01Trans Am WS6

iTrader: (5)

I have a TR224 112 all bolt-ons which heads would be best for my setup. Also which would make me the most power.
Thx in advance.

Sales2@Texas-speed

iTrader: (5)

We've done engine dyno testing with our 228R camshaft in the past (gives a good enough picture of the differences in heads). The "competitor 205" head is the AFR 205 head.

jasycz28

iTrader: (15)

Damn it I have to get those PRC 215's.

Jason 98 TA

iTrader: (4)

as always we'd be happy to test the cylinder heads for you on the engine dyno if you'd like. Cylinder head testing is one of my favorite things to do!

john563

iTrader: (17)

how does your prc 215 compare to your stage 2.5 5.3 heads which I currently have?

lilbuddy1587

iTrader: (1)

Based off of the results that have been posted lately concerning the PRC LS6 heads and PRC 5.3 heads, I do not believe this comparison.

How do we know these aren't one off heads with "super" attention to detail and PERFECT hand finishing/VJ blending? I'm not saying the AFR is king and that your stuff is sub par but based on whats been provided as of late, this is rather inconsistent, don't you think?

jkkaz

Easy, you fly out to Texas and throw the set of heads you're going to buy on an engine and flog it on the dyno.

I saw an open offer on calling BS on their dyno runs, so it's time to either put up or shut up.

Sales2@Texas-speed

iTrader: (5)

I understand that some people will always have these doubts, and all I can do is assure you that they were regular heads without any extra work done. We can repeat the tests with you present anytime you can be here (or a friend of yours, etc) if that helps. We have nothing to hide and are always offering folks to come check us out anytime! The door's always open!

Red99TA

iTrader: (11)

Interesting results. It looks like the 205's are down 10RWTQ/15RWHP on the PRC 215's. You said all the heads are as-cast with no extra work done. Curious on the following:

Gasket used with each combination?
Timing used with each combination?
Any milling done on any of the heads?
A/F ratio on all the combos?

Just to make sure we're comparing apples to apples (comp ratio, quench, tune, etc.). One head might tolerate more/less timing than another so the tune is going to definitely have an effect on your results but I know you guys already know that.

Sales2@Texas-speed

iTrader: (5)

The heads were milled to net the same static compression with the GM MLS gasket. Each was tuned to achieve same AF, timing set for max power without KR (just to the point of KR and then backed off in most cases, some just didn't make any more power with more timing), etc to ensure apples to apples.

willyfastz

Some say the TFS 215s are the best, deff. better trusted.

AINT SKEERED

iTrader: (2)

its funny that not only did the prc casted heads out do the AFR's but so did the 5.3 prc heads.

AINT SKEERED

iTrader: (2)

lots of newbies are going to jump out and by the budget heads based off of these comparisons, got to pay for that dyno at all cost right?

willyfastz

It does appear that the new PRC 215's are decent heads. But I'm wondering if the QC on them is going to go the same as all the other PRC heads.

Tony Mamo @ AFR

iTrader: (13)

Guys,

Regarding the dyno data provided by Texas Speed, I think it goes without saying this type of thing is better handled (and received) if an independent party handles all the testing (for obvious reasons).

I have plenty of brand "P" data that I neglected to post or compare over the years....coming from the source (myself) most of it would be discounted anyway and I feel there is something underhanded about it as much as you would like to shout it from the rooftops.

Instead I focus on promoting our product on its own merits as best I can....even my huge "flow thread" while I could have buried numerous products and company claims, it was all handled as politically correct as possible providing most of you with alot of food for thought and alot of things to think about. The outcome from reading thru it (in short) simply being don't believe all the hype regarding published flow data. Before I started that thread there was more BS numbers being thrown around the net than you could shake a stick at. Hell, at the time every head flowed 300 CFM, and the better ones easily over 320 (reality.....not even close).

What I say is look at all the independent dyno data and results circulating about the cylinder heads in question or the cylinder heads you may be considering purchasing. Also, its important to try and get data from more than one shop because that is a much better barometer. Installs done by guys like yourself finally dyno'ed at the local shop that doesn't have a care in the world regarding the outcome is easily the best cross section of data to pour over and learn from. Most people are here to sell product and earn a living....not just provide customer support. Some more than others obviously.

Also, include/consider the other very important aspects of a purchase of this nature such as quality control, repeatability, customer service, and reliability....not to mention resale value.

When you do and assuming you place a value on alot of that important criteria I just mentioned, I assure you that "Competitor 205" will be something you should give alot more serious thought to, even if it means saving up a little longer. Its a proven performer that delivers every time.

Also, how many unhappy AFR owners are out there versus some of the other choices you might have. Tough to find an owner of our product not thrilled with his purchase and that statement goes a long way.

I bit my tongue all day whether to engage in this thread but I felt the need to say my peace in as tactful a manner as possible while still getting my point across. We have been doing this for close to forty years and we absolutely specialize in this field.....name another company as single focused as AFR.....good luck with that.

Take your time doing the research.....I assure you the more time you take the better our product is going to look.

And check this out whenever you get a chance

http://www.airflowresearch.com/why_afr.php

Regards,
Tony

99Ls1fever

iTrader: (3)

I love Texas Speed and have dropped 8k there in over the past three years. But I would rather have AFR Heads anytime of the day!

Hilton

iTrader: (36)

I'd like to see the TrickFlow CNC 215cc added to that graph just for fun.

JS01

iTrader: (10)

I LOL'D 8 TIMES

at that chart.

OP, get the AFR's.

Gh0st

iTrader: (3)

Marketing at its finest.

Johny GTO

Very tactfully and professionally handled, Tony. I am sure you could have turned this into a monsterous pissing match, hurling insults back and forth, and posting graphs and info that show disasterous results from people using PRC heads. However, you took the high road. Perhaps you are a better man than I.

Texas Speed,
This comes across as a major douche bag move in my opinion. I'm sorry, it really does. I'm not sure why, because a thread comparing cams wouldnt make me feel that way. Perhaps its because in cam threads, its a matter of "this cam works better in this setup", where as in this thread i got the feeling it was a "my heads are better than their heads" kinda thing. PErhaps that was because in this thread, it wasnt presented like "hey guys, we have some dyno results from a head swap we did. ON THIS SETUP, we actually got better results out of our heads than a well known after market head". Now you could have left out the name, you could have stressed that it was "on this setup", etc. Instead it came across as "our head is better, period end of story.".

I think thats pretty dick. I think if Tony would have put up a thread like this, where his heads crushed yours, you would be pretty pissed off and calling for him to remove the thread because it was low class. As Tony said, i am sure he could put up plenty of graphs where your heads got their clocks cleaned, plenty of flow bench results where your heads performed no where near they should have, etc. I myself have seen some horrible heads come out of your shop. Terrible performance, terrible quality control, etc. Usually, it gets swept under the rug.

This was a shitty move all around.