Stereo & Electronics - Old School VS. New School Power

Ok so right now I'm running an old school setup of Rockford Fosgate Punch 200ix and Punch 4080. No problems with the amps at all but I decided to add another sub and before I spend more money on a old school amp can anyone suggest some new stuff that will push true power. Not these so called 1000 watt amps that might do that in a burp but Im looking for something that's true to its rating. Now I know most of the stuff back in the day for example rockford, orion, lanzar, us amps, PPI, Phoenix Gold, Soundstream and so on have pretty much turned to junk since no longer made in the USA or just not what it used to be. I'm used to class A/B power but did try JL audio's amps and was very disappointed, so please any suggestions of some good products. Oh and if you know about these amps then that will show your age just like me :lol:

Heres a pic of my setup under construction yet but might be changing...again
I do have the link and endcaps so it will look like one big amp, but if I add another 200ix will be a huge amp...if I could find another link

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs206.snc4/38653_1530030927312_1130906436_1528577_5932866_n.j pg

Ok so right now I'm running an old school setup of Rockford Fosgate Punch 200ix and Punch 4080. No problems with the amps at all but I decided to add another sub and before I spend more money on a old school amp can anyone suggest some new stuff that will push true power. Not these so called 1000 watt amps that might do that in a burp but Im looking for something that's true to its rating. Now I know most of the stuff back in the day for example rockford, orion, lanzar, us amps, PPI, Phoenix Gold, Soundstream and so on have pretty much turned to junk since no longer made in the USA or just not what it used to be. I'm used to class A/B power but did try JL audio's amps and was very disappointed, so please any suggestions of some good products. Oh and if you know about these amps then that will show your age just like me :lol:

Heres a pic of my setup under construction yet but might be changing...again
I do have the link and endcaps so it will look like one big amp, but if I add another 200ix will be a huge amp...if I could find another link

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs206.snc4/38653_1530030927312_1130906436_1528577_5932866_n.j pg
been into car audio for a while and im only 18 but i have herd stories about rockford and other "legendary" brands that used to rule the audio world.

Yes sir rockford used to be king along with many others. Pretty much any amp done by Zed Audio, PPI, Orion, among others were so called cheater amps. You have to remember though this was in a different time when the rules for SPL was alot different so you would have a amp that runs 25x2 but in reality would bridge to 500-1000w and you would still be in a lower class. So whats all this new school about anything worth looking into?

I just buy old school off of eBay these days. I've got old school Orion amps in my daily driver and my Z28...I've even got a spare set of Orion amps in case something happens to the ones I'm running now.

US Amps use to have the most insane ratings of all the old school cheater amps IMO. I had a US Amps USA-25 that was only rated at like 12.5 watts x 2 RMS, but the thing would bridge and even handle 1 Ohm loads bridged...that's just insane! I think it put out like 300 watts RMS at 1 Ohm bridged if I remember correctly!

I rock a 100wpc Sansui Amplifier into Boston Acoustics A70's in my bedroom. You know where I stand on the issue.

I just buy old school off of eBay these days. I've got old school Orion amps in my daily driver and my Z28...I've even got a spare set of Orion amps in case something happens to the ones I'm running now.

US Amps use to have the most insane ratings of all the old school cheater amps IMO. I had a US Amps USA-25 that was only rated at like 12.5 watts x 2 RMS, but the thing would bridge and even handle 1 Ohm loads bridged...that's just insane! I think it put out like 300 watts RMS at 1 Ohm bridged if I remember correctly!

Old School Orion :drool::drool: You don't have any of that you wanna let go would ya? :secret2:

I also have two old school amp for my setup. One is a (Punch 75HD) for the sub, and a (Series1 460SD) for the mids and highs.

Man I remember Orion and PPI making some damn nice amps. I ran two Eclipse amps back in the day on my 12" subs, I don't think they make them like that anymore. As far as new school - I think Alpine makes a decent amp.

I also have two old school amp for my setup. One is a (Punch 75HD) for the sub, and a (Series1 460SD) for the mids and highs.

I'd like to see pics of that setup ...thats some classics right there :)

I'd like to see pics of that setup ...thats some classics right there :)

Don't have any pictures. I am working on getting the amps mounted in the spare tire area. I will try to get some pictures of the amps. So people can see the little amps that could.

US Amps still makes some good stuff. I dont know what kind of power you are looking for, I like Sundown Audios stuff as well.

I like the older HiFonics as well, Ive used them for years and im still running one of there amps in my car. I remember when Rockford use to run things and when the DVC's came out from them they were unreal. Now all subs are Dual Voice Coil but lack the punch they had in the past.

Old School Orion :drool::drool: You don't have any of that you wanna let go would ya? :secret2:

Nah...I'm running the exact same Orion amps in both of my cars, and I have 1 set as a spare set...I don't know why, I've never had issues with my Orion stuff, but I love it so much that if anything ever did happen, I can just pop in my spare, reset the crossovers/gains and I'll be all set.

I do have some Crutchfield amps on eBay right now that were made by Precision Power back in '89 or so. I had a set of 5 amps that I was trying to sell as a set, but I finally split them up and I've already sold the 50x4 and 75x2, and all I've got left is a 50x2 and 30x2.

Here's a link to the expired auction of the set if you want to see some classic amps from '89 or so:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270542587519

US Amps still makes some good stuff. I dont know what kind of power you are looking for, I like Sundown Audios stuff as well.

See I wasnt sure about US Amps anymore, they used to be made in Florida back in the day but I thought now they were being made overseas. Dont quote me on that but thats what I heard. Im gonna have to check them out then cuz they were top dogs back in the day. Sundown very nice :cheers: Looking for about 1000w and a matching 4 channel, but might just keep the old school not sure yet :)

WOW!!! I remember them Crutchfields, it was all PPI guts very nice brings back memories there

Man I remember Orion and PPI making some damn nice amps. I ran two Eclipse amps back in the day on my 12" subs, I don't think they make them like that anymore. As far as new school - I think Alpine makes a decent amp.

yes alpine sure does great price to boot i have one and it surprised me

I used to love the Pheonix Gold MPS series amps and the MS stuff too.
Anyone remember the Orion monster (cheater amp) that was rated at 1 watt.
IIRC it was one of the last straws that made huge changes in SPL competition.
And Orion did it on purpose for that reason.

I thought the first orion hcca 225 were the shit.

Old school amps are great for raw power, where New School amps you are going to see a Signal to Noise ratio that far exceeds what the old stuff used to put out. For bass this isn't as big of a deal since raw power is really what is needed, but getting clear mid to highs you really should look at some of the newest stuff. SPL contests are all about loudness, not quaility. For some good new school power based amps, you might look at Memphis. They have some great products.

For anything other than your subs, if you are still running an older amp it might be time to shop for new.

Anyone have anything to say about Eclipse amps? I know back in the day they were expensive but you got good, clean power ... and it was powerful. I had two but gave them to my dad to put in his boat. For a while there, Eclipse seemed like they quit with the amps but it seems they are back. Anyone have one of their newer amps? I'd like to try and get them again if they're still good.

Just an FYI - the Eclipse amps in my dad's boat are about 10 years old and still trucking on pretty good. I had them on many different subs/speakers. The amps were too damn good to even consider buying a new one.

Anyone have anything to say about Eclipse amps? I know back in the day they were expensive but you got good, clean power ... and it was powerful. I had two but gave them to my dad to put in his boat. For a while there, Eclipse seemed like they quit with the amps but it seems they are back. Anyone have one of their newer amps? I'd like to try and get them again if they're still good.

Just an FYI - the Eclipse amps in my dad's boat are about 10 years old and still trucking on pretty good. I had them on many different subs/speakers. The amps were too damn good to even consider buying a new one.

I used to sell Eclipse too. Loved the entire product lineup from headunit to amps to speakers. Had a great warranty, 3 years if dealer installed. Also had non-detachable faceplates. If your stereo was stolen they would replace it for free. (ESN-Eclipse security network) I would still buy a headunit from them. But as far as their amps go, They were clean power but for the money there were better choices out there IMHO.

http://www.mmxpress.com/eclipse/images/32430.jpg

These were the amps from back in the day.

Eclipse - Fujitsu Ten

All this talk of old school got my attention:) Running some old MTX amps with Orion XTR's still..though i think its time for an upgrade (ya think) Still sounds pretty good for what it is...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c23/litemup02/IMG_0081.jpg

ummm....ya I wouldn't upgrade at all really. That is one clean install and the equipment you are using would sound better then some of the new stuff they have out. I wouldn't change a thing it looks clean and Im sure it sounds clean.

All this talk of old school got my attention:) Running some old MTX amps with Orion XTR's still..though i think its time for an upgrade (ya think) Still sounds pretty good for what it is...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c23/litemup02/IMG_0081.jpg

I vote upgrade! Get those amps somewhere else. From what I can see It looks like a clean install but I can't stand the amps in the back like that.
Nice setup though!

I vote upgrade! Get those amps somewhere else. From what I can see It looks like a clean install but I can't stand the amps in the back like that.
Nice setup though!


Ok so where would you suggest to put em? I really don't see a problem having your amps there and showing them off, why hide something that's meant to be shown and meant to breathe, also why would you upgrade a classic MTX that
s a/b power, yes he could move to a class D amplifier but why spend money on something when what you have would be more than enough.

I used to sell Eclipse too. Loved the entire product lineup from headunit to amps to speakers. Had a great warranty, 3 years if dealer installed. Also had non-detachable faceplates. If your stereo was stolen they would replace it for free. (ESN-Eclipse security network) I would still buy a headunit from them. But as far as their amps go, They were clean power but for the money there were better choices out there IMHO.

http://www.mmxpress.com/eclipse/images/32430.jpg

These were the amps from back in the day.

Eclipse - Fujitsu Ten

Ya I remember them old Eclipse units, also to get them to work you had use a "key cd" I remember I used my dr. the chronic album and then my cd's got stolen lol.

I have run the fosgate power 50x2 with the optional balanced line driver the last 10 years...it drives 3 eclipse 88102dvc subs in the back of my 93 ta...these old school fosgates kick ass, they are little animals and the SQ is awesome...but I just picked up a phoenix gold ZPA 0.5 amp for 500.00 and I am going to have to change out for more thump, but from what I have heard the phoenix gold is a powerhouse in its own right.

Ok so where would you suggest to put em? I really don't see a problem having your amps there and showing them off, why hide something that's meant to be shown and meant to breathe, also why would you upgrade a classic MTX that
s a/b power, yes he could move to a class D amplifier but why spend money on something when what you have would be more than enough.

I made that comment because it is my personal oppinion. If you want a stack of lumber with amps mounted to them, thats yours. I would mount them in the spare tire well on a custom mount. If temp is a problem, there are ways to fix that too. That is what I would do. In no way, shape or form am I suggesting you to mount yours there! :eek:

I made that comment because it is my personal oppinion. If you want a stack of lumber with amps mounted to them, thats yours. I would mount them in the spare tire well on a custom mount. If temp is a problem, there are ways to fix that too. That is what I would do. In no way, shape or form am I suggesting you to mount yours there! :eek:

I do see your point, the fact of the matter is a Camaro is just a horrible car to a custom install in, I mean Im going to have 3 amps, audiocontrol eqx, audiocontrol epic center and crossovers for the mids and highs just not enough room lol but I love good sound and will some how make it work. I really dont want a stack of lumber there but hopefully by the time Im done it wont be too much of an eyesore.

I have run the fosgate power 50x2 with the optional balanced line driver the last 10 years...it drives 3 eclipse 88102dvc subs in the back of my 93 ta...these old school fosgates kick ass, they are little animals and the SQ is awesome...but I just picked up a phoenix gold ZPA 0.5 amp for 500.00 and I am going to have to change out for more thump, but from what I have heard the phoenix gold is a powerhouse in its own right.

Yes old school Phoenix Gold = GOD!!! Seriously that was another classic that could handle anything you throw at it I wish I still had my PG Octane I think only 250 were made but had to let her go.

Yes old school Phoenix Gold = GOD!!! Seriously that was another classic that could handle anything you throw at it I wish I still had my PG Octane I think only 250 were made but had to let her go.

The Zeropoint amps were very powerfull. (as long as the fans work) IIRC they were clost to a grand new, 12 years ago.

from what I have heard they have 2 oz of 24 carat in them...beautiful amp. And it bangs the hell out of my 3 eclipse 10's...this amp is a freakin monster.

I made that comment because it is my personal oppinion. If you want a stack of lumber with amps mounted to them, thats yours. I would mount them in the spare tire well on a custom mount. If temp is a problem, there are ways to fix that too. That is what I would do. In no way, shape or form am I suggesting you to mount yours there! :eek:

Just so you know its not a stack of lumber.. mine is actually an overlay. Amps sit on the deck

Lets go back a little further. Anyone here remember the PG outlaw?
2 amps in 1 chassis.
Came is a wooden crate.
I still have one of the sales posters from way back.

http://tristanrules.com/OUTLAW/P1010776.jpg

HOLY SHIT that just brought back some memories....Is that beauty for sale :) Kinda reminds me of my Octane!!

Just so you know its not a stack of lumber.. mine is actually an overlay. Amps sit on the deck

Just couldn't let it be, could ya? :givesfuck Not my point!

Easy killer..and i dont give a fuck either. Just clearing it up.. :wave-fing

HOLY SHIT that just brought back some memories....Is that beauty for sale :) Kinda reminds me of my Octane!!

What about the Cyclone sub. The only sub to reproduce frequencies that low. Bad side was it needed a set of conventional subs to pick up the higher notes.

http://www.soundimage.dk/images/Cyclone-front.jpg
http://www.soundimage.dk/images/Cyclone-rear.jpg

The excursion capabilities of these was terrible. I only sold a few of them but couldn't tell you how many were replaced under warranty.

And were they expensive, DAMN!

Easy killer..and i dont give a fuck either. Just clearing it up.. :wave-fing

:cry: Now wipe your tears, everythings going to be just fine....

lol.. i see you own a pusstang too.. explains it all. Your T/A prob dominates your "drag car" doesnt it?

lol.. i see you own a pusstang too.. explains it all. Your T/A prob dominates your "drag car" doesnt it?

WOW, must have really hit a nerve! Your reaching for something. :corn:

No i was just trying to get to you;) Guess its a draw:) Back on to the thread... I'm thinking of ditching the subthump box and going to twin stealth boxes. Any recommended 10's that would work well with my thunder 2160's?

I say get what sounds good to you. If you like your current system the way it is then why change?

Recently i've heard a few setups that just sounded so much more crisp. (If that makes sense) And i'd like to have the normal T-top storage back. The t-top box works but its kind of a pain. Just didnt know if my amps would be enough to push some of the latest 10's.

I have been thinking of doing a system in mine again.
Maybe a Mobile ES C90, JL 900/5, JL ZR650-CSi (X2), JL Stealthbox single 10.
Something simple! Never know though.

What about the Cyclone sub. The only sub to reproduce frequencies that low. Bad side was it needed a set of conventional subs to pick up the higher notes.

http://www.soundimage.dk/images/Cyclone-front.jpg
http://www.soundimage.dk/images/Cyclone-rear.jpg

The excursion capabilities of these was terrible. I only sold a few of them but couldn't tell you how many were replaced under warranty.

And were they expensive, DAMN!

Ya if I remember correctly between 700-800 and they did hit real low but your right if you didnt have another pair of subs to pick up the higher hz level you will be disappointed. Hmmm... I wouldnt use one in a system but would be nice to have for my collection :)

No i was just trying to get to you;) Guess its a draw:) Back on to the thread... I'm thinking of ditching the subthump box and going to twin stealth boxes. Any recommended 10's that would work well with my thunder 2160's?


Ok I have the driver side stealthbox with a JL 10W3V3 and a passenger subthump....too my knowledge JL Audio doesn't have a passenger stealth box....do they??? Would love to see this :)

Ok I have the driver side stealthbox with a JL 10W3V3 and a passenger subthump....too my knowledge JL Audio doesn't have a passenger stealth box....do they??? Would love to see this :)

No i dont believe so..but some other company's do.

I have been running my black Orion BEAST since new. Just recently one of the channels went out. I have never had a newer amp last more than a couple of years without some kind of an issue. I am actually getting ready to send of the Orion to get the channel fixed but don't know where to send it.

All this talk of old school got my attention:) Running some old MTX amps with Orion XTR's still..though i think its time for an upgrade (ya think) Still sounds pretty good for what it is...

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c23/litemup02/IMG_0081.jpg

Still got my 12" Orion XTR's ! Still sound great

My first sub was an Orion XTR, I loved it. I eventually replaced it with a JL Audio sub

I'll chime in for the Rockford Power 500a2 and 800a2 that were made in the late 90's and early 2000's. You can still find them for sale on ebay pretty regularly.

I have a 500a2 that has been in several installs and is still going strong (bought new back around 99' or 00'). That sucker benched at 730W at around 13V if memory serves. Powered my 3 JL 12W6's at 8 ohm's very nicely! Now its on a 15" Kicker L7 that I got for free.

I started on my install tonight. Here is some pic of what's going in.

249416

249417

249418

249419

I also have these speakers on order-CDT CL-E6Cf
and CL-6. This was done on a budget.

I started on my install tonight. Here is some pic of what's going in.

249416

249417

249418

249419

I also have these speakers on order-CDT CL-E6Cf
and CL-6. This was done on a budget.

Thats a nice setup on a budget, be sure to show some pics when finished. Also you wont be disappointed with CDT Speakers :)

Thats a nice setup on a budget, be sure to show some pics when finished. Also you wont be disappointed with CDT Speakers :)

Try to get some more work done on it on Monday. Will get some more pic soon.

Just a few more pic of my install-still waiting on speakers to come in.

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[ATTACH]250675

250676

Finally got finish with the install..
Poor sub-can't take the power of the punch75, now I need to dynamat the truck area of
the car. Here is a few more pics..


251937

251938

251939

Still need to do a little work with the radio bezel, and mount the ipod.

Nice Job Buddy .

Nice Job Buddy .

If you are talking about me thanks.

If you are talking about me thanks.

yes sir im talking about you

Took sometime to find the things I wanted. Then I got both amps for a good price eBay.

Damn this thread has been a nice trip back in time. I ran MTX thunder 2300x and 4300x amps and I loved them. My first system included an Aura Force12 connected to the rear channels of the 4300x bridged (pre 2300x) great power and great sound. Ive been looking for some ZPA0.5 and ZPA0.3 amps just to store for when I get a car worthy of a system.

The PG cyclone was sold to the wrong people for the wrong reasons. they were meant for a home theatre application to play frequencies below the human audible range. people tried to play them in the audible range and blew them out. you needed 10" or 12" subs to go along with them.

I was never a fan of fosgate, but the Power DVC subs were always a favorite, as well as the eclipse 8800 series and going older, old school JL w6. the PPI pro series subs were nice too, liquid cooled and all.

I did run the JL slash series when they came out and i personally liked them. maybe not zeropoint level of quality, but not the other junk thats out there now.

What did you have against the JL Audio amps? I have JL, and many of my friends do too and we all love them. Just interested to see which one you tried and what you thought of it.

Took sometime to find the things I wanted. Then I got both amps for a good price eBay.


Nice setup, love that you went with the old school RF gear!! Looks nice and Im sure even sounds better :secret2:

Nice setup, love that you went with the old school RF gear!! Looks nice and Im sure even sounds better :secret2:

I love the old RF amp's. Thats all I had when I was in my 20's. Yes it does sound good, but now that I am 40. I do not turn it up that lound, but it's nice to have if do want a little BASS.

Thanks