robertbartsch

Anyone using these....?

Are these the "ringless" variety or the two skinny ring type that fit in a single piston land grove?

...I saw an article in a mag where the engine builder was building a big block for the Engine Masters Challenge. He used a lot of coated stuff and claimed that the use of Total Seal Piston rings were worth 10HP. He also said the rings were great for street engines too...

LS1x2

iTrader: (11)

Run. Run as a far as you can from these things!
I had a bad experience with oil control using these rings as have all other people I have talked to about these with ls1's.

I've also seen them work just fine in an LT1 and other SBC's. Engine builders will usually give you different opinions depending on who you talk to.

TEA Brent

I agree, these rings always have oil problems.

Fireball

iTrader: (21)

I had SEVERE oiling problems with those rings. Burned 1qt of oil in 300-500 miles and/or one night of racing.

Just a simple change of rings to diamond pro-selects fixed that problem

SStrokerAce

iTrader: (2)

If you use a low drag oil ring then, yeah that's going to happen unless you take some pressure out of the crankcase. Which everyone seems to think is not a big deal. Well it is a big deal.

In the Engine Masters Challenge we are worried about friction and more oil ring drag hurts that a TON. So a lower tension setup is the way to go.

Now it's not just oil ring tension. It's the cylinder wall surface finish and that's complicated because the only way you know it's good is to measure it. To do that you have to have the right parts.

So like everything else it's a system, crankcase pressure, oil ring tension and cylidner wall finish have to be right for the application.

If you don't do these things, then yeah your going to run into the problems of burning oil that everyones sees.

Bret

robertbartsch

...so when doing a stroker, for example, the piston manufacturor should specify both (i) the ring type, and (ii) the honning surface and bore size?

This suggests you buy the pistons before you hone the block which I thought was backwards???

I thought I might avoid some machining by using a new block; do new GM blocks need to be finish honed too?

Thanks...

Old SStroker

Always have the piston and rings before you finish hone the block. The honing guy needs to measure your pistons with the same gages he's using to set his bore gage.

The ring manufacturer should specify the bore finish and honing techniques to achieve it.The piston manufacturer needs to make the ring grooves the right width and square to the outside of the piston. Some are much better than others.

If I were using a new GM block, or any block, I would hone per the ring manufacturer's guidelines. Depending on the actual bore size, you might need to bore and hone, or even buy oversize pistons if the bore is already giving you too much clearance.

So, IMO, 1) obtain the block and measure the bores. If they need to go O/S to clean up scratches, etc (used block) decide how much, then..
2) buy pistons and rings for the bore size you need
3) bore (if necessary) and hone to fit pistons.

My $.02

Cstraub

iTrader: (1)

If you are after good leak numbers then use them. . . that's all I can say and be politically correct.

Cstraub

H82BBad

they suck for oil control.

larger ring endgaps keep the oil control ring's clean.