Drag Racing Tech - Front SA shocks and springs or slicks?




second_2_none
06-23-2010, 10:10 PM
I've just added everything in my sig to my car minus the cam and stall. Well I'm on a 275/60/15 and spraying a 150 shot. I've adjusted my lca's placement in my relocation brackets both up and down, but for the life of me I can not get my car to hook. I have a progressive to tune the nitrous down, but I am trying to hook out of the whole. I'm sure slicks will probably make my car hook. But I am wondering if getting some SA shocks and springs would get my car to hook on the drag radials. Which one do you think do you guys think would benefit me more? I dont understand how some of these guys are running so fast on radials and I can't hook with a measly 150shot????:bang:


Gary Z
06-23-2010, 10:43 PM
In general tires are a bigger factor than front shocks but that doesn’t mean tires are your main problem. How much have you experimented with tire pressure? What is your rear gear ratio? The difference between drag radials and slicks is huge. The guys who go fast on radials have a lot of experience and have everything working. You can't just throw parts at the problem. You need to experiment.

custm2500
06-24-2010, 03:58 AM
Shocks probably, with almost certainty, won't make the car hook. They will help but you will still be fighting the radial and dialing in your set up. Event then you won't always make it out of the hole. Just how radials are.

Buy the slicks and you can sell the progressive because you will be hooking like a Honda that can't burn the tires in the water box.


Bitemark46
06-24-2010, 08:25 AM
You want your LCA parallel to the ground or at a minimum slight elevated to up from the rear to front no more than 1". Some adj shocks would help. If you can afford it, a DA would be the best option. Alot of SA's only allow you to adj the the rebound (extension). But with a DA you can do both rebound and compression so it'll hold the hit better.

Whats the front suspension consist of? Is your sway bar connected?

-Mark

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 08:43 AM
Thanks guys for the replies! I dont have any aftermarket front suspension, just my sway bar taken off. I have experimented with my tire pressure and 17-18psi seems to work best, but still spins. My lca relocation brackets have 4 different holes with the top whole being the stock location. I have put my lca's on the second hole down, and the third whole down, seemed to do better on the second. I have a 3:90 gear ratio, but with the 28" tall tires it gears it down some. I'm sure JL will tell me to get the slicks as well, I just know that front shocks and springs are good for weight transfer. Thats why I'm not sure which will be better. Its looking like the slicks would be better though so far.

TA1364
06-24-2010, 10:54 AM
I just went through the same decision. I went with slicks, those radials dont hook unless the track is good and suspension is right. ET drags are the way to go.

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 11:01 AM
I just went through the same decision. I went with slicks, those radials dont hook unless the track is good and suspension is right. ET drags are the way to go.

Yeah as much as I dont want to put on a slick I guess I will grab a set and go, probably should have done that from the start. The shop that tunes my car, RPM(sponsors on here) keep telling me not to go to a slick and that it will slow me down a little.

Bitemark46
06-24-2010, 11:56 AM
Do you have any vids of the car launching? What do your friends say your car looks like when you launch? If the nose is not lifting at all then a lighter spring will help to get the nose up and shift weight to the rear.

Which DR? M/T? 18psi seems a little high for me. Hell I used to run a 17" nitto DR at 14psi. You heating them up good?

-Mark

Detroitmuscle
06-24-2010, 12:29 PM
What drag radials do you have now? The M/Ts are by far the best out there if you don't have those or hoosiers then I'd highly recommend them. Why go to a slick though? thats only going to be a band-aid fix and doesn't necessarily mean the car is gonna hook. If the suspension is off its free to tweak it in or see what the true problem is. What is your pinion angle set at? Does the car unload off the line and spin or is any weight being transferred?

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 01:02 PM
Do you have any vids of the car launching? What do your friends say your car looks like when you launch? If the nose is not lifting at all then a lighter spring will help to get the nose up and shift weight to the rear.

Which DR? M/T? 18psi seems a little high for me. Hell I used to run a 17" nitto DR at 14psi. You heating them up good?

-Mark

What drag radials do you have now? The M/Ts are by far the best out there if you don't have those or hoosiers then I'd highly recommend them. Why go to a slick though? thats only going to be a band-aid fix and doesn't necessarily mean the car is gonna hook. If the suspension is off its free to tweak it in or see what the true problem is. What is your pinion angle set at? Does the car unload off the line and spin or is any weight being transferred?

I have M/T steet radials. I had them at 14psi and a buddy bummed them up to 17psi and it was doing a lot better. Another problem I have is trying to figure out if I'm fighting poor track prep or if my suspension is really off. A couple weeks ago the car lifted the front left about 2 or 3 feet and carried it, but I was still spinning a little. That run was a 1.69 60'. But I took my car to the shop to have them fine adjust everything mainly to get my rear centered and they moved my control arms down a hole. I went to the track that night and the front wasn't even lifting, I was just spinning from the whole. I just moved my control arms back up a hole and am taking tools, a jack, and jack stands with me to the track tonight to see how it does and adjust it there. I agree that slicks would be a band aid, I just dont know what else to do. My pinion angle is at -2*. From what I'm told by a couple members on here, pinion angle doesn't really have much or anything to do with traction, just keeps everything mechanically strait. So all the only thing I have to adjust that will effect my traction is the position of my lca's in my relocation brackets.

TA1364
06-24-2010, 01:48 PM
A slick isnt going to slow you down hardly anything, what size are you thinking about getting?

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 01:54 PM
A slick isnt going to slow you down hardly anything, what size are you thinking about getting?

I dont know what size is best, I dont know anything about slicks.

Dragman
06-24-2010, 02:34 PM
I have 295x45x17 M/T DRs on my C5 dont have any issues hooking at all even on 150 shot. Run 18 to 20 pounds with QA1 shocks all the way around. U just dont have car dialed in right. Too many people hook on DRs to say they dont hook. Been 1.46 60ft with my DRs.

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 02:45 PM
Yeah I know my buddy has been 1.32 short time on the same tire I have. Like I said I moved the lca's up a hole and will play with my tire pressure and update everybody, I'm leaving now for the track.

Bitemark46
06-24-2010, 03:12 PM
Good luck. Between rounds/passes take a walk to the starting line and inspect it. Showing bare concrete is a bad thing. Walk up to where the rear tires are when shallow staged. If your foot sticks to it then I'd say prep is pretty good.

If you have all solid arm joints in the rear then your PA should be no more than 1.5*. If you have poly joints then 2-3* is fine. Stock rubber... 3-4*

If you haven't left yet, have a buddy stand on the pass side rear of the car behind the starting line watching you leave so he can see if there is any squat or separation between the pass side rear tire and the fender.

custm2500
06-24-2010, 04:01 PM
, RPM(sponsors on here) keep telling me not to go to a slick and that it will slow me down a little.

Nothing you will notice on a perfect run vs. perfect run. But what you will notice is consistently faster times due to having traction.

Detroitmuscle
06-24-2010, 08:48 PM
Why are you going up a hole on your LCAs? If your spinning you want to move down to where you were or further. Having the LCA level is good for cornering with the car but when your drag racing you want the force to push down on the back tires.

TA1364
06-24-2010, 09:15 PM
Just went 1.52 60' on a 150 shot tonight, still chattered the tires a little.

second_2_none
06-24-2010, 10:29 PM
Well like I said, I moved the lca's to the second hole down on my relocation brackets and left the tires at 18psi. I still wasnt able to dead hook but it did a WHOLE LOT better. I hit a 6.92@99mph 1.58 60' still spining. That was also progressed, 70% for .5 seconds. I think I need adjustable shocks and springs to hook on the radial, just not as consistent as a slick. I just like driving to the track with the radial and not having to change my wheels and tires, but I can if necessary.

TA1364
06-25-2010, 10:43 AM
Were you spraying out of the hole? Try leting it hit the tires on motor then flip the arming switch.

second_2_none
06-25-2010, 12:08 PM
Its a 150 shot progressed at 70% for .5 of a second. I'm trying to hook out of the hole with no progression, just dont think its going to happen though. I am able to pop the wheels of the ground a few inches just on motor but with the nitrous its not getting the proper weight transfer. I could feel the front extending a little but it for the most part it will just spin. Next time out I will make sure to have a buddy watch and record me launching, if they will let him on the track behind the car. If not it will have to be from the stands or fence.

JL ws-6
06-25-2010, 12:28 PM
If you really want to get the radials to work, then I'd get the shocks on the car, double adjustable will be the best thing you can do.

I'd also hit the car right out of the hole with 50% and have it all in within .3, start messing with that. The radial needs to be hit hard right away and the pressure kept on it, hence the reason for the double adjustable shock.

If you do want to stop fighting it, then out a set of 26x10.5S et drags on the car, 28x10.5S if you have the room for them, and just hit that thing with everything immediately right out of the gate. NO holding back with the slick, they take the hit and it's not a problem. 26 inch tire start with about 14 psi, 28 inch start with 13.

second_2_none
06-25-2010, 12:59 PM
If you really want to get the radials to work, then I'd get the shocks on the car, double adjustable will be the best thing you can do.

I'd also hit the car right out of the hole with 50% and have it all in within .3, start messing with that. The radial needs to be hit hard right away and the pressure kept on it, hence the reason for the double adjustable shock.

If you do want to stop fighting it, then out a set of 26x10.5S et drags on the car, 28x10.5S if you have the room for them, and just hit that thing with everything immediately right out of the gate. NO holding back with the slick, they take the hit and it's not a problem. 26 inch tire start with about 14 psi, 28 inch start with 13.

Thanks for the reply! Well double adjustable shocks means double the price. Will SA shocks be fine or DA necessary? The car is not making a whole lot of power, 520rwhp. I was told SA would work, but you drive a car much faster car than most people and have a lot of experience on the track.

sidewayz28
06-25-2010, 01:20 PM
MWC said SA front shocks would be fine for my goals, and im prob similar power levels to you..
But i also have a frankenstein set up in the rear right now.. Koni 4/3s and stock springs*. but Strange SA + 300# springs in the front. So im not sure how its going to hook once i go to the track.
I will be running 275/60 M/T DRs

second_2_none
06-25-2010, 03:09 PM
MWC said SA front shocks would be fine for my goals, and im prob similar power levels to you..
But i also have a frankenstein set up in the rear right now.. Koni 4/3s and stock shocks. but Strange SA + 300# springs in the front. So im not sure how its going to hook once i go to the track.
I will be running 275/60 M/T DRs

Yeah thats what he told me as well. I'm on the same tire you will be running on. He told me the DA strange shocks are about $100 more per shock and I just dont feel like spending another $600. I know its part of the game, but if I can get great results and still spend $200 less than I would rather do that. My car on the spray dont make a ton of power so I'm thinking that SA and 300lbs springs may not get my car to hook, but it will help a whole lot to where I can bring in more nitrous faster with my progressive.

sidewayz28
06-25-2010, 03:34 PM
yep, i'm not looking to be the quickest car out there.. and my car will see more street than it will strip. So i'm sure my set up will be more than enough

second_2_none
06-25-2010, 04:51 PM
My car is more of the opposite, it sees the track way more than the street. I've been trying to build the car first, or around the motor. I want the car to be able to handle what ever I throw at it. I will have my fun with my cam, nitrous ls1 for a while, but in the next year or so I will probably move up to an LQ4 or LQ9 408 or possibly an LS3 if I can swing it.

JL ws-6
06-26-2010, 05:27 AM
If a big motor is something that will eventually happen, do the double adjustable now, you'll be glad you did down the road.

I know the extra $ sucks on the shocks... but trust me there's a MILE of difference from a single to a double adjustable.

I went with R series qa1's the first time around, 12 way qa1 on the rear first time around as well.

Now there's afco double adjustable on the front with the heavy nose option (gets the shock rate up there for a heavier nose car, that's what madman and burkhart reccommended) and the rears, which I haven't purchased yet, will be the same, double adjustable afco coil overs. I am doing a little different setup in the back with the shocks then most do, but when I'm ready to buy I'll be getting those from madman.

The shocks, are a huge part of getting a car to work. That will be the difference from getting the car to 60 foot a 1.3 to a bottom 1.2, which is what I'm aiming for.

In your case, I think you make enough power to get it in the bottom 1.4 to high 1.3 range, and if you do that, you'll find that power level you're at to go alot faster then you think it will. Maximize what you have, and try to buy once and not have to rebuy parts, in the long run it will save you alot of $ and time.

Firehawk441
06-26-2010, 06:43 AM
Single adjustable QA1's are more then capable of high 1.2 60' times...
People who say different don't know what they're talking about.

MADMAN
06-26-2010, 06:44 AM
Put a set of doubles on the rear from AFCO and you can go singles on the front. Listen to RPM he knows what hes doing I have talked to him about your car and it can be fast if you listen. The radial is worth about 2 tenths over the slick when everything is right.

second_2_none
06-26-2010, 08:42 AM
Put a set of doubles on the rear from AFCO and you can go singles on the front. Listen to RPM he knows what hes doing I have talked to him about your car and it can be fast if you listen. The radial is worth about 2 tenths over the slick when everything is right.

Yeah RPM has been taking care of me for a few years now. I didnt know radials were that much faster, but it is a head ache trying to get everything right. So doubles in the rear and singles in the front? I thought for everything to really work right the fronts needed doubles and the rears only needed singles. Not that I am questioning you guys, just trying to understand. I know you guys have the best suspension out, or so I have been told by many.

second_2_none
06-28-2010, 01:01 PM
Alright I talked to MadMan on the phone and I am taking his advise. I will go with Afco doubles on the rear and some strange singles on the front. I will have to wait a couple weeks as they are 300 bucks per shock, but I'm sure it will be worth the wait. Thanks MadMan for helping out, you will be hearing from me soon! Thanks JL ws-6 and everyone else for your replies and suggestions!