LarsV8

So coming off a fresh rebuild. Rebuilt bottom end, heads/cam etc. I also put in a SPEC stage 2+ clutch while I had the motor out. Flywheel was resurfaced, new PP and clutch.

Fired her up for the first time tonight, but couldn't get it to go in any gear while it was running. It would go into gear with the motor off, but not when the car was running.

I bled the system as instructed in the owners manual, but I had no bubbles either before or after.

As I was trying to push the gear into first, the car would start moving forward slightly, same with reverse. I am fairly certain I installed the clutch plate correctly. In my searching I read about shims, but I didnt have any shims included with my clutch and didn't put any in during the install.

Any suggestions?

thecobrahunter

iTrader: (1)

I'm having a similar problem -on my way home, downshifted from 3rd to 2nd, and pulled away just wonderfully. Then, when I got to the last light, couldn't get into any gear. Not a tranny/clutch guru, so here's some of my quick observations:

1. when the car is on, the engine idles nice and quiet, just as before the problem; no unusual grinding sounds coming from the tranny
2. as I was approaching the last light, there was no horrible grinding clunking sound coming from the rear
3. clutch pedal has same feel when pushed down and sprung back up
4. Centerforce clutch has about 45-50k miles
5. car does have the rev limiter in place...quite sure I didn't even bump redline
6. didn't see any type of fluid trail behind the car, or pooling underneath

DaddySS

Did you replace the slave? How did you bleed the clutch, did you use a mityvac?

BALLSS

what year car?

blue99fbody

iTrader: (5)

shim the slave or get a adjustable master

LarsV8

1995

I did not replace the slave.

I bled the clutch by disconnecting the slave and holding it above the master while manually pushing in the pushrod.

BALLSS

One thing it could be... if you TQ the PP bolts more than 22 ft lbs.....disengagement will not happen (go into gear)....

I got careless once and used my air gun on assembly...had to pull tranny and losen/TQ PP bolts to 22 ft lns.

factory TQ spec:

PP=22 ft lbs
FW=76 ft lbs

and stock hydraulics should not be opened/disconnected. hopefully your bleeding method worked

pull type clutch there are no spacers.

LarsV8

Hmm,

I thought that I double checked the torque specs when I assembled it but those numbers don't sound familiar, so I suppose I may have over torqued them.

I went and bought a mighty vac today and tried again to bleed the system, using a different method, with no luck.

DaddySS

What mity vac method did you use?

LarsV8

The one outlined here

http://performanceworks1.com/ls1_clutch_bleeding.htm

BALLSS

Mighty Vac is the best way to bleed these hydraulics. something you needed to do anyway since you opened the system.

PP TQ, 22 ft lbs is not much. make sure the threads in FW are cleaned out and use red lock tite on PP & FW bolts.

I had a 2+ and it was a plug & play install using stock f body hyd., no shims.

assume your clutch fork is on TO bearing right and fork pivot bolt is tight.

clutch fork position should look like pic:

LarsV8

Wait wait wait, which is the fork pivot bolt? I remember asking myself what keeps the fork in the right spot and if it could go in wrong. It seemed as if there were only two positions in or out. This should probably be the next thing for me to look at tommorow.

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

There is no shim needed with our LT1 kits. What flywheel is being used? Was it resurfaced? Has it been cut more than once? Having a flywheel that is too thin as a result of machining will affect clutch release. Additionally, making sure that the fork and pivot are in good shape is key. Both parts wear over time and this will greatly affect clutch actuation. Let me know if you have any further questions and I will be happy to assist you further. Thanks,

LarsV8

To be honest I am not sure. I remember doing some dealings with McLeod 10+ years ago, but I dont know if it was just a clutch or a flywheel. I don't believe it was machined more than once.

Heres what it looked like when I took it off.



Here it is after machining. Maybe you can tell?



I did not know the fork and pivot could wear out. Is this something I could check by just disconnecting the slave? What am I looking for? Is it possible to not put the fork in its "in" position correctly?

BALLSS

thepic looks like a billet FW but I have not seen a LT1 that had a recessed part like the top pic (assumeing it came that way and was not worn down to create that recess). In the bottom pic the outer part of the FW was turned (machined) down to same level as disc mating surface, which would be like a stock FW. Maybe now this billet FW is to thin.

I don't have thickness of stock FW...you could go to a auto part store and measure one they have and yours. If you pull your starter there should be enough room to get calipers in to measure yours.

I don't know at what point a FW for the pull type clutch gets to thin to cause disengagement problems..or if it matters. You can buy shims to put between crank & FW to move the FW back out. You can buy a stock replacement FW for around $60 with core from most auto part stores

....if you are not clear on what TQ you did on PP bolts...check that

SPEC-01

iTrader: (2)

Please measure the thickness of the flywheel from the crank mounting surface to the friction surface that contacts the disc. The flywheel should have no recess at all, it should be flat.

LarsV8

Well I had it towed to the shop since I dont have enough room to drop a tranny.

I get a phone call and he tells me he thinks the throw out bearing was installed incorrectly because the fork isnt as tight as it should be and the hydraulic system appears to be working correctly. I give him the go ahead to drop the tranny and have a look.

He calls me back and tells me he thinks the fork, throw out bearing and pp are destroyed because "he has never seen a pp where the fins go that way". I ask him not to do anything because I had a working clutch and pp at home that I know was working when I replaced it, so we could compare when I got off work. I happen to have a picture of the pp pre install for reference:





This looks correct to me, so I dunno.

So I go up there show him my old pp and clutch and we "determine" that fins were correct (rolls eyes) and that the t.o.b. was on the right way. The first thing I noticed was that the clip that holds the t.o.b was bent to ****. Now I don't think that he bent it when he took it off because that would be kinda difficult.

So my question is...is it possible that when I tried to slide the fork on it caught the clip and bent it a little dislodging the t.o.b, which in turn caused my "wont go into gear" problem?

He seemed to think that it was unlikely. His question was what keeps the fork from falling off the T/O bearing. I didn't have an answer. I dont recall messing with the pivot bolt during the removal or install of the motor. Perhaps that is the cause? Is it possible the clutch fork is bad and won't stick on the bearing?

Anyone have any input?

2slow2flurry-ous

iTrader: (13)

Most likely it's your flywheel. Had the exact same problem and the flywheel was over-machined. At. .0015" you will have engagement issues.

LarsV8

So when I went up to the Tranny shop today I saw my car driving the other way

Looks like the clip came off the fork and wouldn't stay on the bearing. He replaced the fork and it fixed the problem.