View Full Version : Gauging Interest for a VIABLE TVS 2300 Option


DMM
06-19-2012, 04:18 PM
It looks like my quest for an oil-less twin turbo setup has fallen through as I cannot get definitive answers to the questions I have long been requesting and it now looks as if I may not have the time available for a welding/fabrication heavy install such as this.

I have been reviewing my options and calling in favors and now think I am set on going with a custom E-Force 2300 supercharger with custom HEX etc. This is going to be more involved on the 04-05 models with the LS6 as compared to the LS2 models, however from everything I have factored is still very possible.

Being a cheap ass, I am trying to stay within the $5500 - $6000 range (not counting labor, of course) which is still below what the Maggie 112 kits are now retailing for.

My question...if I can get the bugs worked out while staying within my target price range...is there a market for this? Granted, this is not going to be a complete kit that comes to you in a box, but will be well documented if I proceed and easily followed or upgrades with more expensive parts can be substituted if desired.

I will most likely begin ordering parts next week.

Onefast V
06-19-2012, 04:22 PM
what about people already running mp112s? anything that can be reused? if so cost delta for an upgrade?

heavymetals
06-19-2012, 04:26 PM
Why not forge everything and use a 122?

DMM
06-19-2012, 04:29 PM
Yes, it is possible to re-use the HEX system...however the bulk of my budget is based on the head unit and tensioner assembly. The HEX system is the least significant portion of the planned installation. Probably better off selling the Maggie complete since you will make more money sourcing the parts that "could be" used from the Maggie kit.

The E-Force integrates the complete intake/supercharger into one assembly vice the Maggie that is bolted to the lower intake plenum. You will not be able to unbolt the 112 and bolt the 2300 charger on b/c of this and that it is reverse rotation and forces air up rather than down like a Maggie.

Hope this answered your question

DMM
06-19-2012, 04:31 PM
Why not forge everything and use a 122?

I already sold my Maggie in preparation for the twin turbo install...besides, I am not as lucky as CancerJCC and have never seen a 122 head unit for sale.

FuzzyLog1c
06-19-2012, 04:48 PM
I'm interested. Not this year, because my budget has already been blown on my cam kit, wheels, and the hood, but my ultimate goal is to end up with a TVS1900 from Lingenfelter or a TVS2300 kit from somewhere else. I like your price target too.

heavymetals
06-19-2012, 04:52 PM
I was window shopping a full on LS7 (Lingenfelter) and they cost more then the car is worth!

FI or big cubes, it's all fun.

kl2onik
06-19-2012, 07:47 PM
ahhhh ls7 :hump: zo6 is def my next ride

GFallen
06-19-2012, 07:50 PM
If you work out all the bugs, I'm interested. I know your work and have faith you'll have a beast when complete.

psychobillycaddy
06-19-2012, 08:26 PM
It looks like my quest for an oil-less twin turbo setup has fallen through as I cannot get definitive answers to the questions I have long been requesting and it now looks as if I may not have the time available for a welding/fabrication heavy install such as this.

I have been reviewing my options and calling in favors and now think I am set on going with a custom E-Force 2300 supercharger with custom HEX etc. This is going to be more involved on the 04-05 models with the LS6 as compared to the LS2 models, however from everything I have factored is still very possible.

Being a cheap ass, I am trying to stay within the $5500 - $6000 range (not counting labor, of course) which is still below what the Maggie 112 kits are now retailing for.

My question...if I can get the bugs worked out while staying within my target price range...is there a market for this? Granted, this is not going to be a complete kit that comes to you in a box, but will be well documented if I proceed and easily followed or upgrades with more expensive parts can be substituted if desired.

I will most likely begin ordering parts next week.


I have it on my 2007. It runs great but good luck at keeping it under 6k. If you have any questions PM me and Ill give you my #. You can call me and I will try and save you from my pitfalls.

heavymetals
06-19-2012, 09:25 PM
This was interesting:

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-forced-induction-nitrous/2379369-video-funcools-cogged-112-maggie.html

itsslow98
06-19-2012, 09:37 PM
I think twin or single turbo kit would be very well suited for the V because of the power curve. For those with built rears the torque curve would be way less stressful on the drivetrain and would pull like a freight train up top. Any shop would be abel to fab up a turbo kit and throw a Comp oilless turbo on it. Any of the setups besides the 112 are gonna cost you more then 6k unless you do it all yourself.

DMM
06-19-2012, 10:43 PM
If you work out all the bugs, I'm interested. I know your work and have faith you'll have a beast when complete.
Thanks man, will def. keep you informed on the progress.

I have it on my 2007. It runs great but good luck at keeping it under 6k. If you have any questions PM me and Ill give you my #. You can call me and I will try and save you from my pitfalls.
Very much appreciated! I will absolutely take you up on your offer as soon as I get out of this heathenistic shit hole of a country. Do you have any pics to post? What fuel system are you running?

This was interesting:

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-forced-induction-nitrous/2379369-video-funcools-cogged-112-maggie.html
Never would have believed this was possible with a 112. Makes you wonder what his IAT's are.

I think twin or single turbo kit would be very well suited for the V because of the power curve. For those with built rears the torque curve would be way less stressful on the drivetrain and would pull like a freight train up top. Any shop would be abel to fab up a turbo kit and throw a Comp oilless turbo on it. Any of the setups besides the 112 are gonna cost you more then 6k unless you do it all yourself.
That is what I thought as well...GULFM3 has an awesome setup but I have never been a fan of the scavenge system...makes me cringe with everything relying on that pump. Bad thing is, I could not get ANY info that I was looking for from Comp or their distributors (one of which is a vendor here). Anyhow, I would much rather fab a supercharger HEX system than a stainless steel exhaust and intercooler pipes. Besides, welding bores the hell out of me.

Question....Does anyone have the measurements for our radiator (height/width)? Trying to have this stuff waiting for me at home when I return home.

Skidmarcx
06-19-2012, 10:51 PM
This was interesting:

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-forced-induction-nitrous/2379369-video-funcools-cogged-112-maggie.html

That is interesting... run e85 and IAT's should be lowered

CTSV_510
06-20-2012, 08:19 AM
The E-Force integrates the complete intake/supercharger into one assembly vice the Maggie that is bolted to the lower intake plenum. You will not be able to unbolt the 112 and bolt the 2300 charger on b/c of this and that it is reverse rotation and forces air up rather than down like a Maggie.

Hope this answered your question

I am having trouble making sense of this. I understand that you can probably unbolt the maggie from the lower intake assembly that it comes attached to, but I don't imagine too many people would bother taking that apart. When you remove the maggie from the motor, along with the intake section and intercooler, you are left looking at the engine valley cover and heads. Doesn't the e-force bolt on in place of the intake manifold in the same way?

I don't get why you can't remove the maggie unit and bolt in the 2300, they're both just essentially replacement intake manifolds. I understand the TB and intake tubing would have to be modified, along with belt routing and tensioner pulley, hosing, etc.

shadyLS6
06-20-2012, 09:50 AM
+1 interested.. saw Ichs TVS thread a while back but since there has to be custom work done i stopped following..

So this can be done with all off the shelf parts on a CTS V accessory drive??

NOLAG05
06-20-2012, 10:13 AM
You already know my answer...lol. When do you get back to this side and time zone?

DMM
06-20-2012, 10:18 AM
I am having trouble making sense of this. I understand that you can probably unbolt the maggie from the lower intake assembly that it comes attached to, but I don't imagine too many people would bother taking that apart. When you remove the maggie from the motor, along with the intake section and intercooler, you are left looking at the engine valley cover and heads. Doesn't the e-force bolt on in place of the intake manifold in the same way?

I don't get why you can't remove the maggie unit and bolt in the 2300, they're both just essentially replacement intake manifolds. I understand the TB and intake tubing would have to be modified, along with belt routing and tensioner pulley, hosing, etc.

You are correct, the entire assembly will come off down to the valley and cylinder heads. The difference is, the Maggie is on top of the intake and forces the compressed air down through the lower intake where the intercooler resides. Some people (namely ICHPEN) have taken the 112 head unit off the lower manifold and successfully integrated a Maggie 2300 TVS head unit in its place after getting the jackshaft and pulleys aligned correctly. The later I find to be a major pain in the ass that I want nothing to do with.

The E-Force rotor pack is machined into the intake, which sits in the valley, is direct driven (no jackshaft), and forces the compressed air up and then through the two intercoolers on either side. Completely different arrangement. What I was getting at, you cannot unbolt the 112 head unit and bolt the E-Force rotor pack/case in its place.

Goggle E-Force cut away and you will see the major design difference.

+1 interested.. saw Ichs TVS thread a while back but since there has to be custom work done i stopped following..

So this can be done with all off the shelf parts on a CTS V accessory drive??

Well, kind of. Not exactly off the shelf per say, rather a bastardized combination of off the shelf parts across a few platforms that (*should*) allow the TVS 2300 head unit fit our application. I expect there to be some massaging, but I think it will be much easier than having to deal with the jackshaft pulley alignment issue's and custom pulleys.

It will bolt on, and the pulley alignment will be correct. Nothing else from any of the E-Force kits are compatible though...which is why I will be sourcing other aftermarket items to complete this. Only thing provided will be the head unit, inlet tube, injectors, and tensioner. Everything else will have to be otherwise sourced or made...which is insignificant from my perspective.

If it has already worked on Psycho's V, there is no reason that it would not work. My objective is to make this a reasonably priced project that does not require outside fabrication (which always commands BIG $$$, especially with our cars). And most importantly, because i'm cheap.

DMM
06-20-2012, 10:22 AM
You already know my answer...lol. When do you get back to this side and time zone?

Hahaha....I knew you would be posting in here at some point, G...just wondering what took you so long, LOL.

August time frame as it stands right now...just in time for the summer heat...LMAO

CTSV_510
06-20-2012, 11:01 AM
You are correct, the entire assembly will come off down to the valley and cylinder heads. The difference is, the Maggie is on top of the intake and forces the compressed air down through the lower intake where the intercooler resides. Some people (namely ICHPEN) have taken the 112 head unit off the lower manifold and successfully integrated a Maggie 2300 TVS head unit in its place after getting the jackshaft and pulleys aligned correctly. The later I find to be a major pain in the ass that I want nothing to do with.

The E-Force rotor pack is machined into the intake, which sits in the valley, is direct driven (no jackshaft), and forces the compressed air up and then through the two intercoolers on either side. Completely different arrangement. What I was getting at, you cannot unbolt the 112 head unit and bolt the E-Force rotor pack/case in its place.

Goggle E-Force cut away and you will see the major design difference.

It will bolt on, and the pulley alignment will be correct. Nothing else from any of the E-Force kits are compatible though...which is why I will be sourcing other aftermarket items to complete this. Only thing provided will be the head unit, inlet tube, injectors, and tensioner. Everything else will have to be otherwise sourced or made...which is insignificant from my perspective.


I see what you are saying now. So you actually can replace the 112 with this unit as long as you take the entire 112 off including the lower intake manifold and intercooler.

So if you get the E-force head unit with the inlet tube, injectors, and tensioner, you will probably need to re-route some hoses and maybe re-wire some sensors, but you would already have the hex and intercooler pump mounted and ready to go, and a boost a pump already installed (if you're using one).

If you're saying the pulley will line up correctly, and it fits under the hood OK, I don't see much of an issue getting this to work.

The question then is how much for the E-Force head unit with injectors, inlet tubing and belt tensioner? And how much is a used 112 head unit worth without the miscellaneous parts from the rest of the kit?

CTSVBiggie
06-20-2012, 11:02 AM
I would be interested. Or more so maybe buying a MP112 kit off of someone trying to upgrade.

DMM
06-20-2012, 11:19 AM
I see what you are saying now. So you actually can replace the 112 with this unit as long as you take the entire 112 off including the lower intake manifold and intercooler.

So if you get the E-force head unit with the inlet tube, injectors, and tensioner, you will probably need to re-route some hoses and maybe re-wire some sensors, but you would already have the hex and intercooler pump mounted and ready to go, and a boost a pump already installed (if you're using one).

If you're saying the pulley will line up correctly, and it fits under the hood OK, I don't see much of an issue getting this to work.

The question then is how much for the E-Force head unit with injectors, inlet tubing and belt tensioner? And how much is a used 112 head unit worth without the miscellaneous parts from the rest of the kit?

I was trying to say in the earlier post (I was pretty tired, been working 12-15 hours/day and I am 7 hours ahead of you guys) is that there is NOTHING to be gained by re-using anything from the Maggie from my perspective.

If you keep the Maggie HEX and just try to sell the head unit, you will not get nearly as much as you will for the entire kit. I am looking at $500 +/- for a HEX system with a higher capacity pump than the Maggie is equipped with. You WILL take more than a $500 loss if you just sell the 112 head unit and keep the Maggie HEX. Although, this would probably be a pretty good deal for someone else who is looking for a Maggie....

Sorry for the confusion....I sometimes jump ahead a few steps when trying to explain things...my thought process sometimes outpaces my ability to communicate.

lollygagger8
06-20-2012, 11:27 AM
Dang you DMM.......my $$$ was burning a hole in my pocket and I went N/A route. I act upset, but I'm only partially mad lol.

This looks like a sweet option if you can stay at that price point!

tommycompton
06-20-2012, 11:43 AM
Frozen boost is where my whipple HEX pump; core, and fill cap came from.
http://www.frozenboost.com/
If I had a maggie i would just sell the head unit and leave everthing else plumbed in; just tell the buyer where the can get the hex parts.
From FB it should be much less than 500.(can't remember)

CTSV_510
06-20-2012, 01:48 PM
Cool, I am looking forward to pics and updates on the build. I would consider upgrading from my 112 if it works out for you.

Where in MD are you located DMM?

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 01:50 PM
Sorry guys I was going to post the link to my photobucket but the pics are all broken. Ill try and get it done tonight.

To answer some questions.

1. For fuel I put in a Deatchwerks pump. It will suffice for the stock pulley (6lbs) Im running 9lbs and was getting close to lean at WOT and 5500 rpm. I put the Kenne Bell boost a pump and meth injection on there. I havent retuned yet. I have the 62lb injectors from Edelbrock

2.You will have to replace everything above the heads on an existing maggie plus the belt tensioner and intercooler lines. You may as well sell the maggie and use the funds for your new kit.

3. intercooler plumbing. This is a dual intercooler (in the plenum)so you will need a dual feed inlet and outlet. I bought the universal kit and it came with the necessary intercooler stuff. You will need to perform a few mods to make it fit but its not bad. The small e-force hex fits great on our cars and will suffice for a street car. 100% track duty will need something bigger.

4. There are 3 spots where the hood needs to be modded. Front two corners of plenum and the TB all touch the hood. You can try denting it in the honeycomb. I did that and cracked my paint. I would have cut the honeycomb out. I bought the aftermarket powerdome hood and its still rubbing on the TB, just barely though.

5. You need a HUGE filter and 4" intake plumbing to feed this thing. I switched to an LS3 MAF and housing they sent me. Your IAT sensor gets relocated with the MAP sensor to the rear of the plenum. The kit provides a harness for this. You need the harness

6. Fuel lines- this is a PIA to do custom. You need the E-force fuel rails. I went with all custom fittings and their fuel rails. I did a Y block in the rear so its balanced between the rails and a crossover in the front. This is basically the JRE fix the camaro guys have. The plenum does not have a lot of room to get a wrench in there for the front crossover. You cannot remove the upper from the lower so its just a little space. It took me a few hours to get the fuel lines hooked up. I recommend you buy the quick connect setup Edelbrock has for the front crossover to avoid the space problems. Ill post the Y block fuel PNs for the rear later. I put a fitting for a FP gauge in there as well.

I think thats it for now. It will make more sense when my pics are in.

Skidmarcx
06-20-2012, 05:33 PM
Good info

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 08:16 PM
1st pic is current status. needs cleanup and rewiring. Im going to pay someone to rewire it. I dont have the patience to do make a proper harness.

3rd and 4th pic show the tensioner setup

5th pic shows where you have to bend the intercooler discharge to clear the powersteering reservoir. I used a tubing bender to bend it. I pulled the barb out while bending it. Its held in with green loctite.

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 08:27 PM
1st pic shows part way through the install pre bent barb
2nd and 3rd show the intercooler barb that needs to be bent and the hole where it comes out
4th shows post bent barb
5th is my ls3 going in

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 09:24 PM
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-14_19-36-29_612.jpg
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-14_19-33-57_466.jpg
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-14_19-33-18_644.jpg
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-14_19-33-25_381.jpg
Above are the fuel rails The shipped system from Edelbrock feeds the passenger side, goes through a crossover in the front and is capped on the drivers side rear. That setup has the potential to starve the cylinders on the drivers side, especially towards the rear.
i read that the JRE fix has a y block. Based on that info I decided that the y block must be used to feed both rear sides of the rails and leave the crossover in the front to keep pressure balanced. These pics show my current setup with the front crossover using threaded connectors. I DO NOT RECOMMEND this setup. I bought the quick connect crossover from Edelbrock in case I ever remove the fuel rails. I will reinstall with the quick connect next time.

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 09:25 PM
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-17_16-16-28_82.jpg

Pic of where you have to mod the stock hood to fit

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 09:36 PM
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-12-58_490.jpg
intercooler reservoir next to fuse box. I made a bracket so it can be raised when filling and be the highest point in the system for bleeding. When capped it can be lowered back down.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-13-25_949.jpg

It then feeds the pump from the bottom. the pump is mounted on the passenger side bumper mount. I took a thick bracket from Lowes and twisted it in the middle to about 45 degrees. This allowed the pump to be mounted in the right direction and the bolt holes for the bracket were flush with bumper.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-13-44_409.jpg

The pump then feeds the intercooler on the left

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-14-11_599.jpg

After exiting the intercooler it goes up in front of the intake assembly to the bent barb of the head unit. this pieces had to be cut and flipped 180 as the shipped version of this hose assembly would have been in the front where the power steering reservoir sits. This is the inlet split and it feeds under the shout to the inlet on the other side of the head unit.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-14-22_234.jpg

the discharge goes to the back of the head unit and meets in the rear of the passenger side.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-12-05_80.jpg

It then comes back towards the fuse box and into the inlet of the reservoir.

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/2012-03-24_18-12-31_518.jpg

psychobillycaddy
06-20-2012, 09:43 PM
and finished
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/1340240829361.jpg

oh yah the intake is two 4 inch epdm 45 degree elbows from gander mountain. They are for boat exhaust. I have a 4 inch stainless pipe in the middle. The MAF/filter is from eforce and its all fitted with my old LPE Cold Air box

I finally finished the meth install with stage 3 snow controller, Ichpen's penske coilovers are on, the interior is now black, the gauges are kind of working, and I just picked up my rims today form powder coating

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/1340221506280.jpg

Now all thats left is put a shim in the slave (I need .113), alignment, dyno tune, paint

Skidmarcx
06-20-2012, 10:06 PM
Very nice ... I'd like to do the y setup for my Maggie rails

ichpen
06-21-2012, 12:16 PM
and finished
http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/1340240829361.jpg

oh yah the intake is two 4 inch epdm 45 degree elbows from gander mountain. They are for boat exhaust. I have a 4 inch stainless pipe in the middle. The MAF/filter is from eforce and its all fitted with my old LPE Cold Air box

I finally finished the meth install with stage 3 snow controller, Ichpen's penske coilovers are on, the interior is now black, the gauges are kind of working, and I just picked up my rims today form powder coating

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv319/cutter5o_photos/1340221506280.jpg

Now all thats left is put a shim in the slave (I need .113), alignment, dyno tune, paint

Nice job there with the eforce :)

Good luck on the project DMM. 6k is really ambitious, don't know how much the kits go for these days but it can't be too far off that number.

I honestly think the way I went is actually the cheapest route for a straight up upgrade having seen lots of these TVS/whipple threads now. Mind you I lost a chunk of change selling just the maggie unit minus the kit pieces but overall effort is far from rocket science. Let me know if you need help.

DMM
06-21-2012, 02:12 PM
Psyco....THAT IS PHENOMENAL WORK!!!! Kudos man, one hell of a job with everything. And really, thanks for sharing with everyone. I have heard of people having problems with the Areo 340 and Deatchwerks pumps...have you had any issue's at all?


CTSV 510 - I am exactly between DC and Baltimore, when I am actually home that is.


ICHPEN - I agree what you did was probably the cheapest way to go...but I already sold my Maggie in my quest for a twin turbo set up. Unfortunately, I am going to be in the hole for a 90mm T Body right off the bat which will cut into the HEX setup that I am planning if all the odds and ends exceed my budgeted amount.

ichpen
06-21-2012, 03:51 PM
Psyco....THAT IS PHENOMENAL WORK!!!! Kudos man, one hell of a job with everything. And really, thanks for sharing with everyone. I have heard of people having problems with the Areo 340 and Deatchwerks pumps...have you had any issue's at all?


CTSV 510 - I am exactly between DC and Baltimore, when I am actually home that is.


ICHPEN - I agree what you did was probably the cheapest way to go...but I already sold my Maggie in my quest for a twin turbo set up. Unfortunately, I am going to be in the hole for a 90mm T Body right off the bat which will cut into the HEX setup that I am planning if all the odds and ends exceed my budgeted amount.

Ya, TB is a must BUT you can save some money and ditch the MAF or at least don't invest in 102 MAF housings and the like :) Run an SD tune for a worry free MAFless experience. The intake tubing is rarely a restriction at your target boost levels but I see lots of folks spending crazy money on big MAFs and fancy tubing.

psychobillycaddy
06-21-2012, 03:51 PM
Psyco....THAT IS PHENOMENAL WORK!!!! Kudos man, one hell of a job with everything. And really, thanks for sharing with everyone. I have heard of people having problems with the Areo 340 and Deatchwerks pumps...have you had any issue's at all?


CTSV 510 - I am exactly between DC and Baltimore, when I am actually home that is.


ICHPEN - I agree what you did was probably the cheapest way to go...but I already sold my Maggie in my quest for a twin turbo set up. Unfortunately, I am going to be in the hole for a 90mm T Body right off the bat which will cut into the HEX setup that I am planning if all the odds and ends exceed my budgeted amount.


Thanks man. I havent had any issues with the Deatchwerks pump. I have the racetronix harness and BAP hooked up to it. I think its overkill for what I need. We will know for sure when we dyno. I think GulfM3 was working on a oilless turbo setup. Check with him on the status.

psychobillycaddy
06-21-2012, 03:53 PM
Ya, TB is a must BUT you can save some money and ditch the MAF or at least don't invest in 102 MAF housings and the like :) Run an SD tune for a worry free MAFless experience.

Yah that. My tuner thinks the 4 inch and huge filter will feed enough to handle the MAF but were probably going SD. Its up to PatG when he gets her on the dyno.

Nasty N8
06-21-2012, 04:40 PM
We offer billet flow threw rails direct fit for the TVS eliminate the possibility of running the end cyl lean.

http://www.nastyperformance.com/shop/nasty-performance-magna-charger-tvs-billet-block-fuel-rails/

ichpen
06-21-2012, 06:26 PM
We offer billet flow threw rails direct fit for the TVS eliminate the possibility of running the end cyl lean.

http://www.nastyperformance.com/shop/nasty-performance-magna-charger-tvs-billet-block-fuel-rails/

Interesting.... I actually need/want to replace the stock magnuson front crossover line as it looks really pinched. I'm sure it's 'ok' as I've been driving/punching it without leans so far but it's really bothering me psychologically...

Can I get the rails and just a cross over line I wonder :)

Damnit I really thought this was a no car spend month...

Nasty N8
06-22-2012, 12:10 PM
We can help out there too.

psychobillycaddy
06-22-2012, 11:58 PM
We offer billet flow threw rails direct fit for the TVS eliminate the possibility of running the end cyl lean.

http://www.nastyperformance.com/shop/nasty-performance-magna-charger-tvs-billet-block-fuel-rails/

You might want to make sure they fit a E-Force. Its really a tight fit in there with the smaller rails they provide. I mean REAL tight