highonoctane16

hey guys. sorry if this is just a rediculous idea, but its getting late and an idea popped into my head. First of all, let me say that in no way do i think this is any kind of a "breakthrough" or anything. I just look at it as an easy alternative/combination, of the tried and true methods. Hell, somebody may have already done it before, i dont know. Im basically just looking for feedback. This would really only apply to people attempting to make their own true dual setup on a budget. This seems like a good compromise between the efficiency of an x pipe, and the ease/cost of an h pipe. it would be pretty easy to make since it is just two straight pipes bridging the main exhaust, but at the same time it should flow better than an H pipe. i have no problem trying a new idea, but does anyone see any real fault in the system? (sorry if the pic doesnt show up, i've never attached an image before.) tell me what you think.

LS1_PNYTAMR

iTrader: (1)

d- on the artwork but i give ya props for going out on a limb and posting up ur idea.. dont think it would have the effincency of an x pipe though, not quite the same, better off just doing an h pipe id think.

highonoctane16

lol, im no divinci when it comes to microsoft paint, thats for sure.. When you say i'd be better off with an H pipe...why? to me, this looks like it would flow better than an H, but would be much more simple to make than a conventional X.

BottleRocket

X will probably outflow it, but hey, give it a shot if youre up to it!

highonoctane16

yeah, im not doubting the fact that a conventional X will outflow it, but for all practical purposes, this WOULD be easier to fab up. It doesnt incorporate all the bends of an X, not to mention, where the pipes cross would be much easier to weld.

98BirdLS1

Hey guys, highonoctane asked this question in reference with trying to help me set-up my own custom exhaust. I'm looking for over the axle duals and unfortunately no one in this area (that I can find) has an expierence or knowledge in custom f-body duals. Lowest quote I got was $1000 bucks; not including supplies. So I'm going to borrow a welder and do it myself. Highonoctane and I were brainstorming and he came up with that x/h-pipe drawing.

I don't think it will out flow an x-pipe, but it will be far eaiser to custom make. So the question is, will that set-up above give the ease and sound of an h-pipe while still producing superior scavenging effect of an x-pipe?

Thanks in advance Luke

RyanJ

looks pretty dumb (no offense). why have the straight pipes AND the x??? wouldn't moving gas just go to the path of least resistance (i.e. the straight path). How would it be easier to notch the pipe and weld some angle pieces to it...rather than just buying 4 45' bends and welding them to pipe? You're gonna be doing a bunch of that anyway, right? How are you gonna get the pipes over the axle?

jtsc23

Diagram drawn is equivalent to having two H-pipes in your system - angled "H's" that are longer in length and crossing each other. Net result is two balance pipes, one too many. No idea is stupid so keep coming up with them and asking questions.

LS1_PNYTAMR

iTrader: (1)

well put!

highonoctane16

AHH HAA! the first nay sayer!

a. why have the straight pipes and the x? for the same reason that people have an x or an h to begin with..

b. how are you gonna get the pipes over the axle? the same way everyone else does it.. to the best of my knowledge, two 2.5" pipes will fit over the axle.

I've never built an exhaust for an ls1 trans am, so if im wrong, i can live with that..let me know. I'm just simply looking for opinions. So far the feedback has been great! keep it up guys, i want to hear more

DanZ28

iTrader: (5)

I don't think that X setup buys anything over an H setup. The standard X-pipe uses the small cross section meeting together to create the scavenging effect. Your setup, like said above is like having two balance pipes, no need for two.

Also take into consideration why most manufactures don't make true duals out to the bumper, it's not cheap or easy to do. If you run it down the driverside floorboard like your diagram, your right up against the fuel lines, torque arm, and ground clearance loss.

Hope you come up with something nifty though so the rest of us can try

Dan

mrr23

iTrader: (3)

bassani's tru-dual setup is pretty much just like that. comes off the engine into an x-pipe then two over the right side of the axle. then into one muffler which is dual in and dual out. http://www.stealthram.com/2000pontiacformula.html

highonoctane16

Great news! It looks like its at least feasible.. is it worth it? I guess we'll find out.

RyanJ

you totally missed what I was saying.

a. why have the straight pipes AND the x. the x alone will work better and will be easier.

b. That wasn't a real question. I was trying to get you to think for a sec. If you are bending/welding to get the pipes up and over the axle, why can't you just take some 45' pieces and connect to an X.

Let me make this clear. I don't see the benefit of your system. Its dumb and redundant. True-duals have been done for years; why mess with what works?

Clear enough?

DanZ28

iTrader: (5)

The Bassani system is nothing like your diagram at all. It goes to a true X-pipe and runs along the the stock pipe location with both pipes exiting over the axle on the pasenger side, just FYI. If this is what you want and you have stock manifolds or shorties, then I think you can get it in the $8xx range ready to bolt in...

psykoTA

iTrader: (4)

Magnaflow has a nice x-pipe, not two 45's coming to a crappy junction.
http://www.magnaflow.com/02product/02hardware.asp I think it was around $80 for it.

As for "why mess with what works?"-what happened if all the great inventors thought that way? No idea is stupid.
Here someting to make you think:Assuming you have an LS1, why drive it and put money in it? Why not have an old musclecar with a 4 barrel. Why mess with what works ?(carburetor). Why fool around with this new fangled fuel injection, just stay with what works, a carburetor.--See how retarded that way of thinking is.

777

iTrader: (21)

imo this idea will be MUCH harder to fab up than a x-pipe true dual system...plus you've said it yourself it won't make better power...to get it over the axle you will have to bend pipes so there is no need in saying it is hard to make an x when you will be bending anyways...it's an idea but not a logical one..

777

iTrader: (21)

i didn't say it and i can still understand what he is talking about...this way will not be any better...the only idea for this was ease of fabrication...and it won't be easier...

98BirdLS1

First of all Ryan J, just because you don't think it's a perfect idea doesn't mean it's dumb and redundant. Unless you're a physics professor with mounds of data compiled to back up your statment I don't think you have the intelligence to call anyone's idea dumb and redundant.

Second of all, under your theory of "path of least resistance" a conventional H-pipe would be dumb and redundant because exhaust gases would go through the straight pipe and completely bypass the cross section. The purpose of a crossover pipe is to even out exhaust flow from an uneven firing order of a v-8 engine. A h-pipe evens out flow while an x-pipe creates the scavenge effect becuase of the "pulses" of exhaust gas creating a suction like pull.

Thirdly, most ordinary car owners do not have a crushbender or a mandrel bender so they buy pipes and bends from a company. An x-pipe may be easy to make but welding and angled piece to a straight pice would be easier

Fourthly, "true duals have been done for years, why mess with what works", if people didn't mess with what works then we would never have new ideas. The factory exhaust works fine, why mess with it? Now that is just dumb.

Luke

highonoctane16

RyanJ- i appreciate your criticism. It's what i asked for in the first place...criticism. However there isnt really any need to be a dick about it.. I also think you're taking my diagram way too seriously and too much to scale.. It was made in paint in about 30 seconds.. If you want to keep arguing about it, go find a 4 year old, because i wont oblige.