LS4 Performance - How are the LS4 cars for reliability?

I keep looking at LS4 cars (mainly GXP Grand Prix & Impala SS) for my wife. Are they a reliable vehicle or do they have a fair amount of issues. What kinds of issues do these cars have?

good cars the bad tranny failure

I've noticed several electrical issues with my car but nothing major yet. I've had 4 hub assemblies go bad on me. The transmission sucks and will eventually go bad, no other way to put it. The LS engines are very reliable tho.

the transmission is all i hear about

Trans, hub/wheel bearings, Some people with GXP have used up brakes quickly.. GXP eats tires faster than the SS, since the factory wheels can not be rotated. And a few issues with water pumps.

a joke!!

engine-wise it is almost identical to the other LSx engines...it has a remote water pump slightly more prone to failure but engine is otherwise bulletproof really. the trans is a ticking time bomb though...

Before you buy one go to the dealer and have them run a service report. You might be surprised with what you find. Most of the problems are with the transmission. These are the other issues I had: water pump, alternator, brakes and the exhaust rusted out. Some of them have an oil consumption issue too (like mine). Mines one of the first ones made (2005) so Im not sure what if any problems the newer ones have. Its not a Honda but neither is the driving experience. Ive had the car for 7 years on July 4th and it has 66k on it. Get one with a warranty. You'll have more fun with it than a Camary or Accord thats for sure. If your worried about tires and brakes get an Impala or a La Cross Super.

Horrible reliability. Look elsewhere.

You'll have more fun with it than a Camary or Accord thats for sure.

Sure. If your idea of fun is a gastric ulcer....

Like fubar said, the motors are pretty bulletproof.

Vehicle electronics are questionable, hubs are junk, and the transmission is more likely than not to fail before 100k miles.

That said, we've put 115,000 miles on our Impala and it's never left us stranded. It has, however, gone through two transmission.

If you're looking for rock-solid reliability, look elsewhere, as these cars do have issues. If you don't mind being nickel and dimed and budget $2500-$3500 for a transmission (installed), then dive right in! They are fun to drive and get pretty good highway mileage.

I was on transmission #3 by 106k miles when I threw in the towel and traded it in..... and I rarely, if ever, beat on the car.....

Seems they're hit and miss. I've never had any electrical issues, never had any abnormal oil consumption, never changed the hubs. I barely changed the factory brakes at 94k miles and they didn't really need to be changed.

My cars at 103k miles now and I bought it brand new with 54miles.

Seems they're hit and miss. I've never had any electrical issues, never had any abnormal oil consumption, never changed the hubs. I barely changed the factory brakes at 94k miles and they didn't really need to be changed.

My cars at 103k miles now and I bought it brand new with 54miles.

What aout your tranny? I have read so many negative threads in just on day, haha

WTF?? I swear that I put in my post that I've gone through 1 transmission. I blew it up at 54k miles while racing a M3 a few years ago. Had I not been shifting it up and down for our 25mile race through it would have lasted longer and may even be on it still. My trans failure was MY fault.

Well, I ended up buying a 08 Impala SS. Has 85k on it currently. I had the dealer pull up a GMVIS on it & so far nothing with the tranny. It had one hub replaced & one fuel injector replaced. I was pretty impressed with how good it runs also. The only things that it will probably get done to it are tinted windows & possibly mufflers. Hopefully I have a good experience with it

I bought my '07 SS a few years ago with almost 60k on it, just rolled over to 100k this weekend (soo sad) and I replaced the water pump at about 80k and the trans at 85k, it was still under warranty though so whatever. And not gonna lie... I beat the crap out of it. New GM trans comes with 36k/3 year warranty so my goal is to blow this one up before then! Other than that I haven't had ANY issues with the car and it gets awesome fuel mileage for a decent sized car with a V8. If I drove like your average person I'm sure neither the water pump or the trans would have gone out on me.

one other mod I'd do is the don rome STBs, they're cheap and really sharpen the car's handeling without any other sacrifice. at 85k im sure it soesn't ride too great either, I did new struts at 50k I couldnt stand the ride anymore.

also I've gone through front brakes in as little as 12k

congrads on the purchase, its a fun FWD car if there ever was one. I'd say even better than a GTi.

I just replaced one hub. Replace power steering pump. No oil issues. A few electronic issues with mine. Bcm freaks out once in a great while and I have to reset the computer. And just did a full brake job on the front. Bought car with22k have 72k on it now 2008 gxp.

Hub assemblies are fairly cheap and easy to put in so who cares about those. The transmission is the main thing on these cars that will nail your pocket book. I bought my 08 GXP with 68k miles on it and had the tranny rebuilt after about 4k miles. It would still drive fine but would shudder while under a load while at cruising (50+mph). I had it built with all the TEP upgrades, which fix all the issues they have from the factory. The mistake people make with these cars is they take them to places that just rebuild the trannies with factory parts and they don't fix the defects (i.e dealerships).

If it is under warranty thats one thing, but if it is not then get it rebuilt from someone who knows what they are doing and get all the upgrades done to it. My rebuilt tranny only runs 150 degrees even after getting on it repeatedly in 'tap shift' mode on a 70degree day. It used to run over 200 degrees.

So in short I would say they are fairly reliable cars, there is enough info out there that you know what you are jumping into when you buy one. Brakes are cheap too, but they do wear out faster than other cars. But they stop better than most cars too so there is a trade off.

I forgot to mention the electrical... its happened maybe three times since I bought the car, its like the computer turns off while im driving? All the guages zero out and cuts power to everything (atleast what i can see from the drivers seat) but it comes right back on right away and the engine dosent quit running or anything like that.. dunno. Hard to troubleshoot something like that since it only happens for a split second every so often.

I have 110,000 miles on my original tranny, and its still shifts like brand new, so it is hit or miss with these cars.

I wouldnt call the LS4 bulletproof, but thats just me.

I have 110,000 miles on my original tranny, and its still shifts like brand new, so it is hit or miss with these cars.

Doesn't seem to be hit or miss to me, just a matter of when. Your car is definitely an exception.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/ls4-performance/1369632-ls4-transmission-problem-thread-4t65-hd-current-total-inside.html

^^^^^
All those issues are from the very limited # of ls4 owners on this forum.....

Was much I enjoyed my gxp, I definitely would have wished I had more info about the tranny issues before buying it, and definitely wouldn't do it again.

I think the OP made a bad choice and will regret it, IMO.

Love my car and I have had nothing fail that wasn't self inflicted.
I bought this car new though, so I know its history. Buying used is a little iffy. Trans is scary cause its a expensive item to get replaced. Hubs, brakes, and other stuff is cheap and simple.

I haven't had it very long but I do love my GXP. I would make the same decision again if given the choice. I can deal with a trans issue, the rest of the repairs (if you are a DIY guy) are cheap and easy. These cars do have some odd's and ends but overall, they are pretty decent cars. As with anything, do some research on what you are looking at purchasing. Not 15 minutes mind you, spend some actual time on it as you will be spending actual money to buy them :)

Doesn't seem to be hit or miss to me, just a matter of when. Your car is definitely an exception.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/ls4-performance/1369632-ls4-transmission-problem-thread-4t65-hd-current-total-inside.html

^^^^^
All those issues are from the very limited # of ls4 owners on this forum.....

Was much I enjoyed my gxp, I definitely would have wished I had more info about the tranny issues before buying it, and definitely wouldn't do it again.

Same here. Before I got my impala SS, i was debating between that and a charger rt Daytona. All I kept seeing on different sites was don't get it because it's fwd and the styling is bland, etc. I went to the dealership to try both of them and someone bought the yellow Daytona so I drove the impala and I fell in love with it. Then I joined this forum and saw that the transmissions are horrible in these cars and I thought, "eh as long as you take care of it, it will take care of you." Boy was I wrong! Transmission went on me at 60k after babying it. Mind you i got it at 35k. Then I got it replaced and got an extended warranty and it went on me again at 78k after babying it again. Then I purchased a Charger and I will honestly say I made the right decision. Do I miss the impala? Sure i do. It was unique and I always was asked "what the hell do you have in that thing?" or "I didn't know they made them on with a V8! It sounds like you have a big block in there! I heard you about a mile away." I miss surprising people at the light but this car just had too many issues. Not to mention the electrical problems as well as the car having the gear shifter stuck in park and it needing a new idler pulley at 50k. If I had to do it all over again, I would of done more research on it before I assumed it was only a FWD thing.

The folks who've never had trans problems with their LS4 cars are usually the ones claiming that "if you just take care of it and don't beat on it, it won't happen." That is, until it does happen them.

And with most other cars, that may be true, but not the LS4's 4T65-HD. Jrhartman is absolutely correct in it not being a question of "if", but a matter of "when"...At least for 80% of our cars.

I compiled the list on the trans problem thread, and I can tell you that at any given time on this site, more than half of the current posting members are either having or at one time had problems with their transmission. As is well documented, these problems have nothing to do with driving style or how often the fluid was changes, so saying that you're gonna go easy on it doesn't mean shit in the real world, and you're only making a costly mistake if you tell yourself otherwise.

You want the facts on the LS4 transmission? Here they are:

- The transmission failure/problem rate is >50% before 100k miles.
- Failures are most often caused by TCC failures and bad valve body seals.
- GM never addressed the above issues so that factory remanufactured and supposed "new" units still have the same flaws as the originals they are replacing.
- Failures have occurred on cars with as few as 800 miles, with most happening in the 50k-75k mile range.
- Failures occur just as often on stock, unmodified vehicles, as they do on bolt-on, tuned cars. Ironically, a few turbocharged cars are still on the original tranmission.

These are the immutable facts, and anyone disputing them is merely speculating.

If you buy an LS4 car, go into it expecting to replace the transmission with an aftermarket-enhanced rebuild, if it hasn't already been done. If you have your eyes open and are reasonable with this expectation, then you will not be disappointed with an LS4 car.

I noticed the first trans issue at like 60k when it slipped and shuttered driving off from a red light, i wasnt getting on it at all. It continued to slip from that point on, not all that noticeably but it was slipping. Went to advanced and dumped some Lucas stop slip in it and it made it to almost 85k before it ever slipped again but once it did, the trans went pretty fast. May not be a bad idea to throw some in there... seemed to really extend the life of it.

Also when going into overdrive and tc lock up the trans would seem to get stuck sumwhere in mush-land for a second or two before it finally got itself locked in the gear... Letting off the gas a little bit allowed it to instantly drop into o/d or lock up. So I think that while driving style wont prevent the trans failure it can at least prolong it.

Also when going into overdrive and tc lock up the trans would seem to get stuck sumwhere in mush-land for a second or two before it finally got itself locked in the gear... Letting off the gas a little bit allowed it to instantly drop into o/d or lock up. So I think that while driving style wont prevent the trans failure it can at least prolong it.

The trans doesn't "lock into gear", rather, a clutch applies causing 4th gear to engage. After this, the torque converter clutch applies, it then locks the turbine to the impeller, causing what we know of as "lock-up". Unfortunately, the failure of the converter clutch is what dooms many LS4 trannys, as the resulting shrapnel from the failed TCC begins to travel with the fluid through the trans and wipes out the clutch packs.

Changing your driving behavior at this point MAY amount to prolonged life, but the amount of time is most likely trivial.

as the car having the gear shifter stuck in park

Make sure to change the "pink thingy" on that year Charger too, the locking device that keeps it in Park if you don't hit the brake before trying to shift is very prone to breaking. It is a pink plastic piece of crap, Billettech makes a superb replacement. Otherwise, you will be stuck somewhere. I did a year of looking into the Chargers prior to buying my GXP. Both have issues. The 5 sp trans in that Charger is light years better than the 4T65e. But, they are plagued by electrical problems too.

Make sure to change the "pink thingy" on that year Charger too, the locking device that keeps it in Park if you don't hit the brake before trying to shift is very prone to breaking. It is a pink plastic piece of crap, Billettech makes a superb replacement. Otherwise, you will be stuck somewhere. I did a year of looking into the Chargers prior to buying my GXP. Both have issues. The 5 sp trans in that Charger is light years better than the 4T65e. But, they are plagued by electrical problems too.



Very true. I found out about that problem. I'll look into the Billettech one. One of the guys said it takes like 20 minutes go change if I were to do it myself. Also the windshield is a recall as well. I noticed while going over speeds of 85 mph+ there is a howling noise on the front end if I were to go WOT. All these new cars have some type of problem.

I bought the car being well aware of the transmission issues. It does have the remainder of GM Powertrain & I did buy a warranty that will cover my ass after the GM warranty is up. That'll give me plenty of time to source a core & build it. The rest of the stuff is little stuff that can go bad on any car. I can deal with that. This is primarily the wife's daily ride, so it's not going to be really modified or beat on. The transmissions in these seem kind of like a 4L60E, you buy the car sort of expecting the tranny to give up the ghost.

Very true. I found out about that problem. I'll look into the Billettech one. One of the guys said it takes like 20 minutes go change if I were to do it myself. Also the windshield is a recall as well. I noticed while going over speeds of 85 mph+ there is a howling noise on the front end if I were to go WOT. All these new cars have some type of problem.


I have a Charger poster in my office at work yet :)

Ultimately, it was our PT Cruiser (Wife's car, don't judge!) that convinced me to stay with GM. Between 97k and 104k miles I replaced the following on that car:

Radiator

Lower Control Arm bushings + ball joints - I would highly, highly recommend getting a new control arm with these already installed rather than monkey around with them like I did ;)

CV Axles - both sides

Front hubs and bearings - both sides

Struts/Shocks

Rack n Pinion

2 engine mounts

Rear drums and shoes

Both belts

Still to do:

Timing Belt/tensioner/water pump

Rear bushings

Front rotors + pads

Exhaust

P/S Pump



Every car has repairs/maintenance to do, but it's the way it went and seeing Chrysler ingenuity at work, I stuck with what I know :)

The trans doesn't "lock into gear", rather, a clutch applies causing 4th gear to engage. After this, the torque converter clutch applies, it then locks the turbine to the impeller, causing what we know of as "lock-up". Unfortunately, the failure of the converter clutch is what dooms many LS4 trannys, as the resulting shrapnel from the failed TCC begins to travel with the fluid through the trans and wipes out the clutch packs.

Changing your driving behavior at this point MAY amount to prolonged life, but the amount of time is most likely trivial.

I understand the mechanics of an auto trans, I was just saying for a lack of better terms... if your driving style is making the clutch packs slip even more it's gonna wear out faster. The reason why I mentioned the lucas stop slip and change of driving style, it added about 25k miles to the life of mine. A little more than trivial considering the average person drives 12k miles/year.

I understand the mechanics of an auto trans, I was just saying for a lack of better terms... if your driving style is making the clutch packs slip even more it's gonna wear out faster. The reason why I mentioned the lucas stop slip and change of driving style, it added about 25k miles to the life of mine. A little more than trivial considering the average person drives 12k miles/year.

You were fortunate with your experience in using the additive. That has been tried by other people on this site when they had problems, and I know of only one other situation where the trans lasted more than a couple of thousand miles.

As far has habits are concerned, there's not a whole lot you can do once the trans starts showing signs of slipping. Other than out-and-out abuse, nothing in regular driving is going to cause the clutches to slip in the first place, other than a worn out or damaged trans.

I guess we're kind of saying the same thing here. There are little things you can do to mitigate the slipping a bit, but in the end, if it is slipping, the end is near. Kind of like death and taxes.

True that ;)

LS4 cars and reliability in the same sentence??

ha.....ha.........HA.............HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA H

But really besides the tranny .... and oil consumption before DoD removal.... and speakers sounding like shit and getting worse day by day....and head unit sucking.... and the doors starting to rattle..... and the head liner coming slowly unglued and starting to rattle..... and the dashpad doing the same and coming warped......... i havent had a single problem!

My 01 Monte SS had the same problems(minus tranny and oil) at about the same time in it's life...guess its normal

To anyone who thinks the trans isn't that bad. I'm in the core suppling industry and the 4t65e, hd or not, has been a hot item for several years now and the orders for them never decrease, we've never been able to supply as many as the rebuilder wants on any 1 single P.O.

Wonder why GM wouldnt fix the damn thing?? Or a recall?? Pretty messed up on their part considering how many of these cars on the road...

They get away with what they can just like every other conglomerate. I'm all for it, I'd make a quick easy killing on it! Plus I'd get a new trans for my ride too! Everyone but GM wins. :)

Well from that point of view haha yea makes sense

Wonder why GM wouldnt fix the damn thing?? Or a recall?? Pretty messed up on their part considering how many of these cars on the road...

Well, that's the point...There aren't that many of the LS4 cars so it really didn't make sense for them to invest in a fix. Sucks for us!

Anyway, there was talk of the NHTSA investigating this issue about a year-and-a-half ago, but we haven't heard anything since.

I bought the car.

Well then welcome to LS4tech!