obx header question
03-24-2011, 07:54 PM
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obx header question Just got a little money that I can play around with and I'm thinking about getting the 1 7/8 OBX headers. I know u usually get what u pay for, so I'm asking y'all who have done it is it worth it. I can only find 1 video on the tube that really doesn't do too much for me sound wise. So I'm asking to please let me know if u have encountered any issues besides the one with the clearance issue. And post up some sound clips. Thanks
03-25-2011, 01:12 AM
#3
If I were going the cheaper route, I'd probably do ceramic coated pacesetters rather than the chinese ripoff brand, but that's just me. It's 'easy' to make something look good and just copy something to get it to fit; I wouldn't want to risk having to chase down mystery problems down the road in real world useage (heating/cooling cycles with welds, warpage and so on) though. I mean, you may be alright or you may not. Can't make the decision for you of course, but just some things to think about...Something like this I like to do once and be done with it and not have to worry. Beyond that I don't like to support such company practices when I can help it, but that's another story 
03-25-2011, 01:46 AM
#4
If I were going the cheaper route, I'd probably do ceramic coated pacesetters rather than the chinese ripoff brand, but that's just me. It's 'easy' to make something look good and just copy something to get it to fit; I wouldn't want to risk having to chase down mystery problems down the road in real world useage (heating/cooling cycles with welds, warpage and so on) though. I mean, you may be alright or you may not. Can't make the decision for you of course, but just some things to think about...Something like this I like to do once and be done with it and not have to worry. Beyond that I don't like to support such company practices when I can help it, but that's another story
03-25-2011, 05:54 AM
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03-25-2011, 07:00 AM
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i got the cash but im just being cheap. ima prob break down and get the kooks 1 7/8 bro
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03-25-2011, 10:59 AM
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I like how everyone refers to obx as chinese rip off. It's Japanese steel that meets the same grade/quality/parameters as American 304 steel.
Look on the back of your iPhone: Made in China, look on the door of 40% of gm vehicles: Mexico. There are standards for a reason. Do some homework.
OP: tubing is tubing. And that's that. Equal length? If they differed up to 2", your talking fractional TQ. Most people are mad because they paid 1300 for Kooks because a machine welded the primaries to the flange. The machine that was programmer by human. And along with a huge overhead company, they have no choice but to create a huge mark up. How else would the owner afford his multi-million dollar mansion.
Use logic not pride. Kooks ain't looking out for, why should I look out for them. Hell, they are probably made in Mexico anyways.
Look on the back of your iPhone: Made in China, look on the door of 40% of gm vehicles: Mexico. There are standards for a reason. Do some homework.
OP: tubing is tubing. And that's that. Equal length? If they differed up to 2", your talking fractional TQ. Most people are mad because they paid 1300 for Kooks because a machine welded the primaries to the flange. The machine that was programmer by human. And along with a huge overhead company, they have no choice but to create a huge mark up. How else would the owner afford his multi-million dollar mansion.
Use logic not pride. Kooks ain't looking out for, why should I look out for them. Hell, they are probably made in Mexico anyways.
03-25-2011, 11:36 AM
#10
header debate I'm at exactly the same place right now. Kooks does offer the hi flow cats, which OBX does not. they look like cats, but are in fact hollow "resonators" that some members claim stink like unburned fuel (that rotten egg smell). If your state does the tail pipe "sniffer" inspection, you wont pass with OBX set up guaranteed. Pacesetter sells "ceramic coated" for about $150 extra and they do offer hi flow cats, but I think they are about $300 pair. BTW Amazon had the best deal on Pacesetters but are out of stock for at least 3 months-I know cause I called Pacesetter in Phoenix and they aren't building our model right now. Pacesetter headers are available on Ebay in plain or coated version, along with the "off road extensions" that are also sold out on Amazon. Also listed on Ebay is at least 20 different types of header wraps in varying colors, lengths, thicknesses and compositions. So, you could buy any off the cheaper headers and wrap them up in any nice color you'd care to. I just wish my damn Maggie would arrive that I ordered from Hendrix over 3 weeks ago, then I could start buying my own headers! Seems kind of ***-backwards to do it the other way!
leo
leo
03-25-2011, 11:58 AM
#11
I like how everyone refers to obx as chinese rip off. It's Japanese steel that meets the same grade/quality/parameters as American 304 steel.
Look on the back of your iPhone: Made in China, look on the door of 40% of gm vehicles: Mexico. There are standards for a reason. Do some homework.
OP: tubing is tubing. And that's that. Equal length? If they differed up to 2", your talking fractional TQ. Most people are mad because they paid 1300 for Kooks because a machine welded the primaries to the flange. The machine that was programmer by human. And along with a huge overhead company, they have no choice but to create a huge mark up. How else would the owner afford his multi-million dollar mansion.
Use logic not pride. Kooks ain't looking out for, why should I look out for them. Hell, they are probably made in Mexico anyways.
Look on the back of your iPhone: Made in China, look on the door of 40% of gm vehicles: Mexico. There are standards for a reason. Do some homework.
OP: tubing is tubing. And that's that. Equal length? If they differed up to 2", your talking fractional TQ. Most people are mad because they paid 1300 for Kooks because a machine welded the primaries to the flange. The machine that was programmer by human. And along with a huge overhead company, they have no choice but to create a huge mark up. How else would the owner afford his multi-million dollar mansion.
Use logic not pride. Kooks ain't looking out for, why should I look out for them. Hell, they are probably made in Mexico anyways.
...Look how they advertise them and they've even use both references - in the same line, which just goes to show they don't even know what they are trying to say. SUS is only a specification and it can come from anywhere in the world. I don't need to do any homewaork, as I've been paying attention to this for probably 25 years now and I work in the industry that deals with materials, assemblies and so on for quite some time. "Chinese rip-off" is just that, a chinese product that (blatantly) rip's off anothers design. Sure, some of the cars are 'hecho en mexico" now, but guess what, I have a choice, as limited as it is.Like anything else, there is quality or lack thereof in the material, but more importantly the welds (assembly is only as good as what's holding it together)...Has nothing to do with pride and you either get what I'm saying or you don't. It's your money and if you want issues now and down the line, be my guest...I'm not going to waste any more time arguing about this and just simply stating yes, "you get what you pay for" and wish you luck. They are cheap for a reason and why put some junky part on a car that is more deserving than that, imo.
Does this mean Kook's are well worth the extra money? No, probably not...But, if you've followed the price of raw materials, such as stainless steel, in the past few years, you would notice the price has gone thru the roof. Even my Hooker Super comps that used to be $300 at one time are now $550 and that's just mild carbon steel.
Last edited by JNR_Design; 03-25-2011 at 12:09 PM.
03-25-2011, 01:02 PM
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Not this "japanese steel" again ...Look how they advertise them and they've even use both references - in the same line, which just goes to show they don't even know what they are trying to say. SUS is only a specification and it can come from anywhere in the world. I don't need to do any homewaork, as I've been paying attention to this for probably 25 years now and I work in the industry that deals with materials, assemblies and so on for quite some time. "Chinese rip-off" is just that, a chinese product that (blatantly) rip's off anothers design. Sure, some of the cars are 'hecho en mexico" now, but guess what, I have a choice, as limited as it is.
Like anything else, there is quality or lack thereof in the material, but more importantly the welds (assembly is only as good as what's holding it together)...Has nothing to do with pride and you either get what I'm saying or you don't. It's your money and if you want issues now and down the line, be my guest...I'm not going to waste any more time arguing about this and just simply stating yes, "you get what you pay for" and wish you luck. They are cheap for a reason and why put some junky part on a car that is more deserving than that, imo.
Does this mean Kook's are well worth the extra money? No, probably not...But, if you've followed the price of raw materials, such as stainless steel, in the past few years, you would notice the price has gone thru the roof. Even my Hooker Super comps that used to be $300 at one time are now $550 and that's just mild carbon steel.
...Look how they advertise them and they've even use both references - in the same line, which just goes to show they don't even know what they are trying to say. SUS is only a specification and it can come from anywhere in the world. I don't need to do any homewaork, as I've been paying attention to this for probably 25 years now and I work in the industry that deals with materials, assemblies and so on for quite some time. "Chinese rip-off" is just that, a chinese product that (blatantly) rip's off anothers design. Sure, some of the cars are 'hecho en mexico" now, but guess what, I have a choice, as limited as it is.Like anything else, there is quality or lack thereof in the material, but more importantly the welds (assembly is only as good as what's holding it together)...Has nothing to do with pride and you either get what I'm saying or you don't. It's your money and if you want issues now and down the line, be my guest...I'm not going to waste any more time arguing about this and just simply stating yes, "you get what you pay for" and wish you luck. They are cheap for a reason and why put some junky part on a car that is more deserving than that, imo.
Does this mean Kook's are well worth the extra money? No, probably not...But, if you've followed the price of raw materials, such as stainless steel, in the past few years, you would notice the price has gone thru the roof. Even my Hooker Super comps that used to be $300 at one time are now $550 and that's just mild carbon steel.
So, your not an expert then since you 'follow' the industry. Agree?
For one, SUS is not the grade. 304 is the grade standard. T304 is Type 304. SUS-T304... is simply Japanese standard that meets T304 specifications and requirements in hardness, chemical properties, tensile strenght and such...
America does not use a prefix, We simply refer metals to their grade; 304, 409...
The price of RAW Materials has nothing to do with this conversation. Its the overhead of the companies producing the product. Why does the backyard shop charge less than the world wide company, because the backyard shop doesnt have an upper management, CEO's and other overhead personell sucking the life out of profits. You being a business man should understand that. Why does it cost more for you to take your car to a "stealership" than another reputable shop. Because they charge more for labor due to the workers being higher paid and they have MORE OVERHEAD!
Heres a link for the specs of the steel grade:
http://www.azom.com/Details.asp?Arti...cal_Properties
Scroll to table 4 for a comparison table on the grade and spec equivalencies around the world.
03-25-2011, 04:04 PM
#14
Not this "japanese steel" again ...Look how they advertise them and they've even use both references - in the same line, which just goes to show they don't even know what they are trying to say. SUS is only a specification and it can come from anywhere in the world. I don't need to do any homewaork, as I've been paying attention to this for probably 25 years now and I work in the industry that deals with materials, assemblies and so on for quite some time. "Chinese rip-off" is just that, a chinese product that (blatantly) rip's off anothers design. Sure, some of the cars are 'hecho en mexico" now, but guess what, I have a choice, as limited as it is.
Like anything else, there is quality or lack thereof in the material, but more importantly the welds (assembly is only as good as what's holding it together)...Has nothing to do with pride and you either get what I'm saying or you don't. It's your money and if you want issues now and down the line, be my guest...I'm not going to waste any more time arguing about this and just simply stating yes, "you get what you pay for" and wish you luck. They are cheap for a reason and why put some junky part on a car that is more deserving than that, imo.
Does this mean Kook's are well worth the extra money? No, probably not...But, if you've followed the price of raw materials, such as stainless steel, in the past few years, you would notice the price has gone thru the roof. Even my Hooker Super comps that used to be $300 at one time are now $550 and that's just mild carbon steel.
...Look how they advertise them and they've even use both references - in the same line, which just goes to show they don't even know what they are trying to say. SUS is only a specification and it can come from anywhere in the world. I don't need to do any homewaork, as I've been paying attention to this for probably 25 years now and I work in the industry that deals with materials, assemblies and so on for quite some time. "Chinese rip-off" is just that, a chinese product that (blatantly) rip's off anothers design. Sure, some of the cars are 'hecho en mexico" now, but guess what, I have a choice, as limited as it is.Like anything else, there is quality or lack thereof in the material, but more importantly the welds (assembly is only as good as what's holding it together)...Has nothing to do with pride and you either get what I'm saying or you don't. It's your money and if you want issues now and down the line, be my guest...I'm not going to waste any more time arguing about this and just simply stating yes, "you get what you pay for" and wish you luck. They are cheap for a reason and why put some junky part on a car that is more deserving than that, imo.
Does this mean Kook's are well worth the extra money? No, probably not...But, if you've followed the price of raw materials, such as stainless steel, in the past few years, you would notice the price has gone thru the roof. Even my Hooker Super comps that used to be $300 at one time are now $550 and that's just mild carbon steel.
As much as you like to be seen as a person of knowledge, have you ever personally held a OBX header? Have you ever actually Tig welded? In what level? Have you ever actually checked the metal used in OBX or the thickness of the OBX flange vs its competitors(Pacesetter, Hooker, Kooks, etc)?
If not, then GTFO and stop preaching all high and mighty. In all honesty, those little cheap labor employee's are every bit as quality of welders as anything i've seen in the Kook's stuff, and better than what ive seen out of Pacesetter/etc. the flanges are comprable, and in some models THICKER than the Kooks, and the ball joint flanges and hardware(minus the shitty gaskets) are excellent. Their weld consistency and most importantly penetration consistency is well above par. Have you ever actually documented a crack in a OBX header? I haven't personally myself.
I've installed them on C6's, C5's, Fbodies, and a SSR(don't ask, haha). In all cases the quality of the header shocked even the people in the shop that personally owned Kook's headers on their cars. To be honest, yep, it sucks *** that they are a knock-off and that sucks our american companies(thank you Kooks for staying 100% US MADE) have that level of competition. BUT, it's the nature of a global economy.
There's two part's that SUCK on the OBX:
1) The spike in the collector where all primaries come together. In every set I've seen, they are NASTY, and really if you are looking for the last 1% of power out of your car, these aren't the headers for you. If you're generally worried about them, a quick 30 minute work with a dremel works wonders.
2) The header gaskets SUCK. Who cares though, anyone who doesn't re-use their factory gaskets is crazy anyways.
Between Kook's and OBX, I'd buy the Kook's if i had the $$$$, no doubt. Between Pacesetter and OBX, I'd pick OBX.
If it's a matter of maximum performance PER dollar, you have to go with OBX.
The kook's might make another 5rwhp.....MAYBE, but at double the price....I think i can find somewhere else to pick up 5rwhp.
03-25-2011, 04:09 PM
#15
As much as you like to be seen as a person of knowledge, have you ever personally held a OBX header? Have you ever actually Tig welded? In what level? Have you ever actually checked the metal used in OBX or the thickness of the OBX flange vs its competitors(Pacesetter, Hooker, Kooks, etc)?
If not, then GTFO and stop preaching all high and mighty. In all honesty, those little cheap labor employee's are every bit as quality of welders as anything i've seen in the Kook's stuff, and better than what ive seen out of Pacesetter/etc. the flanges are comprable, and in some models THICKER than the Kooks, and the ball joint flanges and hardware(minus the shitty gaskets) are excellent. Their weld consistency and most importantly penetration consistency is well above par. Have you ever actually documented a crack in a OBX header? I haven't personally myself.
I've installed them on C6's, C5's, Fbodies, and a SSR(don't ask, haha). In all cases the quality of the header shocked even the people in the shop that personally owned Kook's headers on their cars. To be honest, yep, it sucks *** that they are a knock-off and that sucks our american companies(thank you Kooks for staying 100% US MADE) have that level of competition. BUT, it's the nature of a global economy.
There's two part's that SUCK on the OBX:
1) The spike in the collector where all primaries come together. In every set I've seen, they are NASTY, and really if you are looking for the last 1% of power out of your car, these aren't the headers for you. If you're generally worried about them, a quick 30 minute work with a dremel works wonders.
2) The header gaskets SUCK. Who cares though, anyone who doesn't re-use their factory gaskets is crazy anyways.
Between Kook's and OBX, I'd buy the Kook's if i had the $$$$, no doubt. Between Pacesetter and OBX, I'd pick OBX.
If it's a matter of maximum performance PER dollar, you have to go with OBX.
The kook's might make another 5rwhp.....MAYBE, but at double the price....I think i can find somewhere else to pick up 5rwhp.
If not, then GTFO and stop preaching all high and mighty. In all honesty, those little cheap labor employee's are every bit as quality of welders as anything i've seen in the Kook's stuff, and better than what ive seen out of Pacesetter/etc. the flanges are comprable, and in some models THICKER than the Kooks, and the ball joint flanges and hardware(minus the shitty gaskets) are excellent. Their weld consistency and most importantly penetration consistency is well above par. Have you ever actually documented a crack in a OBX header? I haven't personally myself.
I've installed them on C6's, C5's, Fbodies, and a SSR(don't ask, haha). In all cases the quality of the header shocked even the people in the shop that personally owned Kook's headers on their cars. To be honest, yep, it sucks *** that they are a knock-off and that sucks our american companies(thank you Kooks for staying 100% US MADE) have that level of competition. BUT, it's the nature of a global economy.
There's two part's that SUCK on the OBX:
1) The spike in the collector where all primaries come together. In every set I've seen, they are NASTY, and really if you are looking for the last 1% of power out of your car, these aren't the headers for you. If you're generally worried about them, a quick 30 minute work with a dremel works wonders.
2) The header gaskets SUCK. Who cares though, anyone who doesn't re-use their factory gaskets is crazy anyways.
Between Kook's and OBX, I'd buy the Kook's if i had the $$$$, no doubt. Between Pacesetter and OBX, I'd pick OBX.
If it's a matter of maximum performance PER dollar, you have to go with OBX.
The kook's might make another 5rwhp.....MAYBE, but at double the price....I think i can find somewhere else to pick up 5rwhp.
03-25-2011, 04:12 PM
#17
I guess i just don't really see the OBX headers as a Kook's competition. If people have the $$$$ to buy kook's, they are going to buy Kooks.
The OBX's are really more of a direct competition for Pacesetters IMO. And in this case, the Pacesetter's are bringing a knife to a gunfight.
The OBX's are really more of a direct competition for Pacesetters IMO. And in this case, the Pacesetter's are bringing a knife to a gunfight.
03-25-2011, 05:12 PM
#18
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So, your not an expert then since you 'follow' the industry. Agree?
For one, SUS is not the grade. 304 is the grade standard. T304 is Type 304. SUS-T304... is simply Japanese standard that meets T304 specifications and requirements in hardness, chemical properties, tensile strenght and such...
America does not use a prefix, We simply refer metals to their grade; 304, 409...
The price of RAW Materials has nothing to do with this conversation. Its the overhead of the companies producing the product. Why does the backyard shop charge less than the world wide company, because the backyard shop doesnt have an upper management, CEO's and other overhead personell sucking the life out of profits. You being a business man should understand that. Why does it cost more for you to take your car to a "stealership" than another reputable shop. Because they charge more for labor due to the workers being higher paid and they have MORE OVERHEAD!
Heres a link for the specs of the steel grade:
http://www.azom.com/Details.asp?Arti...cal_Properties
Scroll to table 4 for a comparison table on the grade and spec equivalencies around the world.
For one, SUS is not the grade. 304 is the grade standard. T304 is Type 304. SUS-T304... is simply Japanese standard that meets T304 specifications and requirements in hardness, chemical properties, tensile strenght and such...
America does not use a prefix, We simply refer metals to their grade; 304, 409...
The price of RAW Materials has nothing to do with this conversation. Its the overhead of the companies producing the product. Why does the backyard shop charge less than the world wide company, because the backyard shop doesnt have an upper management, CEO's and other overhead personell sucking the life out of profits. You being a business man should understand that. Why does it cost more for you to take your car to a "stealership" than another reputable shop. Because they charge more for labor due to the workers being higher paid and they have MORE OVERHEAD!
Heres a link for the specs of the steel grade:
http://www.azom.com/Details.asp?Arti...cal_Properties
Scroll to table 4 for a comparison table on the grade and spec equivalencies around the world.
