LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

Hey guys any of you running the john Deere Hy-Guard fluid in your 4l80e. I decided to "experiment" with it I had the trans freshened up a couple months I'm running jakes Transbrake (which kicks ***) so I figured this fluid will take the heat better and not break down as easy as conventional ATF. Mods on the car is a turbo car I'm running an FTI turbo converter trans cooler is rated @40k matched with a chiseled performance "ice box cooler". The problem I'm having is when my trans is cold my tranny whines when you hit the throttle after a few minutes of idling the "whine" is gone probably the fluid gets warmed up so I'm thinking since this fluid is thicker I'm starving my trans from fluid when it's cold It drives fine but will drop the pan since I smell some burnt fluid from the dipstick.... Thanks

mrvedit

There was some discussion about successfully using Hy-Guard in various transmission in this thread:
https://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic...uid-4l60e.html
I recall other posts stating that it tightens up the converter a bit.

AutomagicLS1

iTrader: (18)

I use just orielley auto parts 303 tractor fluid and change it once a year. What filter are you using in your trans? If using tractor fluid you need to use the screen type filter otherwise it will starve the pump which may be why you are hearing the pump whine

LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

That's exactly what I was thinking I'm running the stock 4l80 filter I tried looking for a screen filter like the th400 but no luck I might just tare down the tranny again since I see some dark material in the oil

AutomagicLS1

iTrader: (18)

I would post up on trans section on the bullet and find out what screen filter guys are using for 80e's with tractor fluid. Someone knows

lsfanatic

On a note aside from the whining issue, I would be more concerned with parasitic loss from the thicker fluid. Personally I think Hy-Guard is to sticky and thick to run in a trans without it causing some sort of resistance. If you are worried about the fluid decomposing from heat why don't you run a synthetic? As far as I know standard ATF isnt supposed to decompose until somewhere above 250 degrees anyway. The synthetic has to be higher, and if your trans is getting that hot you have some problems anyway haha.

transam69230

iTrader: (49)

Do you have a car with a trans-brake at all? It creates a stupid amount of heat when you are in the trans brake.

lsfanatic

I was not trying to be snarky, merely offer a suggestion due to my experiences with Hy-Guard in its recommended uses.

To answer your question, I do not have a trans-brake. I knew they generated a lot of heat but don't you only use it during staging? How much heat can it possibly generate in 7 seconds? I honestly don't know since I have never used one.

LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

That's exactly why I decided to make the change and try the hy-guard. I hot lapped my car at the end of the 3rd race my car lost 3rd gear I had to let the car sit for a while before my trans started working again. I was running ATF and launching off the transbrake.... I knew the trans got hot since fluid came out the vent.... When the trans got torn apart all my clutches seemed to be in good shape except for my direct clutches which had minor glazed to them that's why i figured my fluid had broken down do to the heat from using the trans brake.

lsfanatic

Do you have a fluid temp gauge? I am curious now how hot a trans-brake actually makes the fluid.

LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

At the time if the race I didn't have it installed but I'm sure it was beyond 230+ lol that's why I upgraded my coolers and made the change to this Hy-Guard fluid

mrvedit

1HP = 750 watts
So, if your partial throttle to reach the stall speed puts out 100HP, that is 75,000 watts or 256,000 BTU. That is how much heat several high power propane heater put out - all into the fluid running through your converter. I estimate the fluid temp goes up by 10-20 degrees per second. (Not a fact, just my estimate.)

lsfanatic

Thanks for doing the math! That puts it in perspective for me, as I have a 165,000 BTU kerosene heater for my garage. So all the heat comes from the hydraulic resistance in the converter? I thought some heat came from the trans-brake activating 1st and reverse at the same time. If it all comes from the converter, wouldn't foot-brake launches cause the same heat build up?

Jake's Performance

iTrader: (2)

50-100 degrees per second on a transbrake.
1000 RWHP combo, cooler outlet line ( right after the converter), you''ll see about 600 in 7-8 seconds.

Unless the trans is slipping, the only place heat is generated is in the converter and pump when on the transbrake. Some heat can be generated by the clutch packs on a shift, and some very small amount of heat is generated in the rotating parts, geartrain, but 95% of the heat generated in an auto transmission happens in the converter. That is why the the fluid goes directly from the converter to the cooler.

Jake's Performance

iTrader: (2)

No special filter is required. Use low viscosity HyGard.

LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

Crap I used the thicker hy-guard stuff... You think that's what's causing the "whine" it goes away once the I drive the for a few miles the noise goes away once it seems to warm up

Jake's Performance

iTrader: (2)

That's what I would suspect since it goes away when it gets warm.

lsfanatic

So foot-braking the car would generate the same heat?

LosLs1's

iTrader: (21)

Hey Jake another question I'm running two coolers one cooler is mounted in front of my car then I have the line exting the cooler going all the way to the back of the car where the battery is located when it's relocated (4th gen Fbody) going to another cooler that's inside of a aluminum cell and I just add ice during a race... So the exit line goes back to the rear cooler fitting.. Do you think I'm runnin too much hose line that might cause a drop in pressure?

Jake's Performance

iTrader: (2)

You won't be able to apply as much power on a footbrake, so not as much heat but anytime you have an engine making power, it has to be transmitted. It will either be transmitted THROUGH the drivetrain, or if you try to prevent that by footbraking/transbraking, you will transmit it back into heat.

The rough rule of thumb for an internal combustion engine is that 1/3 of the engines heat is used for combustion to make power, 1/3 goes out the exhaust, and 1/3 is lost to the cooling system.

Think of that in terms if how much heat it takes to make the power, and if most of that power is going back to heat...