View Poll Results: What Block Do You Use For Under 10 Sec Car? (NA Only)
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll
What block do you use to run less than 10.0s?
03-30-2010, 08:33 AM
#5
All Motor, you want aluminum, no need IMO for Iron unless the block allows for rediculous cubic inches.
I would consider a LS2 over a LS1 due to the fact it has a larger bore but the skirts are short either way, plus no extra cost like having to sleeve the LS1's
Something that has superior oiling capabilties and the need to have HIGH rpm stability. No matter what, I see you having to modify the block to a degree.
As for heads, ETP, TEA, AFR and possibly TFS all do well.
Comparing the best ET you had, depending how deep the 9's need to be you could even get away with a 383/402 CID motor.
I am no expert but this is what I have exp. and seen, but getting the weight down and going to a TH400/4L80e combo I def see in your future.
I would consider a LS2 over a LS1 due to the fact it has a larger bore but the skirts are short either way, plus no extra cost like having to sleeve the LS1's
Something that has superior oiling capabilties and the need to have HIGH rpm stability. No matter what, I see you having to modify the block to a degree.
As for heads, ETP, TEA, AFR and possibly TFS all do well.
Comparing the best ET you had, depending how deep the 9's need to be you could even get away with a 383/402 CID motor.
I am no expert but this is what I have exp. and seen, but getting the weight down and going to a TH400/4L80e combo I def see in your future.
03-30-2010, 09:19 AM
#6
Not there yet but couple tenths away. I am trying for a 9 second all motor street car shifting. Those are my goals with the car and I am using a LS7 factory block and think we are close to our goals. Just trying to get some weight out of the car and we will be there. For all motor I think you are fine with the factory LS blocks.
03-30-2010, 09:22 AM
#7
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My last motor used a C5R block and LS6 heads and went 9.90's at 3550lbs all day long in N/A trim with the motor converter. It was built to handle nitrous so it slowed down .03 on the motor when we changed to a tighter nitrous converter. If you are running motor only I would stick with an aluminum block. I think a LS2 would work just fine and you can modify it for different applications. Get a good oiling system too... maybe an external one although the melling high volume one we used with the Moroso pan worked very well. We weren't seeing high RPM's though, 7600RPM was the max it would see.
At the end of the day you need to identify whether this is a race only motor or if you plan on driving it on the street. Shooting for an ET is great and there are many ways to get there but depending on how you are using it will help determine other decisions in building a 9 sec N/A combo. Erik as HKE has built some 9 sec hydraulic cam pump gas motors and so have a few others. Sounds like the best of all worlds there. Good luck.
At the end of the day you need to identify whether this is a race only motor or if you plan on driving it on the street. Shooting for an ET is great and there are many ways to get there but depending on how you are using it will help determine other decisions in building a 9 sec N/A combo. Erik as HKE has built some 9 sec hydraulic cam pump gas motors and so have a few others. Sounds like the best of all worlds there. Good luck.
Last edited by ericg69ss; 03-30-2010 at 09:27 AM.
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03-30-2010, 11:59 AM
#8
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2 more key points:
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
03-30-2010, 01:16 PM
#11
2 more key points:
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
The sleeves are Iron if I recall correctly and that sounds like a heat control issue be it not enough lubrication under load, or combustion control possibly due to inadequate fuel. If the cyl are getting elongated/shifted/stretched.
JL should be chiming in soon but I find this a interesting discussion.
03-30-2010, 02:35 PM
#12
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Definitely important info which is why I asked the question earlier. I did drive my 13.5-1 C5R, LS6 headed 427 on the street when I had it and never had an issue with running hot so its relative. The big issue is the tune up, ie timing and running the right fuel. I have drums of VP C12 at my office so I never worried about driving it on the street.
For your situation it depends on how much compression is considered high. If you are building an all out N/A only motor and never going to see nitrous ever, ever, ever... Then I would build something in the 14-15.1 range and if you ever drive it on the street make sure your cooling system is up to par, and your tune up and fuel is right.
Regarding issue #2 I think you can address that but you have to consider how much compression, bore and stroke combo, and your oiling system. I think you can reach your goals if you keep compression around 13.5-1, upgrade your cooling system with a nice aluminum radiator, electric pump, and fans, and get a nice external oil pump system or even go dry sump. You may already have some of parts mentioned above too.
For your situation it depends on how much compression is considered high. If you are building an all out N/A only motor and never going to see nitrous ever, ever, ever... Then I would build something in the 14-15.1 range and if you ever drive it on the street make sure your cooling system is up to par, and your tune up and fuel is right.
Regarding issue #2 I think you can address that but you have to consider how much compression, bore and stroke combo, and your oiling system. I think you can reach your goals if you keep compression around 13.5-1, upgrade your cooling system with a nice aluminum radiator, electric pump, and fans, and get a nice external oil pump system or even go dry sump. You may already have some of parts mentioned above too.
2 more key points:
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
1) This is a "drag race" car only. I could put it on the street but would have to put a "HP limiting" exhaust on it. Plus, the cops and people in my neighborhood hate my car.
2) We had an issue in the past with LS aluminum blocks getting elongated cylinders due to high compression/heat. This is why I thought about an iron block??
03-31-2010, 02:52 PM
#13
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Good info.
The sleeves are Iron if I recall correctly and that sounds like a heat control issue be it not enough lubrication under load, or combustion control possibly due to inadequate fuel. If the cyl are getting elongated/shifted/stretched.
JL should be chiming in soon but I find this a interesting discussion.
The sleeves are Iron if I recall correctly and that sounds like a heat control issue be it not enough lubrication under load, or combustion control possibly due to inadequate fuel. If the cyl are getting elongated/shifted/stretched.
JL should be chiming in soon but I find this a interesting discussion.
Definitely important info which is why I asked the question earlier. I did drive my 13.5-1 C5R, LS6 headed 427 on the street when I had it and never had an issue with running hot so its relative. The big issue is the tune up, ie timing and running the right fuel. I have drums of VP C12 at my office so I never worried about driving it on the street.
For your situation it depends on how much compression is considered high. If you are building an all out N/A only motor and never going to see nitrous ever, ever, ever... Then I would build something in the 14-15.1 range and if you ever drive it on the street make sure your cooling system is up to par, and your tune up and fuel is right.
Regarding issue #2 I think you can address that but you have to consider how much compression, bore and stroke combo, and your oiling system. I think you can reach your goals if you keep compression around 13.5-1, upgrade your cooling system with a nice aluminum radiator, electric pump, and fans, and get a nice external oil pump system or even go dry sump. You may already have some of parts mentioned above too.
For your situation it depends on how much compression is considered high. If you are building an all out N/A only motor and never going to see nitrous ever, ever, ever... Then I would build something in the 14-15.1 range and if you ever drive it on the street make sure your cooling system is up to par, and your tune up and fuel is right.
Regarding issue #2 I think you can address that but you have to consider how much compression, bore and stroke combo, and your oiling system. I think you can reach your goals if you keep compression around 13.5-1, upgrade your cooling system with a nice aluminum radiator, electric pump, and fans, and get a nice external oil pump system or even go dry sump. You may already have some of parts mentioned above too.
The timing stays at 13 all the time so it's good. I also run superb fuel. I run an electric water pump with the stock radiator and stock fans. May be an issue? Honestly, I'm on the fence right now. I have a really good running, 10-second LS1 now and since they picked the 9-second class at the recent "Pinks All Out" Event, I feel like I need to be faster. Knowing what I have got out of the 347, I could prob throw in a larger cam and a little more weight reduction and hit 9's. Or do I just go all out with a new set-up? I'm talking large motor, big air flow, possibly carb style. If this thing needs a parachute after it's done, I'll be pretty excited. But, all that for 1 second? And, how difficult is it to run this quick of a car if you are a regular bracket racer?
