Gen 5 Camaro Internal Engine Tech - L99 Camaros Running Much Slower Than Advertised

What does everyone make of this?

I've been reading some 5th gen. forums out there. It seems many of the L99s are running super rich and super slow.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34158

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31570

This one seems relatively healthy.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29464

This guy's L99 5th gen. can barely get out of it's own way and is recording 60mph times over 7 seconds. He is making a big issue out of it with GM.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32317

GM still doesn't know how to tune and/or implement DoD/AFM or whatever its called.

And I imagine its easier to notice their short comings in a performance application.

There are a pretty big handfull of guys with slow l99s right now. Mine dynoed 321rwhp and like 335rw tq. But its still running rich all throughout the powerband.

I have a feeling its a lot to do with torque management, because when you get into second it feels like a different car.

HA. I am glad I have a LS3.

No satifaction issues here.

There are a pretty big handfull of guys with slow l99s right now. Mine dynoed 321rwhp and like 335rw tq. But its still running rich all throughout the powerband.

I have a feeling its a lot to do with torque management, because when you get into second it feels like a different car.

Have you been to the track yet?

mine runs fine, I have heard of maybe 3 L99 cars that legitamly run slow, the others are a classic case of too much car for the driver

TM is killing these heavy cars. That is truly all I think it really is.

I don't know why they didn't just offer the LS3 with the A6. With 6 different gear ratio's there no no reason why they couldn't get the same mileage as the M6 which is 1mpg less on the highway as the L99. They were able to do it with the V6. Would have solved a lot of issues.

Take a look at what we found with this one. http://www.exoticperformanceplus.com/projectCar.php?car=62 The car hit the rev limiter right before the 2nd gear shift, which then momentarily closed the throttle. Correcting it dropped the 1/4 mile time by .5! Bob

HA. I am glad I have a LS3.

No satifaction issues here.

I had an L76 G8 GT for about a year. It too felt a bit sleepy at low speeds or cruising. It woke up though when you give it throttle, pretty fast at WOT.

But still, people aren't buying V8 cars because they want that extra 1mpg or their cars to feel like they're on sleeping meds. I also noticed slight vibration in four-cylinder mode through the seats and wheel. You could hear it too.

I seriously can't fathom why anyone in GM thought greenwashing a muscle car like the G8 or Camaro was a good idea.

I'm so glad I sold the GT and got an LS3 GXP, it feels so much better. Why can't Camaro owners be treated to an LS3/A6 combo as well?

What does everyone make of this?

I've been reading some 5th gen. forums out there. It seems many of the L99s are running super rich and super slow.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34158

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31570

This one seems relatively healthy.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29464

This guy's L99 5th gen. can barely get out of it's own way and is recording 60mph times over 7 seconds. He is making a big issue out of it with GM.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32317


I been following some of these threads too... I feel for these owners :( And they're not getting much of a resolution or answer so far. I'm sure an aftermarket tune would cure their problems but then they'd risk losing their warranties

This is why you should always buy the manly transmission in a sports car. Maybe GM figured the limp-wristed automatic buyers wouldn't mind limp-wristed performance to match?

:)

This is why you should always buy the manly transmission in a sports car. Maybe GM figured the limp-wristed automatic buyers wouldn't mind limp-wristed performance to match?

:)

Hey, Im not limp wristed!!!




wait a second, am I?









:wrist:


Seriously though, some peeps could only get the new camaro if we bought it in auto.....per the wife. LOL Im such not a man.

If your wife made you buy an automatic... sad.

My wife made me buy the manual, even she doesn't like weaksauce auto sports cars. :)

My wife will have no say in my non daily driver. But I'm not married yet anyways so :)

My wife cant drive my Formula because its manual but honestly I could care less because I really dont want her to drive MY fun car.

Same story with all OEM tunes.
Loads of room for improvement, dont be so surprised. GM doesnt want busted drivetrains turning up for warranty claims.
If you want more power you got to be prepared to pay for it. Get yourself a decent tune :)

My wife cant drive my Formula because its manual but honestly I could care less because I really dont want her to drive MY fun car.

Unless you drank too much beer :)

I'm a bit confused on why GM would pair a different engine with the auto trans. I thought the GM autos were very durable?? Why the detuned engine? They pair the same trans with the LS3 in the Corvette right, or is it a different trans? A comparable setup for 5M and auto in an S197 with the auto car properly tuned and stalled.. the auto will beat the manual four out of five times. Ain't nothin' limp wristed about it ;-).

I believe it was because of the gas guzzler tax. I wouldnt of bought the car with another $1,700 tacked on to it. FYI the g8 gxp has the gas guzzler tax.

you gotta be kidding... GM is really straddling the green fence with this car eh? and cost factor.. I see their logic now.. I think :huh:. the M6 can't get that much better gas mileage than a 6-speed auto. Or does it?

A stalled, tuned auto car with the LS3 would smoke the M6 IMO and what I would be looking to buy.

Its only like 1mpg difference, but thats our government hard at work. You would think they could of just changed the rear gear to make up for it?

Maybe I'm expecting too much, but I've been less than impressed with the results we've seen out of the '10 L99 we have in the shop right now.

Bone stock Baseline was 317 whp and 331 wtq on my Mustang Dyno, starting the pull @ 160 deg ECT I did 2 other baselines at 192, and a smoking hot at 214, the 160 was the best, but negligible over the 192 degree pull. I made a couple 1/4 mile runs on the dyno and the best was a 13.51@104 with a 2.17 60' (192 deg ECT at the start of the run)

With just a tune it picked up to 331 whp and 343 wtq starting at 174 deg ECT, the 1/4 mile improved to a 13.13@106 with a 2.05 60', I made another pull with a 2.13 60' that went 13.16@106 (both runs were 192 deg at the start).

Next we added a set of Full Length Headers, High Flow Cats and exhaust, and a colder thermostat. We didn't have the CAI finished, so we were still using the stock airbox/filter. After countless tunes trying everything under the sun the best pull was 340 whp and 345 wtq.

Then we added a cam and the CAI and are currently at 377 whp and 352 wtq, bottom end is up around 10 whp/wtq over stock, the numbers at 6000+ are quite a bit better.

Finally we added a 150 shot which resulted with 506whp and 494 wtq, but the a/f pegged the meter rich, so were gonna try and pull some fuel out and try again.

This is why you should always buy the manly transmission in a sports car. Maybe GM figured the limp-wristed automatic buyers wouldn't mind limp-wristed performance to match?

:)

SOme of us have legs that dont work Tony and have to buy the Auto..:hump: lol

Funny. I was thinking to myself the other day..Some idiot will design something to run 1/4 times on a dyno..Low & behold, it's already being done..LOL

Let's not forget that the LS1 A4 cars were nothing to write home about stock, either. With that heavy TC, slow shift times, premature upshifts, and late downshifts, I hated how mine ran stock. It took tuning, a shift kit, and an aftermarket converter to get things working right.

In my experience, the LT1 A4's were the last to be set up right from the factory. Mine with the perfomance shift button and 3.23's worked so well that I never touched it.

SOme of us have legs that dont work Tony and have to buy the Auto..:hump: lol

Damn you Scotty, LOL! Okay, wheelchairs get a waive on the girly trans. But hey, my motorcycles have a clutch handle on the bars, why couldn't a car? ;)

SOme of us have legs that dont work Tony and have to buy the Auto..:hump: lol

+1 Im in that boat

Maybe they have fixed some issues with some of the Auto cars being slow. I checked on the status of my build yesterday (it's in production yay) & I was told that my car would be ready in about 2 weeks or so, but it may take a while to ship it because they just released the hold on the auto cars, so they have a lot of cars to ship. So bad news for me on my car being held up for shipping due to the Auto's being released, but maybe good news for the people who have cars with an auto trans in them.

This is why you should always buy the manly transmission in a sports car. Maybe GM figured the limp-wristed automatic buyers wouldn't mind limp-wristed performance to match?

:)

:cheers:

The main issue is that this is a performance car but even the newer techonolgy is designed to restrict max effort at the point where the most likely hood of damage is to occur.

If allow to run like it should most of the drive train will still be garbage. As race weight is def a factor. But again, these car demand getting lightened up and I feel a 12 bolt or so rear should have been put it.

:cheers:

The main issue is that this is a performance car but even the newer techonolgy is designed to restrict max effort at the point where the most likely hood of damage is to occur.

If allow to run like it should most of the drive train will still be garbage. As race weight is def a factor. But again, these car demand getting lightened up and I feel a 12 bolt or so rear should have been put it.

I think the rear is comparable to a 12 bolt in strength, can't remember where I read it, but it has a 8.8" ring gear.

What does everyone make of this?

I've been reading some 5th gen. forums out there. It seems many of the L99s are running super rich and super slow.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34158

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31570

This one seems relatively healthy.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29464

This guy's L99 5th gen. can barely get out of it's own way and is recording 60mph times over 7 seconds. He is making a big issue out of it with GM.

http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32317


I believe that the video was shot in Denver and you probably have to adjust for the altitude. At least by reading his posts he says he is in Denver.
Another guy on that thread is talking about how a Honda Accord beat him- what is up with that?

I think the rear is comparable to a 12 bolt in strength, can't remember where I read it, but it has a 8.8" ring gear.

That maybe true on the ring and pinion but still too many moving parts. As I have seen reports of blowing half shafts.

That maybe true on the ring and pinion but still too many moving parts. As I have seen reports of blowing half shafts.At what power? The Aussie guys are running 11's on stock stuff with 1.6 60's. Maybe the US supplier is building some weak half shafts.

At what power? The Aussie guys are running 11's on stock stuff with 1.6 60's. Maybe the US supplier is building some weak half shafts.

Could be a possibility but with racing, a heavy race weight will put extra stress on parts. Not to say the car shouldn't be raced as per some member's opinions but I think given the weight, power, tire, and launch technique, your going to see cars getting lighter and band-aids put to the drivetrain to keep it alive.

I think the Aussies are doing that, focusing on keeping the IRS alive, and the same goes for the G8's.

One thing no one talks about is the variable of the driver and how good they are. I will tell you, one good wheel hop session puts more stress on parts then racing down the track 10 times. That sudden shock and hit, is enough to destroy parts. I predict people will start putting fab 9" or something stronger in.

Could be a possibility but with racing, a heavy race weight will put extra stress on parts. Not to say the car shouldn't be raced as per some member's opinions but I think given the weight, power, tire, and launch technique, your going to see cars getting lighter and band-aids put to the drivetrain to keep it alive.

I think the Aussies are doing that, focusing on keeping the IRS alive, and the same goes for the G8's.

One thing no one talks about is the variable of the driver and how good they are. I will tell you, one good wheel hop session puts more stress on parts then racing down the track 10 times. That sudden shock and hit, is enough to destroy parts. I predict people will start putting fab 9" or something stronger in.the weight of these cars is pretty much something thats easy to get by. ive had my car a month now and already have it in pieces doing the usual modding. however with that said that has also led me into taking various other parts out to weigh them. and damn ill say this much. most of that extra 480-750 extra lbs that everyone complains about lies in all the safety equipment and extra options these cars carry. all the airbags including side curtain airbags and even the ones in the seats weigh in at an average of 25-42 lbs each . the heated power seats are right at 75 lbs each, that independent rear is also a huge mass as well at about 400 lbs. and then comes those big ass 20 inch wheels right at 65lbs each. so pretty much just the installation of some lightweight race seats, some airbag removal and bogart type drag wheels and this car would without a doubt be pretty nasty with only bolt ons

the weight of these cars is pretty much something thats easy to get by. ive had my car a month now and already have it in pieces doing the usual modding. however with that said that has also led me into taking various other parts out to weigh them. and damn ill say this much. most of that extra 480-750 extra lbs that everyone complains about lies in all the safety equipment and extra options these cars carry. all the airbags including side curtain airbags and even the ones in the seats weigh in at an average of 25-42 lbs each . the heated power seats are right at 75 lbs each, that independent rear is also a huge mass as well at about 400 lbs. and then comes those big ass 20 inch wheels right at 65lbs each. so pretty much just the installation of some lightweight race seats, some airbag removal and bogart type drag wheels and this car would without a doubt be pretty nasty with only bolt ons

Have you started to weigh everything?? We are looking for some numbers for a new sticky in the drag race forum, you can PM me if you like.

Also the carpet is like 2 inches thick.........not just the normal sound deadening stuff

That maybe true on the ring and pinion but still too many moving parts. As I have seen reports of blowing half shafts.

Well a handful of people have broken an axle, but most were not even driving hard when it happened. Personally, I think there are some defective parts out there, as most have had no problems. Time will tell where the weak links are and what those limits are though.

Have you started to weigh everything?? We are looking for some numbers for a new sticky in the drag race forum, you can PM me if you like.
everythings been weighed. used a digital scale for the weighing of all parts. however dont know exactly how accurate it is ! i was pretty suprised at the weight of just the options and safety equipment in this car. ill leave the weight reduction mods to the hardcore drag race guys . i like my fully optioned car as it is.:drive: