My99 problems questions, ideas..
07-04-2009, 10:12 AM
#1
My99 problems questions, ideas.. I have been running in 3 bar sd for a month or so now. Car was running not too bad. Idle has been rich but think have that fixed. Decel is still rich.
I have new plugs gapped to around .030 .TR6ix for low boost 7.5psi . I have new granetlli ht wires.
Fuel filter is new, twin lonnies pumps, big lines,rails, currently 60 pound injectors and running 7.5psi max . Nitrous is not being used yet.
Sticking to gate psi which is 7.5psi. Haven't seen past 8psi on the boost guage.
Car pulls high vacuum at idle around 18inches steady. Have that gt7 cam with 1.8 rockers. around .590 lift. Supposed to have 8019 valve springs they are supposed to come standard in the afr 225 heads since like 2007. They are good for .650 lift.
Now the problem. Car drives around pretty good but when you give it a lot of throttle like wot or near wot it seems to pop,backfire..it does this at lower rpm,higher rpm..pretty much anytime you go near or at wot and even when think boost is just starting to come in. I have gone wot with it and sometimes it seems ok afr at wot was like 12 to 1 as when had timing where it was before at around 12 degrees max it had no knock.
I am running pump 94 no alc/meth injection.
I have my pe set at like 12.3 across the board. Since read my gasohol 94 runs .5 leaner if you dont' set the stoic for it but leave it at gas setting. So that would give 12.8 pe when out of boost for target afr.
I set my boost pe at 11.0 again figure was targetting 11.5 due to the gasohol and have not set ve so that might be why got 12.0 on brief wot run.
I have to make some logs and post my tune for you hptuner guys to look at. I have not gotten any help on the hptuners board at all. I wanted to do a power balance test but can't figure out exact procedure to do that. I can't read misfire with the 3 bar sd it disables it. I might have to put maf back on and my 1bar map and then can check misfire again and the 1bar. Guess would have to write over the 3 bar not sure if this will use up credits putting the 1bar non sd back in and then going to the 3bar again after get things checked out. I thought power balance might also find maybe a cylinder that isn't firing.I think its firing all 8 as the vacuum is as said high.Still pain to have misfire not useable.
I don't think its spark blow out.As said its happening at low rpm.And pretty sure at very low boost levels. And 8psi is not much boost. I could see it possibly being a wire maybe not on the plug all the way. Thats why misfire would be nice to look at.
I can't see it being valve float if do have the 8019 in there and again this is at low rpm. I realized should maybe set both my pumps to be same pressure at idle..???? I just set the one. The second fuel pump comes on at 5psi with hobbs switch..
Could the pumps be putting in two much fuel ?. I think I am getting the backfire pop in exhaust not intake. at least it feels that way. Maybe need someone to follow my car when its doing this.It sounds like an antilag almost when its happening. My lingenfelter box is not hooked up either. and for sure my rev limiters in hptuners are set right to 6500currently.
I don't think its tuning . Should I blend that pe down after 3000 to be closer to the ratio that am using for boost pe?? Could having the pe right across mess things up when it goes to boost pe. Figured that was supposed to override the non boost pe anyway.
Can too little timing cause a popping and backfiring like antilag effect.
I figured with my 9.5 to 1 and 94 octane propably about 15 is max timing range for 7.5psi? Did try 18 and car got snappier but was seeing some knock like 2.9 degrees so backed the timing back down.
Anyone else got some ideas and if anyone has a working sd tune running similar stuff would really like to take a peak at it. I will try to get my tune posted and some logs posted in next day or so. Could really use a tune that works well with even the 60s that am using temporarily. This Greg guy is coming out with new dvd that has proper settings for them trying to order it.
I got two new o2s but pretty sure they are working fine. Will be installing them in a few days.
I pulled one plug so far and it looked fine. Problem is really driving me nuts.
I have new plugs gapped to around .030 .TR6ix for low boost 7.5psi . I have new granetlli ht wires.
Fuel filter is new, twin lonnies pumps, big lines,rails, currently 60 pound injectors and running 7.5psi max . Nitrous is not being used yet.
Sticking to gate psi which is 7.5psi. Haven't seen past 8psi on the boost guage.
Car pulls high vacuum at idle around 18inches steady. Have that gt7 cam with 1.8 rockers. around .590 lift. Supposed to have 8019 valve springs they are supposed to come standard in the afr 225 heads since like 2007. They are good for .650 lift.
Now the problem. Car drives around pretty good but when you give it a lot of throttle like wot or near wot it seems to pop,backfire..it does this at lower rpm,higher rpm..pretty much anytime you go near or at wot and even when think boost is just starting to come in. I have gone wot with it and sometimes it seems ok afr at wot was like 12 to 1 as when had timing where it was before at around 12 degrees max it had no knock.
I am running pump 94 no alc/meth injection.
I have my pe set at like 12.3 across the board. Since read my gasohol 94 runs .5 leaner if you dont' set the stoic for it but leave it at gas setting. So that would give 12.8 pe when out of boost for target afr.
I set my boost pe at 11.0 again figure was targetting 11.5 due to the gasohol and have not set ve so that might be why got 12.0 on brief wot run.
I have to make some logs and post my tune for you hptuner guys to look at. I have not gotten any help on the hptuners board at all. I wanted to do a power balance test but can't figure out exact procedure to do that. I can't read misfire with the 3 bar sd it disables it. I might have to put maf back on and my 1bar map and then can check misfire again and the 1bar. Guess would have to write over the 3 bar not sure if this will use up credits putting the 1bar non sd back in and then going to the 3bar again after get things checked out. I thought power balance might also find maybe a cylinder that isn't firing.I think its firing all 8 as the vacuum is as said high.Still pain to have misfire not useable.
I don't think its spark blow out.As said its happening at low rpm.And pretty sure at very low boost levels. And 8psi is not much boost. I could see it possibly being a wire maybe not on the plug all the way. Thats why misfire would be nice to look at.
I can't see it being valve float if do have the 8019 in there and again this is at low rpm. I realized should maybe set both my pumps to be same pressure at idle..???? I just set the one. The second fuel pump comes on at 5psi with hobbs switch..
Could the pumps be putting in two much fuel ?. I think I am getting the backfire pop in exhaust not intake. at least it feels that way. Maybe need someone to follow my car when its doing this.It sounds like an antilag almost when its happening. My lingenfelter box is not hooked up either. and for sure my rev limiters in hptuners are set right to 6500currently.
I don't think its tuning . Should I blend that pe down after 3000 to be closer to the ratio that am using for boost pe?? Could having the pe right across mess things up when it goes to boost pe. Figured that was supposed to override the non boost pe anyway.
Can too little timing cause a popping and backfiring like antilag effect.
I figured with my 9.5 to 1 and 94 octane propably about 15 is max timing range for 7.5psi? Did try 18 and car got snappier but was seeing some knock like 2.9 degrees so backed the timing back down.
Anyone else got some ideas and if anyone has a working sd tune running similar stuff would really like to take a peak at it. I will try to get my tune posted and some logs posted in next day or so. Could really use a tune that works well with even the 60s that am using temporarily. This Greg guy is coming out with new dvd that has proper settings for them trying to order it.
I got two new o2s but pretty sure they are working fine. Will be installing them in a few days.
I pulled one plug so far and it looked fine. Problem is really driving me nuts.
Last edited by MY99TAWS6; 07-04-2009 at 01:16 PM.
07-04-2009, 12:32 PM
#3
I live in Saskatchewan. We have no good FI tuners here. We have a couple guys that know NA. I likely know more than them when it comes to FI tuning.I have tuned lots of cars, dsm ,lt1s, and many FI cars in past.I have pretty good grasp of hptuners but could still use a few tips.
Ok if its rich then will try a few things. Maybe second pump is coming in too soon.
Ok if its rich then will try a few things. Maybe second pump is coming in too soon.
07-04-2009, 06:17 PM
#4
Bit more test and tune today. I can part throttle it to redline but if nail it wot even at lower rpm then it starts the machine gun backfire type of sound. Its definitely exhaust not intake so for sure rich.
I disconnected one fuel pump ,since one comes on at 5psi. Thought that might lean it out some but same thing at wot. I don't think need that second pump anyway at 7.5psi.
So guess now can try to lean out things maybe in the boost pe tables and see what happens. If that don't do it then maybe check wires or plugs. Car seems to be running on all 8 though. I am pretty sure gapped the plugs downt o .028 to .030. Maybe the iridiums like a bit bigger gap than copper plugs. I did gap them carefully I have gapped them before.You just use the type of gapper that don't have you touching the center electrode it is fragile.
I disconnected one fuel pump ,since one comes on at 5psi. Thought that might lean it out some but same thing at wot. I don't think need that second pump anyway at 7.5psi.
So guess now can try to lean out things maybe in the boost pe tables and see what happens. If that don't do it then maybe check wires or plugs. Car seems to be running on all 8 though. I am pretty sure gapped the plugs downt o .028 to .030. Maybe the iridiums like a bit bigger gap than copper plugs. I did gap them carefully I have gapped them before.You just use the type of gapper that don't have you touching the center electrode it is fragile.
07-05-2009, 06:36 PM
#6
I thought they only closed shut at higher boost like past 10psi. I have bought 3 inch oval pipe and was going to stent them but didn't do it yet figured no rush at 7.5psi.
Woudl that give syptom of backfire type of machine gun sound or would that simply stop boost.
I also had someone behind me tell me had oil think when punched it don't see any oil normal driving .I have scavenger pump also to install.
If these turbos give me any trouble just going to order the LG ones not going to mess around.Just wanted to get thru season with the aps ones. I have some ebay spare centers but think as said just go to the LG ones.
Woudl that give syptom of backfire type of machine gun sound or would that simply stop boost.
I also had someone behind me tell me had oil think when punched it don't see any oil normal driving .I have scavenger pump also to install.
If these turbos give me any trouble just going to order the LG ones not going to mess around.Just wanted to get thru season with the aps ones. I have some ebay spare centers but think as said just go to the LG ones.
07-06-2009, 09:03 PM
#7
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mine did something simular to that the first time i tuned it, i guess since i started rich it smutted up the plugs. They looked fine buy when i put new ones in the problem went away and its been fine since
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07-08-2009, 01:16 AM
#9
That is nice offer. I will try to do that next little while. Current tune is in 2.23 format and now have 2.22 back in since 2.23 was beta. So wondering if can just read ecu to get a readable latest tune..or guess can send the 2.23 tune directly even if can't open or read it?
Also wondering can I simply turn on the maf and check misfires will the car even drive with the 3bar map if I turn on the maf again? I really don't think my current problems are tune but are wires,plugs,something like that.
Also wondering can I simply turn on the maf and check misfires will the car even drive with the 3bar map if I turn on the maf again? I really don't think my current problems are tune but are wires,plugs,something like that.
07-09-2009, 06:21 PM
#10
Sorry bit of duplication in my other similar thread.
I did misfire at idle and it was fine and revved it at idle to 3000 also fine on the misfires.
I did power balance test and it was very close on that also. Car don't seem like its missing at idle.
We blocked off line to intake and put breather in valve cover to see if oil was coming thru into intake thru that line. We also revved to check for blowby and looked at hood after running car fairly hard today. No much oil misting.
Checked intercooler and nothing really could be felt there but there was a bit of oil in tb ?So still think some is coming thru intake line. Have catch can to install in that line to better monitor things.
We were thinking this machine gun at wot is maybe oil igniting ? Could that make popping and backfiring sounds?
Other theory is way low timing. Running like 15 degrees from 2800 thru redline. Would that be too low and make it machine gun at wot especially when boost hits and usually hammer it at 3000 so it would be already in boost in third. If don't go wot I can take it up with decent throttle to redline clean pull and its still seeing some boost. I am running baby boost 7.5psi . I have 9.5 to 1 compression. Gas is e10 94 octane. Timing as said is 15 degrees max. Buddy who is helping me is pro racer but carb guy and he said maybe my timing is way low?
I guess it could be a plug or wire but as said misfire and power balance tests at idle were not showing anything.
I am not sure if can drive the car to test misfire without going back to old maf tune and reinstalling 1bar? Today I simply put maf back on ,hooked it up and turned maf back on by not failing it. Car started and idled ok? Could I have actually drove the car with a 3 bar map tune and the maf not failed. Figured it would be way whacked when went wot ?
I guess to do that will have to put the 1bar on and the non sd tune back./
Do I have to do write entires for that or can I just flash calibration the non sd tune and then flash the sd back in or do I need to do two write entires..not clear on that?
Also I redid my tune in 2.22 format so should be able to send them shortly. I didn't log today laptop was near dead after messing around.
Buddy said to throw more timing at it and see if it gets better closely watching for knock of course. So far seen zero knock retard. Weather was about 75 today not too hot.
So any more ideas guys? I wish the 99 was easy to check plugs. My 97 talon is too too easy. This 99 is a pain. Especially the back passenger side.
I did misfire at idle and it was fine and revved it at idle to 3000 also fine on the misfires.
I did power balance test and it was very close on that also. Car don't seem like its missing at idle.
We blocked off line to intake and put breather in valve cover to see if oil was coming thru into intake thru that line. We also revved to check for blowby and looked at hood after running car fairly hard today. No much oil misting.
Checked intercooler and nothing really could be felt there but there was a bit of oil in tb ?So still think some is coming thru intake line. Have catch can to install in that line to better monitor things.
We were thinking this machine gun at wot is maybe oil igniting ? Could that make popping and backfiring sounds?
Other theory is way low timing. Running like 15 degrees from 2800 thru redline. Would that be too low and make it machine gun at wot especially when boost hits and usually hammer it at 3000 so it would be already in boost in third. If don't go wot I can take it up with decent throttle to redline clean pull and its still seeing some boost. I am running baby boost 7.5psi . I have 9.5 to 1 compression. Gas is e10 94 octane. Timing as said is 15 degrees max. Buddy who is helping me is pro racer but carb guy and he said maybe my timing is way low?
I guess it could be a plug or wire but as said misfire and power balance tests at idle were not showing anything.
I am not sure if can drive the car to test misfire without going back to old maf tune and reinstalling 1bar? Today I simply put maf back on ,hooked it up and turned maf back on by not failing it. Car started and idled ok? Could I have actually drove the car with a 3 bar map tune and the maf not failed. Figured it would be way whacked when went wot ?
I guess to do that will have to put the 1bar on and the non sd tune back./
Do I have to do write entires for that or can I just flash calibration the non sd tune and then flash the sd back in or do I need to do two write entires..not clear on that?
Also I redid my tune in 2.22 format so should be able to send them shortly. I didn't log today laptop was near dead after messing around.
Buddy said to throw more timing at it and see if it gets better closely watching for knock of course. So far seen zero knock retard. Weather was about 75 today not too hot.
So any more ideas guys? I wish the 99 was easy to check plugs. My 97 talon is too too easy. This 99 is a pain. Especially the back passenger side.
07-09-2009, 11:48 PM
#11
Ok here is tune no logs yet.
The car does machine gun thing at pretty much any rpm when you go wot.
It does it out of boost .If hit it at 2000 in fourth wot it does it. It does it in third at 3000 which is where it would see boost. It does it at pretty much any rpm in boost or out.
The car does machine gun thing at pretty much any rpm when you go wot.
It does it out of boost .If hit it at 2000 in fourth wot it does it. It does it in third at 3000 which is where it would see boost. It does it at pretty much any rpm in boost or out.
07-11-2009, 07:08 PM
#12
logs.. First log shows problem .At 100% throttle looks like right bank goes very lean when it happens but injector look like they are still firing.So would think its misfire or spark blowout? Oh not sure how to get my map to read boost properly or if have to pick a different PID.
Boost shows like 5.3 psi at idle I think it was .?
I should have logged engine speed maybe too.
Second log shows car not into wot but wondering why it goes closed loop at such low throttle positions? Is this normal..wasn't getting into any boost or not much. My mechanical boost gauge showed about 5psi or so think 8briefly I don't stay into it as it makes that machine gun noise at wot.
Boost shows like 5.3 psi at idle I think it was .?
I should have logged engine speed maybe too.
Second log shows car not into wot but wondering why it goes closed loop at such low throttle positions? Is this normal..wasn't getting into any boost or not much. My mechanical boost gauge showed about 5psi or so think 8briefly I don't stay into it as it makes that machine gun noise at wot.
