93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

I'll try not to write too long of a book

So I'm trying to get this 97 formula into shape as a daily driver. I got it cheap and it needs some TLC I bought it knowing it needed a head gasket. I saw some milkshake on the stick and he said it would need water to get the quarter mile home. In retrospect stupid but I felt sorry for the car and it was pretty cheap..

So I've done motor swaps and heads and cams on these cars. Mostly LS1 stuff, last 4th gen was an LSX 454 car with all the supporting mods did most of the work myself. Now I have a 73 Firebird that is my toy and an 06 TBSS that is my summer daily. I got this to be my winter daily and just because I love 4th gens and even though I know an LS1 is better in alot of ways love the LT1. My 93 is still going strong and is owned by Fastbird on this board.

Anyways fast forward to getting home. Car runs ok home consider there was no intake in front of the MAF and the intake elbow has a gapping hole in it. But I figure I should drain the water and keep it dry and change the oil before I put it on ramps in the garage for the head gaskets...well no water comes out and the oil ends up like this:



On top of that there is obvious gasket material in there. So I guess that lessons the chance of a cracked head or block causing it

I have a video of me starting it up and pulling it into the garage but I'm a little embarrassed to post it, it is mostly of my thumb and my dirty garage but it does show its not smoking at startup although running like crap with unmetered air and a massive head gasket leak...

So my question is, I really don't want to drop a lot of money into this car right now, until I get it going and know what I have. I have a couple of options:

1- Swap the gaskets, I'd at least have a shop check the heads, after all parts and fluids, buying 1704's and ARP's I'd be under a 500 bucks. Run a few oil changes in the first 30-40 miles and some seafoam to clean the motor out and take my chances.

2- Drop the motor and rebuild it. This one is hard because I know me and by the time I'm done I'll probably have 3k into, which is stupid at this point.

3- I found this on craigslist. Supposed to be from a 97 formula with a six speed, and has all accessories and wiring harness ( a plus because if I kept the car I'd do a 6 speed swap I've done like 7 of them.) Supposed to have 65k and the car was totalled. Gave me a total BS power number but supposed of had head work and a cam but who knows. Who does head work and a cam with steel rockers and manifolds? I think I can get it for 450-525.







What do you guys think. I'm leaning towards the head gaskets, and get the CAI and 1LE elbow on there and see how she runs...but I've never had a head gasket go this bad before.

Thanks for reading my novel!!! Looking forward to driving this thing I really miss the 4th gens. My 73 is crazy but its just not the same...

Bobby

whytryz28

iTrader: (28)

Im more worried about those bearings, but change the gaskets and fluids and see what she does. Not that expensive just labor.

bufmatmuslepants

iTrader: (3)

Can you ask to see the intake ports on that motor to verify any head porting? At least to see if its shitty port work. You could probably sell your current motor and wiring harness to offset cost, but if its a shitty motor in that ad your out more money. There is no real need for ARP head bolts or studs if your just replacing head gaskets, especially since you wouldn't be sending the block to a machine shop to be honed with a torque plate to simulate the extra load on the block with the arp bolts, just use rock auto new bolts and save money. If you keep searching craigslist ypu can find a stock longblock for $4-500, maybe less. The cheapest easiest route would be the 0.026 gaskets, new non torque to yield bolts, and just new gaskets. Maybe new valvesprings while the heads are off.

The other option is to a very basic refresh of the motor and USE SELF CONTROL to not let it snowball. Here is a thread I created of my project I'm starting now.

https://ls1tech.com/forums/lt1-lt4-m...-opinions.html

Post 3 has part numbers and prices.

96lt1m6

iTrader: (31)

Disassemble entire motor, clean and inspect crank, rod ends and replace those bearings oil pump, timing chain and rings.... if you don't you will be sorry..

SS RRR

iTrader: (2)

Don't ever buy a used long block unless you are going to take it apart and check it out. Could be in worse condition than your current.
Just change out the gaskets on your current engine. Take the heads to a machine shop to get cleaned and inspected. No reason to use Seafoam if you're having the heads cleaned. If you are worried about carbon on the pistons, take some mineral spirits and a nylon or brass brush and scrub them clean. Get some Fel-Pro 1077's, put everything back together using ARP head bolts and be on your happy way.

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

So I figured I'd see a nasty gasket blown, but I have really nice plug coloring on the drivers side. And really clean pistons for 104k miles and everything else filthy. What do you guys think? Did they just let water with no coolant sit too long?

Also the bolts on the lower part of the head were really easy to break while the center ones were a workout. Time to give up on this motor?







The head:

LTZombie

I'd say there is a bit more work there than a simple HG install.

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

Could you elaborate?

LTZombie

Sorry, I just realized I missed the part about you bringing the heads to a shop to have them checked.

That looks like a pretty nasty head gasket failure. If it were me, I would have the shop check the heads and, at minimum, have the deck resurfaced so you don't have to do the job twice. The variation in the head bolt torque could be an indication of some warping, but that's just a guess.

Assuming the engine wasn't running for too long with that sludge in the oil pan, you may be able to get some decent life out of the bottom end. For a DD, I would just change all seals and maybe consider bearings and rings to keep the build on a low budget.

Low N Slow

iTrader: (4)

That crud looks like someone mixed Dexcool with plain old ethylene glycol antifreeze. It can be a real bitch to flush clean.

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

Yeah I think after I get it all back together I'm just going to take it to a radiator shop and have them flush it again. Nasty stuff.

Italianjoe1

Have you put a straight-edge across the heads? Looks like it's badly warped in the middle. Worth checking the block same way, if you can't find any measurable warpage, i'd skim the heads and toss it back together. I've pulled heads that were overheated so badly they cracked, and didn't have to touch the block.

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

The heads are going to the machine shop so I figure they can check them. THanks for the reminder on the block, I'll do that when I get it all cleaned up. That is going to fun!

duh

iTrader: (16)

In every SBC engine I've ever torn apart for head gaskets, this side looks relatively normal. Carbon on the pistons and cyl head looks about right for a good running engine for the mileage. I'm interested to see what the other side looks like. It's probably going to have one or two slugs that look brand new. The chambers from the bad cyl's will look brand new as well. Aside from the crummy looking cooling jackets, it looks about normal. I'd continue with the gasket swap, maybe run the new oil for 30 minutes or so, then change it and the filter for fresh and run it like normal. If the car is a daily driver, I personally would go that way, have the cooling system flushed and then just drive it. If it for some reason develops a knock, you know what you have to do from there.

LTZombie

Outside of the possible head warp, I bet you'll be fine otherwise.

Transmarrowbird94

Well u got it apart throw a cam in it

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

I hear you...its taking all my self control to not just start order parts. At this point I just want it run good as transportation. That may change after I get the kinks worked out. This will be the first time I don't do a bunch of "while I'm in theres"

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

Damn it might get alot more than a cam... The passenger side didn't look quite so good.
The surface rust is catching a light finger nail.

duh

iTrader: (16)

Yea, its been sitting too long. Needs at least a good hone. Pull that sucker and so a few "while you're in there's". I'd personally say get some .030 over slugs and a small cam. Have the heads re-done and just limit yourself on the rest. Try doing 1.5 roller TIP rockers, they're pretty cheap and free up a bit of friction. Keep it modest and maybe a LPE or hotcam. Nothing major. Then you can keep factory injectors and not get too crazy but have a fun driver. That's what I would do. Keeps the price down and the fun factor is still then.

93TAWicked1

iTrader: (28)

Thanks for the help, but after adding up the cost of options I think I'm going to go LS I'm not really that excited about it but I found a setup local with suspension and exhaust for 2400 bucks so I think I"m going to that route.

Thanks again!