LS1 GEN III new build warhawk wont start
03-29-2010, 09:04 PM
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LS1 GEN III new build warhawk wont start We just finished dropping a new LS1 GENIII into a 2002 Camaro. The motor is a new Warhawlk 427 block, eagle rotating assm. AFR heads, comp. cam. All pro built. We have compression, we have spark, we have correct fuel pressure, power to the injectors. The problem is it won't start. it pops in the exaust but that is it. We checked the ECM in another car and it works fine. It was flashed recently and should at least run the motor until we can get it on a dyno. I understand this is a common problem with swap like this but I can't find much that I havn't tried. It's driving me nuts, does anybody have some suggestions? Any help to get this baby running before next winter would be great. Thanks,
Bert
Bert
03-29-2010, 09:53 PM
#3
3 Things to check:
Timing chain
Crank Sensor
Cam Sensor
Obviously cam timing can only be checked by pulling the timing cover, which is a job. However, popping in the exhaust during cranking is usually a good indication that your timing is off.
Crank and cam sensor signals can be checked with a scan tool. Basically you want to make sure you are getting a good reading from both signals during cranking. If not, start by checking the wiring and sensors themselves.
Timing chain
Crank Sensor
Cam Sensor
Obviously cam timing can only be checked by pulling the timing cover, which is a job. However, popping in the exhaust during cranking is usually a good indication that your timing is off.
Crank and cam sensor signals can be checked with a scan tool. Basically you want to make sure you are getting a good reading from both signals during cranking. If not, start by checking the wiring and sensors themselves.
03-30-2010, 12:42 PM
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LS1 GEN III swap WE already had the motor out one extra time to check to be sure that the cam was lined up correctly. We have new cam and crank sensors, we are getting compression. This may sound stupid but is a PCM the same thing as the ECM or am I missing something or calling something by the wrong name. We ran the ECM in another LS1 car and it worked fine. Bert
03-30-2010, 12:52 PM
#7
wiring/sensors
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03-30-2010, 02:19 PM
#8
WE already had the motor out one extra time to check to be sure that the cam was lined up correctly. We have new cam and crank sensors, we are getting compression. This may sound stupid but is a PCM the same thing as the ECM or am I missing something or calling something by the wrong name. We ran the ECM in another LS1 car and it worked fine. Bert
03-30-2010, 02:22 PM
#9
WE already had the motor out one extra time to check to be sure that the cam was lined up correctly. We have new cam and crank sensors, we are getting compression. This may sound stupid but is a PCM the same thing as the ECM or am I missing something or calling something by the wrong name. We ran the ECM in another LS1 car and it worked fine. Bert
03-30-2010, 08:11 PM
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LS1/7 GEN III swap I want to thank everyone who gave some help. Here is the problem. The World Products block was bought early on, it was one of the first and was based on the early LS tech. We bought a real nice AFR heads and cam setup and I guess the problem is it's a newer style cam (front sensor) and the block is rear sensor. Unfortunatly this is the first LS motor these guys have ever delt with and they didn't realize that even though the block is a all alum. LS7 it is still based on the old LS1 block. So I guess we will have to talk to AFR and find out if this cam that is ground to match the heads can be replaced with the same grind but for a rear sensor.
I will say one thing, I have learned as much about LS motors in the last month as it took me all of my teens to learn old small and big blocks. Here is what we have in the car now. There should be a pic. I'll post the whole car when it's running. Thanks again. Bert
I will say one thing, I have learned as much about LS motors in the last month as it took me all of my teens to learn old small and big blocks. Here is what we have in the car now. There should be a pic. I'll post the whole car when it's running. Thanks again. Bert
03-30-2010, 08:34 PM
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If they charge you another $300 plus for a new cam it may be worth it to convert to the front cam sensor set up... only 180 or so for the kit .. just a heads up for you
03-31-2010, 08:24 AM
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Thanks for the heads up about the front sensor set up. We're at that point now, we'll see what is the best way to go, I know there is some wireing changes that have to be made too but I am guessing that would come with the kit, if they make a conversion kit. In answer to the reluctor question...we have a 24 tooth reluctor, thats what was in the blown LS1 we took out. As far as having the coil pack plugs reversed, we already checked that. We are pretty sure it's the cam being the wrong type, I just hope AFR makes the grind we want on a rear sensor cam. I can't wait, this motor should be a bullitt proof screamer when it runs.
03-31-2010, 02:38 PM
#16
You just need the correct LS2 front sprocket and Ls2 timing cover. Several vendors sell the extension harness for the cam sensor wiring, but they are notorious for having the outside wires crossed.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...e-ls1-ecm.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...e-ls1-ecm.html
04-02-2010, 06:47 PM
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Still no joy with the Warhawk WE got the front timing sensor cover and the correct gear and extended the sensor wires up to the front and it still won't start, in fact it's popping less than before. This cam we have is a custom grind that came with the AFR heads. I'm beginning to think something is wrong with the cam somehow. Tomorrow I am going to pull the valve covers and turn it over by hand and just see what the pistons and cam are doing. This is an early style LS1 block but everything else is LS7. Eagle crank. We know the PCM and the 24 tooth crank match. It's got to be something with the cam or the sensor setup. Since it's my kids car, I am still hoping I can drive it to his one year memoral on the 23rd. he'd have it running had he been able to finish at UTI in Florida.
You guys can jump right in if you think of anything I should check or do before I start shooting holes in it. Oh yea, one of the guys had a scope and it didn't show any faults. THANKS AGAIN Bert
You guys can jump right in if you think of anything I should check or do before I start shooting holes in it. Oh yea, one of the guys had a scope and it didn't show any faults. THANKS AGAIN Bert
04-02-2010, 08:13 PM
#18
The setup swapped from an old motor??
If so, and the injectors have been sitting for a period of time, they may be gummed shut, and/or leaking just enuf fuel to get the popping sound..
Just because you have fuel psi, it's not for sure the injs are working.
I've been cleaning/flow testing for 15 yrs... Have seen MANY sets gummed up. Some so bad, they were JUNK.
If so, and the injectors have been sitting for a period of time, they may be gummed shut, and/or leaking just enuf fuel to get the popping sound..
Just because you have fuel psi, it's not for sure the injs are working.
I've been cleaning/flow testing for 15 yrs... Have seen MANY sets gummed up. Some so bad, they were JUNK.
04-03-2010, 10:52 AM
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This is all new stuff, LS1 style LS7 block,eagle rotating assm.,AFR heads with a cam that came with to match, new injectors, correct crank(24 tooth), PCM that is good and will run a motor. We have tryed just about everything we can think of and everything you guys have thought of and still no joy. I going over there right now and pull the valve covers and timing cover and check everything out. There has to be something we missed.
