View Full Version : Can I safely dig my 750rwhp T/A through a upgraded 10bolt rear end?


camaro-coz
04-28-2012, 07:06 PM
Hey guyz..

I'm thinking of starting my 750rwhp T/A from dig through the stock 10 bolt and sticky tires

by buying an aftermarket differental , axels , ring & pinion set and upgrading my stock 10 bolt rear end , It is a safe way ? I mean rev my rpm to 4k and then shift it to 1st.

Is it a risk doing this ?

Blu99T/A
04-28-2012, 07:09 PM
Risk? It will break, not if, just when. IMO it is a waste of money.

fastazzls1
04-28-2012, 07:24 PM
agree like playing russian roulette with a hand gernade buy a 9inch or 12bolt but launching any car hard from a dig you have the possiblity of WHAT IF ! what if put a new rear end but stock drive shaft and u joint catch my drift good luck sounds like an awesome car

95batmobile
04-28-2012, 07:36 PM
even going from a roll with that much power- eventually it will break lol

camaro-coz
04-28-2012, 07:40 PM
Thanx all!
F*** 10 bolt..
I'm going for the Moser 12 bolt
I had a great deal for it.

My6speedZ
04-28-2012, 09:15 PM
12-bolts arent as bad on an auto as they are with a M6.

Floorman279
04-28-2012, 09:18 PM
if you go moser 12 your wasting money....that thing will start to leak and make noise right away........if on a budget,you can get an s60 with the s trac which is conservitavely rated at 650, however if your running a turbo or supercharger you can probly squeeze an extra hundred out of it since its not as hard as spray or natural hp on a rear and its components.......or just get a locker or spool with it and you will have no issues........if you call carl at central racing parts, his base price is like 2250 i belive (may be lower but dont wanna false advertise) now if you wanna ad TCS it goona cost you a little extra.....and that is a shipped price......his number is 316-299-8427, and his customer service is the best out there.

fastazzls1
04-28-2012, 09:21 PM
^ agree moser 9 or strange 9 or s60 the only downfall to the s60 is weight but i wouldnt mind cause of the peace of mind

01ssreda4
04-28-2012, 10:33 PM
Strange 12 bolt over Moser anyday.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/gears-axles/1522104-strange-12-bolt-install.html

TheLS1Lover
04-28-2012, 11:24 PM
MWC Fab 9" and never look back.

camaro-coz
04-29-2012, 08:33 AM
Thanks you , I found another (used) rear end called 'Dana' I think as he said.

The problem is ... I live in Kuwait , transporting such a heavy rear end costs me much , for example , a 2000$ rear end with the price of transport is almost 4000$ in total. I just bought the Billet light weight wheels from the US , they took 1000$ from me for only the transport.. so I suggest buying a used one at kuwait is a better choice.

My6speedZ
04-29-2012, 09:18 AM
The Dana 60 is heavy but large and strong. It will swap in just like putting your 10-bolt back in. You will need to get your drive shaft shortened or a new stronger one.

I would get the S60 over a 12-bolt anyday.

01ssreda4
04-29-2012, 09:41 AM
s60 robs some hp.

My6speedZ
04-29-2012, 11:14 AM
True, if I was forced to deal with what I could find used to avoid shipping over sea's I would still pick a s60 over a 12-bolt. But I'm M6 so a 12-bolt is out for me.

Floorman279
04-29-2012, 11:23 AM
yea strange 12 bolt is more superior than a moser anyday.......the mwc 9 inch is a great choice as well, but again a little pricier........i never understood why people bitched about an extra 60 pounds in the s60 vs a 12 bolt.....id rather have extra weight and extra durability if im spending 2200 or more

camaro-coz
04-29-2012, 11:24 AM
Yep , I'll search for a S60
My car is an M6 too... forged 347 H/C/I + 300 shot on 1st stage , It's a street car and never went to a strip.

Floorman279
04-29-2012, 11:34 AM
i just sold my 500 miles s60 with the works, set up for a 4 channel forged yoke with a forged pst aluminum driveshaft......i got 2500 forit and a stock rear and driveshaft

Ethan[ws6]
04-30-2012, 04:20 PM
I have never had any problems with my moser 12 bolt and I have quite a few friends running them who also never had any issues.

Also,
True, if I was forced to deal with what I could find used to avoid shipping over sea's I would still pick a s60 over a 12-bolt. But I'm M6 so a 12-bolt is out for me.

Why is a 12 bolt not an option for you with an m6? That doesn't even makes sense lmao.

My6speedZ
04-30-2012, 06:16 PM
;16257682']I have never had any problems with my moser 12 bolt and I have quite a few friends running them who also never had any issues.

Also,


Why is a 12 bolt not an option for you with an m6? That doesn't even makes sense lmao.

They tend to pick up whine if your launch on them hard repeatedly. I see no point in spending the cash on a 12-bolt when a 9 inch is practically the same price.

Ethan[ws6]
04-30-2012, 07:31 PM
I picked mine up used for cheap, only reason I bought one. I've never heard of anyone complaining about a whine just devoloping out of no where like that. I would say something would have had to been set up wrong in the first place if you start getting a whine.

RAMPANT
04-30-2012, 08:15 PM
First hard hit on slicks had my Moser howling everytime. I broke it 4 times, best 60ft was a 1.48 dead hooking with 511rwhp. So 5 sets of different gears all did the same thing. US Gear/Strange Gears/Richmonds.

Ethan[ws6]
05-01-2012, 12:23 PM
Really? I have never had that issue. I will say this, mine was setup "wrong" when I got it. Backlash was sloppy and carrier bearing preload was way low. I corrected everything and this bitch is smooth haha

Orr89rocz
05-01-2012, 08:53 PM
bone stock 99-02 zexel torsen diff 2.73 gear rear end in my turbo thirdgen. 690whp on stingy mustang dyno thru unlocked TH400 with 5400-ish stall...way to high for the combo or it was blowin thru, i couldnt tell.

9.72 at 142 on a 1.49 60 foot. Been in the 9's few other times with dozen 10 sec passes ranging from 134-140mph traps. 60's ranging from 1.49-1.7's. Still holding, 2 summers of racing a few times a year and many street pulls.

10 bolts can live :)

My 3.42 rear lived behind a 400whp 383 then + 150 shot for well over 500whp. MANY 1.50's 60 foots all motor and 1.41 and 1.45 60's with spray. Then into my turbo motor couple passes in the low 10's and bunch of street tuning pulls. Sidestepping it out many times on the highway finally chipped a worm gear tooth...just a tiny chip...but it clanked abit going around turns so I swapped in a 2.73 rear.

My car would easily have done 750+ on a dyno jet. Auto's can live if soft with the converter...no tbrake or heavy hits on boosted launches. T56, you have to be very light...but my buddy's been 10.0's at 136 in a nitrous 406 sbc with a 1.5x launch spraying at 25mph which should be top first gear. T56, spec 3 clutch

RAMPANT
05-02-2012, 06:08 AM
bone stock 99-02 zexel torsen diff 2.73 gear rear end in my turbo thirdgen. 690whp on stingy mustang dyno thru unlocked TH400 with 5400-ish stall...way to high for the combo or it was blowin thru, i couldnt tell.

9.72 at 142 on a 1.49 60 foot. Been in the 9's few other times with dozen 10 sec passes ranging from 134-140mph traps. 60's ranging from 1.49-1.7's. Still holding, 2 summers of racing a few times a year and many street pulls.

10 bolts can live :)

My 3.42 rear lived behind a 400whp 383 then + 150 shot for well over 500whp. MANY 1.50's 60 foots all motor and 1.41 and 1.45 60's with spray. Then into my turbo motor couple passes in the low 10's and bunch of street tuning pulls. Sidestepping it out many times on the highway finally chipped a worm gear tooth...just a tiny chip...but it clanked abit going around turns so I swapped in a 2.73 rear.

My car would easily have done 750+ on a dyno jet. Auto's can live if soft with the converter...no tbrake or heavy hits on boosted launches. T56, you have to be very light...but my buddy's been 10.0's at 136 in a nitrous 406 sbc with a 1.5x launch spraying at 25mph which should be top first gear. T56, spec 3 clutch

I know the old 10 bolt cases can live into the 9s with an auto, but the new ones will barely live in the 12s with an M6, which is what the OP said he has. I went 1.7s with 400rwhp on my 10 bolt with 1.7s, only a couple times though, before it broke. I was wounding my Moser 12 regularly with 1.47s. They were 6500rpm drops that would dead hook. they may have been more harsh on my car though, it has a road racing suspension on it, but seemed to work with QTPs.

With an M6, it is a waste of money and time to even try. If you have an auto, I have seen them in the 10s.

Orr89rocz
05-02-2012, 07:37 AM
I just said I have a newer rear end and been 9's on some quick 60's. Its not an old case.
Now my buddy's rear is a 28 spline 10 bolt, older case ands its lived well into the 10's with a T56 in a 93 firebird.

i wouldnt say its a waste to try, but with the manual you have to be alot softer on the launch

RAMPANT
05-02-2012, 08:15 AM
I just said I have a newer rear end and been 9's on some quick 60's. Its not an old case.
Now my buddy's rear is a 28 spline 10 bolt, older case ands its lived well into the 10's with a T56 in a 93 firebird.

i wouldnt say its a waste to try, but with the manual you have to be alot softer on the launch

When I said older case I meant the 70s 10 bolts. The newer ones are no where near as beefy.

I think the torque arm twists these diffs up and screw with the ring and pinion alignment, but that is just my theory. My 12 bolt broke 4 times and never went better than a 10.78@129. I think the same issuse was causing the the 12 bolt to break.


The OP said he wants safe, with 750rwhp, M6 and sticky tires from a dig. Telling him it can be done with a 10 bolt is just leading him into a bucket of wasted money. Since it has been done maybe 1-2% of the time and calling that reliable is good advice? Really? The guy has to ship everything and doubling the costs, not to mention labour, I say do it once.

Orr89rocz
05-02-2012, 09:49 AM
Never said it was reliable...just pointing out it could be done and perhaps worth a shot before swapping rears. Everyone says it wont work and it will break..well it isnt always the case if you go softer on the rpms at launch. He isnt leaving at 750whp. I also never said to build the rear...
I should have added keep it bone stock if you want to try it, dont waste money on upgrades. He said by buying new components, is that a safe way? No that is not. I didnt mention it here in this thread but another 10 bolt thread I said leave the rear stock, dont build it.

LS1-IROC
05-02-2012, 11:15 AM
First time he wheel hops it it will be done.

Mgill
05-02-2012, 01:35 PM
First time it hooks its dead.

96lt1m6
05-02-2012, 04:29 PM
The parts that generally fail would be the Eng and pinion they are too small, the carriers usually spit the springs out, then you will break an axle or have all 3 happen together..... save the money and build an 8.8 or purchase an S60

My6speedZ
05-03-2012, 06:21 PM
I think the torque arm twists these diffs up and screw with the ring and pinion alignment, but that is just my theory.

I agree the deflection from the TQ arm is part of the reason our cars can't get away with as much like the older cars were able to.

Edit: what kind of idiot would say for him to try and run his 10-bolt? Why so it can die on him... maybe while shifting hard into 3rd and causing him to wreck?

Blu99T/A
05-03-2012, 06:28 PM
When comparing the old 10 bolts (1st and 2nd gen) remember they were also 8.5" ring gear size unlike the 4th gens 7.5". The older 8.5" 10 bolts are more comparable to the 12 bolts offered for the 4th gen.

SparkyJJO
05-03-2012, 06:42 PM
Given that the previous owner of my car was snapping 10 bolts with just a cammed v6 + spray at the track through an auto transmission, I wouldn't even give a 10 bolt any consideration for a 750HP car, ever.

I think that GM should have given us the 8.5"/8.6" 10 bolt instead of this crappy 7.5" 10 bolt. The larger one actually has some strength to it.

Wu6FiRe
05-03-2012, 07:58 PM
What about a ford 9" how hard or what all is required to install one on a f-body

ULTIMATEORANGESS
05-03-2012, 08:12 PM
if you go moser 12 your wasting money....that thing will start to leak and make noise right away........if on a budget,you can get an s60 with the s trac which is conservitavely rated at 650, however if your running a turbo or supercharger you can probly squeeze an extra hundred out of it since its not as hard as spray or natural hp on a rear and its components.......or just get a locker or spool with it and you will have no issues........if you call carl at central racing parts, his base price is like 2250 i belive (may be lower but dont wanna false advertise) now if you wanna ad TCS it goona cost you a little extra.....and that is a shipped price......his number is 316-299-8427, and his customer service is the best out there.

First hard hit on slicks had my Moser howling everytime. I broke it 4 times, best 60ft was a 1.48 dead hooking with 511rwhp. So 5 sets of different gears all did the same thing. US Gear/Strange Gears/Richmonds.

it seems that nickname "moaners" was earned.

i just had my 10 bolt built with suspension upgrades to keep from hopping. im nowhere near 750 hp though.

RAMPANT
05-03-2012, 08:58 PM
it seems that nickname "moaners" was earned.

i just had my 10 bolt built with suspension upgrades to keep from hopping. im nowhere near 750 hp though.

I should state my 5 busted gears in the Moser were over 5 years and about 300 passes. It was a street car and driven to the track, and most of the time home. Once it got home with 3 teeth missing.

SexyTransAm
05-03-2012, 09:01 PM
its not safe to run stock power from a dig on a 10 bolt. says the guy running the 10 bolt when a wheel in the air lol

RAMPANT
05-03-2012, 09:02 PM
What about a ford 9" how hard or what all is required to install one on a f-body


Once I removed the 12 bolt, and since I had MWC ship it assembled, I installed it myself on jack stands in about 2 hours. Removal was similar or a little less time, but in between I swapped brakes and made new brake lines, and that took about 2 hours. Mine also had a Watts link to install. If I had help it would have been quicker. I like to take my time and tinker.

My6speedZ
05-03-2012, 10:05 PM
When comparing the old 10 bolts (1st and 2nd gen) remember they were also 8.5" ring gear size unlike the 4th gens 7.5". The older 8.5" 10 bolts are more comparable to the 12 bolts offered for the 4th gen.

I didn't know this, thanks for the info :cool:

SparkyJJO
05-04-2012, 01:16 AM
What about a ford 9" how hard or what all is required to install one on a f-body

:search:
There is a crapload of info about this on here, heck you can purchase 9" axles already made for these cars.

its not safe to run stock power from a dig on a 10 bolt. says the guy running the 10 bolt when a wheel in the air lol

lol :jest:

Some 10 bolts are freaks and manage to survive, others break if you just look at them funny. My 10 bolt is one of those freaks which I am just fine with!

Orr89rocz
05-04-2012, 07:09 AM
Some 10 bolts are freaks and manage to survive, others break if you just look at them funny. My 10 bolt is one of those freaks which I am just fine with!


Exactly

camaro-coz
05-06-2012, 01:49 AM
Thanx all for the replies! appreciate it!
sorry for the late reply , I spent my time working on my rearend after I broke it :bomb: on a 50mph roll LOL , I don't know how I thought dig'n it was a quite safe way HAHA !

I'll be raisin' some money for the next 3 weeks for buyin' an s60 or a Moser 9"

stock 10bolt ='s TRASH !

RAMPANT
05-06-2012, 07:07 AM
Thanx all for the replies! appreciate it!
sorry for the late reply , I spent my time working on my rearend after I broke it :bomb: on a 50mph roll LOL , I don't know how I thought dig'n it was a quite safe way HAHA !

I'll be raisin' some money for the next 3 weeks for buyin' an s60 or a Moser 9"

stock 10bolt ='s TRASH !

Sorry to hear that, but not surprised at all. I guess you are not part of the 1% club, if the number is even that high.

Get the upgraded S60 or 9" in there and have fun.

camaro-coz
05-06-2012, 03:24 PM
Thanx Rampant!
You just proved you'r advice from what happened to my rearend ...
and yeah , planning on buying the S60 ;)