour pistons. So, if you do want more boost just buy the recommended program, fuel injectors, pump, and regulator. I can install all of that.
So it looks like all we need it CARB and a sniffer after all. Many people told me that even with CARB #'s, i would fail visual, but i would pass the sniffer test. Looks like this is all we need after all. Hopefully all goes well. Ill let everyone know once i have it smogged and registered. Hope this helps you guys out!!! I know it helped me get past a great deal of frustration!
Hi i had a question for you, since you have so much experience with ca emissions. What are the regulations regarding aftermarket turbo systems? I mean, i have a 96 WS6 Trans Am. Im looking at a STS rear mount turbo system which has CARB numbers. Theyre indented right into the pipes themselves. So is that all i need to be street legal in Ca? Do i just bolt it up and bring you my car to smog? Are the CARB numbers all i need to smog and register my car? Do i have to see a referee or anything? Should i just bring you my car and pay you to install it, does it have to be installed by an ASE certified mechanic?............... -Josh
This is what i got back;
Hey Josh
There is requirements on the emissions levels as well as the CARB label. The carb label is good enough for the visual section of the smog test, but the emissions still have to meet the requirements on exhaust gas levels. I can install them for yoif you want. I just can't guarantee your emissions will be perfect afterward. Did the system come with software? You will probably need to adjust fuel delivery for the added boost. Also california's referee service isn't available at this time (just to let you know what's up), the budget screwed them. I am more than happy to install the turbo kit for you. Give me a call to set up a free estimate.
I know, i know. Not everything's answered. But after an hour, he then sent me this email;
Hey Josh
I checked on that turbo setup and it should make your car one of the cleanest burning on the road. You nox emissions will be good enough to pass smog as well. Give me a call when you get it. Also as long as you only run 5-8 pounds of boost your stock set up will be sufficient. If you go any higher you will lean out meaning not enough fuel and it will devour pistons. So, if you do want more boost just buy the recommended program, fuel injectors, pump, and regulator. I can install all of that.
So it looks like all we need it CARB and a sniffer after all. Many people told me that even with CARB #'s, i would fail visual, but i would pass the sniffer test. Looks like this is all we need after all. Hopefully all goes well. Ill let everyone know once i have it smogged and registered. Hope this helps you guys out!!! I know it helped me get past a great deal of frustration!
02-25-2009, 11:48 PM
#2
Whoever told you it would fail a visual with a CARB number doesn't know what they're talking about. That's exactly what the company got the part CARB certified for, it costs a lot of money.
Best thing to do is just move out of the Smog **** state, then you don't have to worry about it.
Best thing to do is just move out of the Smog **** state, then you don't have to worry about it.
02-25-2009, 11:51 PM
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Wow, that is the first guy doing emissions testing that sounds like he knows what he is talking about. Now just get him to find the loophole so I can get my Firebird to pass. 
02-25-2009, 11:54 PM
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Whoever told you it would fail a visual with a CARB number doesn't know what they're talking about. That's exactly what the company got the part CARB certified for, it costs a lot of money.
Best thing to do is just move out of the Smog **** state, then you don't have to worry about it.
Best thing to do is just move out of the Smog **** state, then you don't have to worry about it.
And before you start, Los Angelas has smog, not the whole state! And it probably IS the reason for these laws but at least theyre doing something about it!
02-25-2009, 11:56 PM
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A turbo would be a pretty silly reason to leave my home. H/C set ups are legal lol. I'll never leave Ca unless its to Sydney or Tokyo. Ca is the best place to live by far, IMO. All these laws are, believe it or not, for our own good. Theyre making the biggest attempt in the country to keep our air clean. I would much prefer that everyone in the country have to leap through these hoops rather than dumping excess, unnecessary waste into the air we all breath everyday, and depend on to survive. But i've been called a **** lol.
And before you start, Los Angelas has smog, not the whole state! And it probably IS the reason for these laws but at least theyre doing something about it!
And before you start, Los Angelas has smog, not the whole state! And it probably IS the reason for these laws but at least theyre doing something about it!
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02-26-2009, 12:35 AM
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it says on STS's website that only the GTO and Vette systems are covered under the carb #. here
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine
02-26-2009, 01:07 AM
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it says on STS's website that only the GTO and Vette systems are covered under the carb #. here
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine
02-26-2009, 01:37 PM
#11
According to the Air Resource Board, these are the smog legal kits from STS:
http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/eo/D-593.pdf
http://www.arb.ca.gov
We have undergone several CARB submission at my work, the CARB process is very costly and very strict. It is not something that can easily be accomplished by the home mechanic, nor will it pass the certification process. Go to the site I provided for a clear understanding of what is involve, or I can try and answer your questions.
http://arb.ca.gov/msprog/aftermkt/devices/eo/D-593.pdf
http://www.arb.ca.gov
We have undergone several CARB submission at my work, the CARB process is very costly and very strict. It is not something that can easily be accomplished by the home mechanic, nor will it pass the certification process. Go to the site I provided for a clear understanding of what is involve, or I can try and answer your questions.
02-26-2009, 02:03 PM
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x2 you couldnt pay me to live in that state. At least states like AZ have exemptions for seasonal, mostly track vehicles. Ohio has a good system as well, only the 5 largest populated counties have emissions testing and its only every 2 years. MI we have it made, no testing at all (knocks on wood), I have a feeling that will change. It will hurt my profession and hobby A LOT when it does. Hopefully the moron lawmakers have a grandfather clause.
02-26-2009, 02:10 PM
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x2 you couldnt pay me to live in that state. At least states like AZ have exemptions for seasonal, mostly track vehicles. Ohio has a good system as well, only the 5 largest populated counties have emissions testing and its only every 2 years. MI we have it made, no testing at all (knocks on wood), I have a feeling that will change. It will hurt my profession and hobby A LOT when it does. Hopefully the moron lawmakers have a grandfather clause.
. At least I can drive my Camaro year-round. I'll just keep doing what I do now, which is using a smog place that overlooks my visual. Its not that hard, they are everywhere. 
02-27-2009, 01:23 AM
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You guys are horrible! LOL. I would get caught, i get caught no matter what i do. Iknow so many cops too.....and honestly you never know who'll turn you in. Plus i have to register on base and they can really poke around if they want
02-27-2009, 12:45 PM
#19
The reasons many cars with "carb certified systems" still will fail visual is becasue 99% of the time the car will also have fuel/air delivery parts that are NOT part of the kit. Also, many techs would be affraid to sign their name on such cars because they are not educated enough about what all is included on the kit, and they are scared that if they pass a car that later fails at a REF, they would lose their license and face stiff fines.......so they just fail the visual.
03-29-2009, 03:43 PM
#20
it says on STS's website that only the GTO and Vette systems are covered under the carb #. here
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine
With that said, my kit still came with a carb sticker on the intake piping and the car passed smog (sniffer) just fine with all the stock smog equipment (manifolds, cats, air).
As long as you have a good tune in it you should be fine