703 CAMAROSS

I'm doing a 6.0 iron block swap. Its a 390ci (6.4L) will have 9.6:1 compression. I'm also adding a 234/234 .595/.595 with 112lsa cam. This motor will see boost later but I'm just looking to run N/A for now till I can afford my turbo kit. Would a mail order tune work or would I need a dyno tune? Iv heard tuned by frost is the way to go. Also their only a few hours away from me... I'm right in VA also. Thanks for any advice.

gectek

iTrader: (2)

Frost by far would be your best bet.

703 CAMAROSS

That's who I will use but what do you think or anyone else... Would I need a dyno tune or would a mail order work fine.

gectek

iTrader: (2)

I would at least get a drivability tune from him. THat way you are not trashing the block with overloading it on fuel or running it to lean. If that comes with the dyno tune, then get that. Esp since you are so close. He will get it done right.

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Mail order is ridiculous. If you want to get the best tune for the engine you just had built, do it on the dyno. If you do a mail order tune you might be fine as well.....but you also might just ruin your engine...fast...or maybe in 3-4 months.

Mail order tunes.......I cannot believe anyone does it anymore. Especially after all the stories of peoples engines running like crap and people needing rebuilds because they washed their rings in 5 days......makes no sense.

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703 CAMAROSS

I haven't heard any bad things about the mail order tunes by frost.

GTO1_OHIO

iTrader: (3)

True especially when there are tuners who will remotely connect to your laptop and use your own tuning software to directly tune your car.

edcmat-l1

iTrader: (10)

Ridiculous? Really? I do mail order tunes all the time. Several a week. But, my clientele is a bit different. Most of my clientele have their own software, and need someone who can tune and send them tunes. Another large part of my business is selling tunes and support to other shops. Several internationally.

I do virtually no "bolt on" tunes. Mainly because of price.

This is the kind of stuff I mail order tune on a regular basis........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YveK...1&feature=plcp

And this.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJYB9...eature=related

Anyone who says mail order tuning is ridiculous, well, is ridiculous.

gectek

iTrader: (2)

Maybe you should not have made a general statement like ALL MAIL ORDER TUNES ARE RIDICULOUS. Maybe something more along the lines of mail order tunes through an unreputable source are not advised.

If a tuner knows what they are doing, it is usually no problem (if the other side has the software to upload and scan) to get the correct config to the person, have them scan, then tune accordingly. The only thing the other person has to do is just adhere to a set of guidelines and not get too overzealous and try other things or stray, or think they know tuning because they read a thread online about it.

LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Well, if you have the software links through the internet to work with, thats not mail order.

And the tune isn't the ridiculous part.....spending thousands on a new engine and not getting the best possible tune, without the possibility of it being OFF a little bit....is the ridiculous part.

I'm talking about people that tell a tuner what engine they have.....and a tune shows up in the mail. Thats ridiculous. Yes, sometimes it works out. But there are far too many threads of people whos tunes are WAY WAY off. And in allot of cases through the years they ran rich for the first month and their rings are shot......now their brand new engine needs to be torn down.

If you can do it like you say, with real time readings to look at and tweak.....thats 100% NOT mail order........

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LS6427

iTrader: (2)

Agreed....but thats not at all....a mail order tune.

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edcmat-l1

iTrader: (10)

I would classify any type of tuning, where files are swapped via the internet, and the car is not tuned in person, as a mail order tune.

Now, I don't feel like arguing the technicality of what dictates mail order tunes. So, my final comment will be this. A mail order tune, is only as good as the tuner writing it, and the information provided. Just because a tune is mail order, does not automatically make it inferior to an in-person tune. There are plenty of tuners out there, obviously some better than others. Who's to say the mail order guy isn't significantly better than the in-person guy?

A "mail order" tune (if the end user doesn't have his own software) should only be used to get something up and running, and to a QUALIFIED tuner. Washing rings and destroying motors on a mail order tune is a product of either bad info to the tuner, or a crappy tune. It's not the fact that it's mail order versus in-person. If it's a closed loop tune, and there isn't anything WAAAY off, or a mechanical issue (bad sensor) then even if the tune is off significantly, the fuel trims should bring it into a realistic range to at least keep it from running so rich as to wash out the rings and damage the cylinders.

BOBS99SS

iTrader: (2)

im with this guy ,frost is your best bet and is good at what he does but your crazy if im running a mail order on my new block, listen i can see getting a baseline to drive it to the dyno but honest mail in tunes imo are just that a baseline

BOBS99SS

iTrader: (2)

well im ridiculous then, i have seen issues with some mail in tunes,and if you search there are alot more, im not talking about most of the sponsers but i have seen some people that were not so luckey with there mo tunes

703 CAMAROSS

Ok well I guess I have to pay an extra 250 and drive it down then. Good thing I haven't put the engine in yet because I wouldent be able to afford the tune lol.

edcmat-l1

iTrader: (10)

OK, search and post them all here, and let's see how many of them were actually mail order tune issues, or some other issue. I.E, driving around with a miss, or a bad ECT, or other sensor.

Again, there's way more to a mail order than just flashing a PCM and sending it out the door. The recipient has to make sure the engine is sound mechanically, and all sensors are functioning properly.

Even "in-person" tuning, it's rare that I can just TUNE a car. I usually have to fix at least one problem before I can ever tune them. Alot of times, especially after someone just built something, there's many problems to be fixed.

So, therein lies the problem with sending a tuned PCM out to someone who has no software, no way of diagnosing any type of problem. It's automatically an issue with the tune. It cannot be that they screwed something up during the build.

BOBS99SS

iTrader: (2)

i should have added that in my post, very good info there, my buddy tunes alot and he has told me most of the time he is hunting down issues, more time doing that then the tune itself lol