GTO's/WS6 Selling Way More Than They Are Worth. (Need Some Buying Advice)
12-10-2012, 09:53 PM
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GTO's/WS6 Selling Way More Than They Are Worth. (Need Some Buying Advice) Hey Guys New To The Forum. 
Although not an owner of a LS Car, I plan on getting one in the future (4-5 years, could be earlier but unlikely) I currently have a Pontiac GTP Comp G 2004 and loving the car. It is my first car and I am loving it since buying it in March of 2012.
However, I always wanted a LS2 GTO or a (00-02) Trans AM WS6 but could not afford it being a college student and insurance costs.
In the future I do plan on getting a GTO LS2 but maybe a WS6 instead. However I noticed something about these cars especially the WS6 in particular. Maybe you guys can help me out. I live in the NYC area and branch out my search to 100 miles and at a dealership that offers the car with a warranty. Also both cars have to be a manual.
What really annoys me is that especially with the Trans Am WS6 dealerships and even private seller have these cars that are in good condition under 60k miles much more than the KBB price.
For example this WS6 goes for 22k and it was "reduced" to 22k. This tends to go with other dealerships as well. Also a video of the actual car driving. (sounds great).
http://youtu.be/jiUBwlOL1wI
KBB has it for 17k max in this condition and miles. Private seller and others tend to follow the same route.
The GTO LS2 on the other hand is cheaper but to find one in great condition for under 18k is more common but usually in the auto (yuck) and although the 6 speed is more common than the WS6 in the 16-18k range, they are still not as common as I would hope. Here is an example of a nice GTO M6 under 18k
http://youtu.be/FCxA1w2z3Zw
I know some of you on here have GTO's on here and a few with WS6's. Some of you have been able to negotiate a GTO for cheaper.
But I am noticing on other forums and through some research, the WS6's tend to be much harder to bring down in price.
Has anyone negotiated a GTO down or even a WS6 down a couple thousand or at least 1.5k? Also have you been noticing this trend. (Maybe its just around me but I can be wrong)
When I bought my GTP paying cash was a big reason why the dealership where I bought my GP which was originally (11.8k) and got it for (8.5k). Plus it was the end of the month and they had to meet their used car sales quota along with it being there for three months.
I would guess it would be the same with the GTO but less with the WS6. Maybe by the time I buy my next car and pay in cash, the WS6 in similar condition as this one with a M6 (00-02) will be cheaper or negotiable. But I will probably have a better chance with the GTO although I fear the price will rise as well on the GTO in the future.
Sorry for such a long post guys but I fiqure for my first thread I would get right to the point and this forum would be a great place to come for this information.
Although not an owner of a LS Car, I plan on getting one in the future (4-5 years, could be earlier but unlikely) I currently have a Pontiac GTP Comp G 2004 and loving the car. It is my first car and I am loving it since buying it in March of 2012.
However, I always wanted a LS2 GTO or a (00-02) Trans AM WS6 but could not afford it being a college student and insurance costs.
In the future I do plan on getting a GTO LS2 but maybe a WS6 instead. However I noticed something about these cars especially the WS6 in particular. Maybe you guys can help me out. I live in the NYC area and branch out my search to 100 miles and at a dealership that offers the car with a warranty. Also both cars have to be a manual.
What really annoys me is that especially with the Trans Am WS6 dealerships and even private seller have these cars that are in good condition under 60k miles much more than the KBB price.
For example this WS6 goes for 22k and it was "reduced" to 22k. This tends to go with other dealerships as well. Also a video of the actual car driving. (sounds great).
http://youtu.be/jiUBwlOL1wI
KBB has it for 17k max in this condition and miles. Private seller and others tend to follow the same route.
The GTO LS2 on the other hand is cheaper but to find one in great condition for under 18k is more common but usually in the auto (yuck) and although the 6 speed is more common than the WS6 in the 16-18k range, they are still not as common as I would hope. Here is an example of a nice GTO M6 under 18k
http://youtu.be/FCxA1w2z3Zw
I know some of you on here have GTO's on here and a few with WS6's. Some of you have been able to negotiate a GTO for cheaper.
But I am noticing on other forums and through some research, the WS6's tend to be much harder to bring down in price.
Has anyone negotiated a GTO down or even a WS6 down a couple thousand or at least 1.5k? Also have you been noticing this trend. (Maybe its just around me but I can be wrong)
When I bought my GTP paying cash was a big reason why the dealership where I bought my GP which was originally (11.8k) and got it for (8.5k). Plus it was the end of the month and they had to meet their used car sales quota along with it being there for three months.
I would guess it would be the same with the GTO but less with the WS6. Maybe by the time I buy my next car and pay in cash, the WS6 in similar condition as this one with a M6 (00-02) will be cheaper or negotiable. But I will probably have a better chance with the GTO although I fear the price will rise as well on the GTO in the future.
Sorry for such a long post guys but I fiqure for my first thread I would get right to the point and this forum would be a great place to come for this information.
12-10-2012, 10:31 PM
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I think the fourth gen f-bodies like the ws6 are just simply becoming harder to come by for one that's not beat to hell. Kbb means nothing on These cars because the respective owners can sell for whatever price they see fit.
12-10-2012, 10:32 PM
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They think ws6's are gold. Ive had plenty that i've given less than 10 grand for. Most had 75000-100,000mi. I'm sorry, not to hate on the cars, but they are not worth it. You can also find GTOs for around 12,000 and I think thats even pushing it for old cars. The GTO is closer to being worth it than a ws6. Buy one with more miles on it for 10,000 less
12-11-2012, 12:17 AM
#5
WS6 package=cool and all, but waaaay overpriced and overhyped.
Ram Air Hood, Exhaust tips, 17" wheels, bigger (some claim more unbalanced) swaybar, power steering cooler.....that's it. And you usually pay 30-50% for a ws6 car than a comperable "base" Trans am/formula.
If you're looking to mod a car at all, don't bother spending the extra cash on a ws6. Most people upgrade the wheels anyway, and that's half the package.
Also, LT1 cars are a phenominal performance for the price as well and hell, 90% of it is the same car as a 98-02. May be a compromise for the time being as they can be had for about half the price of a comperable LS1 car usually, and are really not leaps and bounds behind an LS1 stock for stock.
Ram Air Hood, Exhaust tips, 17" wheels, bigger (some claim more unbalanced) swaybar, power steering cooler.....that's it. And you usually pay 30-50% for a ws6 car than a comperable "base" Trans am/formula.
If you're looking to mod a car at all, don't bother spending the extra cash on a ws6. Most people upgrade the wheels anyway, and that's half the package.
Also, LT1 cars are a phenominal performance for the price as well and hell, 90% of it is the same car as a 98-02. May be a compromise for the time being as they can be had for about half the price of a comperable LS1 car usually, and are really not leaps and bounds behind an LS1 stock for stock.
12-11-2012, 10:03 AM
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Dang, I need to raise my price. Too bad you weren't in the market now instead of 4-5 yrs in the future at which point the 5th gen prices may be the better option seeing that dealership's marketing strategy.
12-11-2012, 01:08 PM
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That WS6 example you posted isn't far off from what you might expect to pay. The ultra low mileage (12,000 in this case) non-abused examples sell for above KBB in many instances. To top it off the SOM color is highly desireable to many thus adding on even more of a 'premium'. $18,000 - $20,000 will probably be the selling price of that car you have mentioned.
In the grand scheme of the WS6, or any LS1 F-bodies, you definitely 'get what you pay for' 9 out of 10 times. Finding a low mileage, one owner, adult owned F-body or GTO will cost you serious money and rightfully so. The prices do vary but I am going to cite you two examples of cars that could be for sale:
1) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, one adult owner, stock, with all maintenance records. The car needs nothing!
2) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, 3 owners, with the last owner being a very young driver that has the car modified with a cam, oversized tires, etc... No records available as far as maintenance.
Amazingly, each of these cars will be priced the same in any price guide book if they are considered by the sellers as in 'good' condition. Now which one do you want to buy?? You know car #2 will probably need some TLC sooner than later (and maybe more) where car #1 is set to go coast to coast once the keys are turned over. I know I will pay a reasonable 'premium' for car #1 every day of the week. That's the car I want. If the owner is $2,000 over 'private party' KBB pricing it is worth it. Non-abused with full records!
When you are ready to purchase, keep your goals focused on what you want. Don't be afraid to pay a little more than a price guide quote for that special car. Don't worry what others say. Also the prices you see are asking prices. You bring cash or a bank check and see how fast that price gets reduced. That $17,000 asking price may be yours for $15,000 within 10 minutes. I've owned these F-bodies for 16 years and have seen owners come and go constantly. Be one of the smart owners when the time comes. Buying a poor example is the quickest way to becoming an ex-owner before you ever envisioned.
*** One other note: Expand that search area to find the car you want. My last two cars (the GT and the SS) required overnight stays and 500 miles distances. They were worth every dime spent on gas, fast food, and a motel room. Don't limit yourself. Best of luck!
In the grand scheme of the WS6, or any LS1 F-bodies, you definitely 'get what you pay for' 9 out of 10 times. Finding a low mileage, one owner, adult owned F-body or GTO will cost you serious money and rightfully so. The prices do vary but I am going to cite you two examples of cars that could be for sale:
1) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, one adult owner, stock, with all maintenance records. The car needs nothing!
2) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, 3 owners, with the last owner being a very young driver that has the car modified with a cam, oversized tires, etc... No records available as far as maintenance.
Amazingly, each of these cars will be priced the same in any price guide book if they are considered by the sellers as in 'good' condition. Now which one do you want to buy?? You know car #2 will probably need some TLC sooner than later (and maybe more) where car #1 is set to go coast to coast once the keys are turned over. I know I will pay a reasonable 'premium' for car #1 every day of the week. That's the car I want. If the owner is $2,000 over 'private party' KBB pricing it is worth it. Non-abused with full records!
When you are ready to purchase, keep your goals focused on what you want. Don't be afraid to pay a little more than a price guide quote for that special car. Don't worry what others say. Also the prices you see are asking prices. You bring cash or a bank check and see how fast that price gets reduced. That $17,000 asking price may be yours for $15,000 within 10 minutes. I've owned these F-bodies for 16 years and have seen owners come and go constantly. Be one of the smart owners when the time comes. Buying a poor example is the quickest way to becoming an ex-owner before you ever envisioned.
*** One other note: Expand that search area to find the car you want. My last two cars (the GT and the SS) required overnight stays and 500 miles distances. They were worth every dime spent on gas, fast food, and a motel room. Don't limit yourself. Best of luck!
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12-11-2012, 02:46 PM
#8
That WS6 example you posted isn't far off from what you might expect to pay. The ultra low mileage (12,000 in this case) non-abused examples sell for above KBB in many instances. To top it off the SOM color is highly desireable to many thus adding on even more of a 'premium'. $18,000 - $20,000 will probably be the selling price of that car you have mentioned.
In the grand scheme of the WS6, or any LS1 F-bodies, you definitely 'get what you pay for' 9 out of 10 times. Finding a low mileage, one owner, adult owned F-body or GTO will cost you serious money and rightfully so. The prices do vary but I am going to cite you two examples of cars that could be for sale:
1) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, one adult owner, stock, with all maintenance records. The car needs nothing!
2) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, 3 owners, with the last owner being a very young driver that has the car modified with a cam, oversized tires, etc... No records available as far as maintenance.
Amazingly, each of these cars will be priced the same in any price guide book if they are considered by the sellers as in 'good' condition. Now which one do you want to buy?? You know car #2 will probably need some TLC sooner than later (and maybe more) where car #1 is set to go coast to coast once the keys are turned over. I know I will pay a reasonable 'premium' for car #1 every day of the week. That's the car I want. If the owner is $2,000 over 'private party' KBB pricing it is worth it. Non-abused with full records!
When you are ready to purchase, keep your goals focused on what you want. Don't be afraid to pay a little more than a price guide quote for that special car. Don't worry what others say. Also the prices you see are asking prices. You bring cash or a bank check and see how fast that price gets reduced. That $17,000 asking price may be yours for $15,000 within 10 minutes. I've owned these F-bodies for 16 years and have seen owners come and go constantly. Be one of the smart owners when the time comes. Buying a poor example is the quickest way to becoming an ex-owner before you ever envisioned.
*** One other note: Expand that search area to find the car you want. My last two cars (the GT and the SS) required overnight stays and 500 miles distances. They were worth every dime spent on gas, fast food, and a motel room. Don't limit yourself. Best of luck!
In the grand scheme of the WS6, or any LS1 F-bodies, you definitely 'get what you pay for' 9 out of 10 times. Finding a low mileage, one owner, adult owned F-body or GTO will cost you serious money and rightfully so. The prices do vary but I am going to cite you two examples of cars that could be for sale:
1) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, one adult owner, stock, with all maintenance records. The car needs nothing!
2) A 2002 WS6 with 40,000 miles, 3 owners, with the last owner being a very young driver that has the car modified with a cam, oversized tires, etc... No records available as far as maintenance.
Amazingly, each of these cars will be priced the same in any price guide book if they are considered by the sellers as in 'good' condition. Now which one do you want to buy?? You know car #2 will probably need some TLC sooner than later (and maybe more) where car #1 is set to go coast to coast once the keys are turned over. I know I will pay a reasonable 'premium' for car #1 every day of the week. That's the car I want. If the owner is $2,000 over 'private party' KBB pricing it is worth it. Non-abused with full records!
When you are ready to purchase, keep your goals focused on what you want. Don't be afraid to pay a little more than a price guide quote for that special car. Don't worry what others say. Also the prices you see are asking prices. You bring cash or a bank check and see how fast that price gets reduced. That $17,000 asking price may be yours for $15,000 within 10 minutes. I've owned these F-bodies for 16 years and have seen owners come and go constantly. Be one of the smart owners when the time comes. Buying a poor example is the quickest way to becoming an ex-owner before you ever envisioned.
*** One other note: Expand that search area to find the car you want. My last two cars (the GT and the SS) required overnight stays and 500 miles distances. They were worth every dime spent on gas, fast food, and a motel room. Don't limit yourself. Best of luck!
This is true 1000x over. People can AND WILL ask the top dollar for their car most times after seeing immaculate/well maintained cars of similar "options" go for X amount. All cars are not maintained equal.
I've been to New York, Salt Lake City, Texas, Florida, and all voer the midwest just to buy cars for these exact reasons.
12-11-2012, 02:49 PM
#9
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oh my goodness, here is one that almost meets the above advice and criteria!
https://ls1tech.com/forums/vehicle-c...ible-6spd.html
have you ever been to Milwaukee? Well worth the time in cheese and beer sampling plus you can get an awesome foam cheesehead to protect your head from the blistering midwest sun when driving the WS6 'vert with the top down.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/vehicle-c...ible-6spd.html
have you ever been to Milwaukee? Well worth the time in cheese and beer sampling plus you can get an awesome foam cheesehead to protect your head from the blistering midwest sun when driving the WS6 'vert with the top down.
