Jay-SS

So lets say I have an '02 SS w/ 51k on the clock, its my DD, and I rarely rarely get on it. For the last 2-3k miles/ 5-6 months I been running w/ new h/c/i makin bout 430 rwhp. I head to the garage today to do a normal oil change. Slap a Mobile1 filter on and dump in 6 quarts of Mobile1 10w30 synthetic and good to go.

The engine is turning for a total of about 5-10 minutes and actually moves a total of <1 mile before I realize somethin sounds off. Hard to explain but sounds like a type of pressure build up that thumps in rythm with the engine. Not very noticeable at first.

Then I get on the throttle a lil bit only up to a lil over 2k rpm (low spd limit road) and the sound is clearly noticeable. I backed off and at the same time the 3200 stall locks up (38ish mph) and the thumping becomes so strong that its unmistakable and I can actually FEEL it sittin in the seat.

I immediately slow and let the converter unlock again and pull over as soon as I get a chance and kill it. (again this is all in barely a mile from the oil change).

I call my buddy up to help me figure out what the hell is going on. He shows up (much more knowledgeable than me) and thinks I may have spun a bearing or somthing from my description. He has me fire it up so he can hear whats going on.

Can barely hear it at idle but he still picks it up. Not sure what the problem is and he's explaining somthing to me when we notice smoke starting to rise from the breather valve on top the oil cap and kill it.

Checks the oil level (again) and (again) its still in the good zone. However, this time he runs his fingers down the dipstick to whipe the oil off and says feel my finger.

Im fucked. There's metal flakes on his fingers and on the dip stick. First thought, my block is done.

So now im trying to figure out exactly what the hell happened. Is the metal shaving off the crank, the heads, the cylinder walls, the pistons, or what?

The only things we know so far is I JUST did an oil change, it has a high flow oil pump, and it looks like somthing isnt getting lubed. He opens the oil cap and it almost looks dry in the little bit of the heads we can see. We figure the damage is already started so I fire it up again JUST FOR A COUPLE MOMENTS to check to see if we can see oil flowing under the valve covers through the open cap.

Nothing. It didnt look like there was any oil gettin up there at all.

So I have questions galore now:

Can you normally see oil flowing under the covers from the oil cap opening?

Is the oil pump failing?

How the **** does changing your oil (and im not stupid, i've changed my own oil dozens of times) alluva sudden cause your engine to eat itself?

Was this damage done before the oil change and it took the change to bring it to the surface?

Did all this damage actually occur in the approx. =<1 mile of distance traveled after the change?

The all in one question; what the **** happened?

conan

iTrader: (5)

Usually when running the engine with the fill cap off you can place your hand over the hole and you'll get a mist of oil on your hand. I would pull the rocker covers and start there. Could be no oil in the valve train, lifter problems ect. Spun bearings are loud at idle and get much worse as rpm's climb.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

In all of that post, not once did you mention what sort of oil pressure you're getting. That would be the very first thing I would look at as soon as this issue started.

So, before I comment any further, these are my questions:

- What is your "normal" (meaning before this issue) oil pressure reading at idle?
- What is your current oil pressure reading at idle?
- What was the oil pressure reading when you accelerated to 2k rpm and the noise got worse? And, as rpms rose, did the oil pressure needle first drop and then increase?

One other question.... you said you had just done an oil change..... do you happen to remember if there were significant metal shavings on the drain plug magnet? Also, do you still have the old oil somewhere? If so, pour it from one container to another using a super fine screen as a filter and see if it catches any shavings.

The Bronx Bull

RPM WS6's posts on this forum, in my opinion, are considered the newest testament to the bible and a form of gospel. I'd listen to him

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

Well, thank you very much.

Jay-SS

Normal pressure is 60 either at idle or cruise (thats what my dash gauge says). I dont remember exactly what it was when i drove it during this incident but I wanna say it still said 60 lbs. When the noise was poppin hard I honestly didnt look at the oil pressure I was too busy trying to find a place to pull over. I spoke to a couple shops and they said what I describe doesnt sound like it has anything to do with an oil change, and that it just happened to coincide with it. That sounds like a shooting a bullseye from 400yards blindfolded type luck there.

I was told by my shop that a while back that yella terra shipped out a bad batch and what i describe could sound like a broken rocker. So thats gonna be the first thing I check out. Now... I've taken covers off carb cars before but not a fuel injected LS1. Is there anything extra I need to do other than just take out 4 bolts?

Juicy J

iTrader: (5)

Eh, he does ok.

In a situation where you are driving down the street and something odd starts happening, your guages are your best friend.

There are a few things that you need to get off first. You will need to take off the coil packs. Theres a fuel line you need to disconnect, so you will need a special tool for that. Other than that, I can't think of anything to else. It really isn't hard at all, and should be pretty straight forward if you have used a wrench before.

I don't think we know enough yet to determine what happened.

TooLateVTEC

iTrader: (2)

From now on, you need to watch the oil pressure more...especially when **** it hitting the fan.

The oil change most likely has nothing to do with what happened, its just bad timing.

Either way with whatever you find after removing the valve covers, get ready to pull/have the motor pulled out.

Like Juicy said, we really dont know enough yet to help figure out what happened.

Good luck man

samson_420

iTrader: (1)

That sucks. . . . . Does not sound like this actually was caused by the oil change at all.

Like mentioned above, tear off the valve covers and start looking around.


About 90%+ metal shavings in the oil = the death of a motor(how bad depends on what failed)

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I agree with the guys above. If you didn't pay any attention to the oil pressure when this happened, then there is no way to say whether or not the oil pump has anything to do with this, nor is there any other way to know for sure what happened at this point.

Did you pull the valve cover yet?

You never mentioned if you still had access to the old oil. If you do, I still suggest that you pour it from one container to another using some window screen as a filter and look for metal of any kind.

the_merv

iTrader: (88)

If you lost Oil to the upper portion of the Engine then you could've spun a Cam Bearing..they aren't as loud as Rod Bearings.

You won't know till you tear it down..in this case that is what is needed with the metal in the oil. And that's all the way down..

Jay-SS

2nd time = gay... i typed this whole damn thing up once and hit reply and it asks me to login (again) and erases everything I typed. LAME!!
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RPM WS6 unfortunately no i dont have access to the old oil and no I didnt notice anything out the norm on the magnet when I drained it.

So we pulled the valve covers off and noticed a couple things. Rockers are fine. We turned the engine over a few times off just the starter and oil flow looked good just didnt slosh around like I though it would. Also there was not metal to be seen anywhere in there. So we know its not the top end. Oddly enough, when removing the coil packs we noticed the front most passenger side pack, the 3 socket female adaptor was not properly plugged in. It just slipped right out with no force at all. So if that thing wasnt connected properly then its possible that cylinder wasnt firing, right?

Next, the top side of the dipstick is coated in somthing that looks like rust (either rust or dried oil) and I assume the inside of the dipstick tubing is as well. That might be the "metal" I was see'ing (I hope).
Either way im not banking on it, imma change the oil again and filter it this time to see what comes out and we'll proceed from there.

Now the new best case theory is; that one coil pack wasnt plugged up and that 1 cylinder wasnt firing. The "metal" in the oil is just rust or dry/hardened oil that the dipstick picks up off the tube wall as i pull it out. The smoking... maybe some oil got on the outside of the heads while we were looking around it and when they were heated it just started burning that oil making a little smoke?

This is all just guessing, couple questions tho.

1) Has anyone driven an LS1 (or possibly anything similar) with a cylinder that wasnt firing? If you have could you describe what that feels/sounds like?

2) When taking the valve cover bolts out they clicked upon loosening. My buddy said it sounded like bolts torqued to spec. The site I was using for direction just said hand tighten those but I want to make sure. Is there a torque spec on the valve cover bolts?

More to come...

Joshiedoom

iTrader: (4)

Hmm, pretty wierd. About 5k after I changed headers I was cruising down some backroads and went WOT to hear a pop when I let off after a few and to see the nice flashing SES light. It was vibrating and knocking and I thought I had busted a rocker/lifter/pushrod/etc but after a closer look the spark plug wire had burned in two after it had rotated against the primary. Simple fix with an old plug wire of mine and some sleeves. Valve cover bolts would be slightly tighter than snug. I would change the oil filter and see if the coil fixed it. Keep an eye on oil pressure.

samson_420

iTrader: (1)

+1 then some. . . . . . . Oil pressure and temperature is a must on keeping a constant eye on.

RPM WS6

iTrader: (3)

I agree with all of this. Definitely watch the oil pressure this time.

Also, as for the smoke, I have a minor valve cover gasket leak. Occasionally some of that oil will ooze down to the exhaust manifold and burn off. If I watch the engine long enough, up close, once in a while I can see a tiny trail of smoke from that area.

I'm not certain that this is the same sort of smoke you saw though. I think you said it came from the breather you have installed in place of the oil fill cap? If so, the only reason you should see smoke there is if the crankcase vapors/pressure are greater than what the PCV system can remove by itself, or if the PCV system is clogged.

LS1TA385

iTrader: (1)

Hopefully it was just a cylinder not firing and not anything major. I have seen oil filters come apart and block the oil flow and since you just changed it that might be something to check.

98ZEMT

iTrader: (5)

I actually bent the prongs inside the connector going to my 8th coil pack. When we started it up, it didn't sound right. Wasn't really making any funny noises or anything. It just didn't sound right. I drove it down the road and it ran like ****. Brought it back, straightened the prongs back out and it ran fine. It may very well be the problem. I hope it is. That would be the easy problem to fix.

SparkyJJO

iTrader: (11)

Something else to consider about the smoke - did you spill any oil filling it by accident? My 3800 has the filler neck back a little farther and at an angle, so I almost always ways spill a little when I go to fill it up. Ends up on the exhaust manifolds, then burns off when I drive it. Last time I was really sloppy or something, and spilled more than normal. Got to work and I had quite a bit of oil smoke rolling out from underneath the hood

itsslow98

iTrader: (18)

Maybe its just me but when i have a miss from just one cylinder, the car doesnt "thump" it ticks.....i hope thats all it is but I doubt it. Metal shavings in the oil at the same time as the "thumping" doesnt sound like just a coincidence.

Juicy J

iTrader: (5)

Well OP, I hope this all works out for you. If everything seems fine after this oil change, I think it would be benifical for you to send in a quart of that oil for an oil analysis. That way you can find out where the metal came from, and if your engine seems to be in decent shape according to the oil.