Manual Transmission - Like I shifted into reverse...

You know how people always say things like, "I passed him like he shifted into reverse!" Well, lately its actualy been happening to me. From time to time, especially when the temperature is in the single digits and lower, the reverse lockout solenoid fails. But its very strange that sometime it will work and sometime it will not, even if I havnt slowed down enough to have the lockout release. For instance, i may be on the highway in some traffic, and I may shift between 4 5 and 6th gears a bunch. sometime it will fail, then itll work, then it will fail again. I was under the impression that the solenoid failed in the lockout position. With no current applied to the solenoid, it should lock me out, right? Well once youre going faster than a few miles per hour, it locks you our tight? Why if it works one momen, would the ecm add voltage to get it to release, even if im at highway speeds. Weird stuff, man. I just needed to vent.

Lets try this in here...

I've seen that @ the track a few times. It's usually an internal trans problem with the shift forks that I've heard as the cause.
It is when your shifting into 3rd when people say they see the reverse lights?

No no... its just a problem with the solenoid. Sometimes it just isnt locking me out, so when i go to hit 5th gear, if i move over too far, it hits reverse. All I really need to do is be careful selecting gears and im fine, but ive gotten so used to just pushing as far right as I can when going to 5th.

I had mine replaced 3 times under factory warranty! They just go bad! People I have talked to said its random, they just fail. Mine all locked me out of reverse... lol so I had to be careful how I parked so I wouldn't have to push my car to backup... lol

Ok , so lets do this again. The reverse solenoid is normall exende so in order to "activate " it/ release the load, it needs 9 volts min.So if you are getting the gate easily, you are powering the solenoid = this is a classic inverted plug( with the skip shift solenoid) symptom. If the solenod fails it fails with the load on. Although the load is high, the reverse is not really locked out.
There is no internal linkage failure issue its just people missing a shift and gooning reverse at the track. Yes, missing two gates( 3rd and 5th).

Ok , so lets do this again. The reverse solenoid is normall exende so in order to "activate " it/ release the load, it needs 9 volts min.So if you are getting the gate easily, you are powering the solenoid = this is a classic inverted plug( with the skip shift solenoid) symptom. If the solenod fails it fails with the load on. Although the load is high, the reverse is not really locked out.
There is no internal linkage failure issue its just people missing a shift and gooning reverse at the track. Yes, missing two gates( 3rd and 5th).


Thats why this is so weird. Forget about racing or at the track. This dosnt happen all the time, and it wasnt the result of a botched shift. My tranny shifts all gears perfectly fine (for a mexican built tremec :eyes: ) This will happen on normal commute, while driving like a grandmother. It is definately proportionally linked to how cold it is outside. I happens much more frequently when its in the negatives outside.

My guess is that there is something in the ECM that semds voltage to the rev l/o solenoid during normal driving from time to time, probably to avoid it freezing. However, it is actually freezing when this happens and sticking in the open condition from time to time.

I was thinking it could be a problem with my VSS reading 0, but my speedo seems to be fine.

are you sure you don't have the skip harness plugged into the reverse solenoid? Gotta be a bad/ wrong signal going to that thing for it to do as you say.

Yes, Im positive. I havnt been poking around down there at all. CAGS is disabled via HPTuners. Nobody works on my car but me. Its been working fine the last 3 or 4 days since its been warmer out. If I didnt experience it myself, repeatedly mind you, I would tell anybody else that its just not possible. I would cite all the things that were stated above. But I assure you that something is pulling that lockout solenoid out of the way at highway speeds.

Maybe the solenoid has voltage going through it normally until the clutch pedal goes down? I also read something about it being released while there's no load on the tranny, but im not familliar with any "load sensor" lol. Who knows.

You know how people always say things like, "I passed him like he shifted into reverse!" Well, lately its actualy been happening to me. From time to time, especially when the temperature is in the single digits and lower, the reverse lockout solenoid fails. But its very strange that sometime it will work and sometime it will not, even if I havnt slowed down enough to have the lockout release. For instance, i may be on the highway in some traffic, and I may shift between 4 5 and 6th gears a bunch. sometime it will fail, then itll work, then it will fail again. I was under the impression that the solenoid failed in the lockout position. With no current applied to the solenoid, it should lock me out, right? Well once youre going faster than a few miles per hour, it locks you our tight? Why if it works one momen, would the ecm add voltage to get it to release, even if im at highway speeds. Weird stuff, man. I just needed to vent.
Back from the Dead..... Did you ever figure out your problem? My car has been sitting since sept. and i jumped in it to do the rearend swap and while driving i was able to throw it into reverse (not on purpose, it was a accident) i went home and hooked up my scanner and ran a function test on the solenoid and it's clicking when activated but i can still put it into reverse it's not easy to do it but it's possible and was never before. when i don't activate the solenoid it will shift into reverse fine with ease and no problems. Do i need to replace the solenoid or look for another problem? Fuse is ok btw. ive only heard of it failing and not allowing reverse but not failing and allowing reverse.

From what you've said abpve, the solenoid is working as intended. It is NOT a lock out it is an inhibitor. Therefore you can over ride it ( with higher effort) by design. If you are getting a low-effort reverse shift at speeds above 3-5mph, your ECM must be giving a 12V signal to the solenoid. This is an aftermarket programing flaw not a transmission issue.

Back from the Dead..... Did you ever figure out your problem? My car has been sitting since sept. and i jumped in it to do the rearend swap and while driving i was able to throw it into reverse (not on purpose, it was a accident) i went home and hooked up my scanner and ran a function test on the solenoid and it's clicking when activated but i can still put it into reverse it's not easy to do it but it's possible and was never before. when i don't activate the solenoid it will shift into reverse fine with ease and no problems. Do i need to replace the solenoid or look for another problem? Fuse is ok btw. ive only heard of it failing and not allowing reverse but not failing and allowing reverse.

No, sadly I havnt found any fix for this. Ive just learned to shift more carefully into fifth to make sure I dont accidentally hit seventh gear.

From what you've said abpve, the solenoid is working as intended. It is NOT a lock out it is an inhibitor. Therefore you can over ride it ( with higher effort) by design. If you are getting a low-effort reverse shift at speeds above 3-5mph, your ECM must be giving a 12V signal to the solenoid. This is an aftermarket programing flaw not a transmission issue.

My concern is this has never happened before and going into reverse at 30mph and grinding the gear is not fun at all, i wish i could blame it on massive muscle strength and im just over riding the inhibitor but it's not, like i said it takes a bit off effort but if this is how it was designed i probably would of hit reverse more times then just once my shifting style & computer programing hasent changed since the car was put to sleep for the winter. The only thing that has changed was the rear end gears I went from 3:42's and a Stock LT1 complete rearend to 2:73's and a Stock LS1 Complete Rearend. Computer programing hasent been touched yet. Now could that cause this problem?

It's happened to me in twice in the past to weeks. It's like it just stopped working on me those times, very aggrivating. QUICK QUESTION- Will a short throw shifter eliminate this safety feature all together?

QUICK QUESTION- Will a short throw shifter eliminate this safety feature all together?

No, the solenoid is in the transmission housing, not the shifter.

I'll add, again, if the load is removed, the solenoid is being powered. The failure mode for the solenoid is to apply higher load so the above conditions are NOT due to a transmission problem although you are ripping the nads outa reverse..

And Ill add, again, that we are IN NO WAY OVERPOWERING THE SOLENOID. Something is giving this solenoid power to pull back, or perhaps, the solenoid is sticking in the open position even when its released.



I'll add, again, if the load is removed, the solenoid is being powered. The failure mode for the solenoid is to apply higher load so the above conditions are NOT due to a transmission problem although you are ripping the nads outa reverse..

This sounds like a SOLENOID sticking. If it happens when is cold I would bet on it.

You may have a pinched wire on "B" of the wire that goes up to the PCM and it is going to ground. The PCM grounds out the circuit and operates the solenoid.

Just something else to look at :)

This sounds like a SOLENOID sticking. If it happens when is cold I would bet on it.
ok if in fact its sticking because it's cold which i can believe since temps are around 20-40 degrees on any given day... what can i do to stop it from sticking?

I think you have failed to read so... The power, that would be the 12volts supplied externally, is what makes the load on the solenoid diminish. The spring load in the mechanism does not "stick" it cannot "stick" - have any of you seen this mechanism? It would seem not and would also seem that even fewer know what they are posting about. As I have said before, if the solenoid gave up it would be at the higher load NOT lower .
BTW I am not just postulating here I do know what I speak of . I see these units daily and have done so since '90.

I think you have failed to read so... The power, that would be the 12volts supplied externally, is what makes the load on the solenoid diminish. The spring load in the mechanism does not "stick" it cannot "stick" - have any of you seen this mechanism? It would seem not and would also seem that even fewer know what they are posting about. As I have said before, if the solenoid gave up it would be at the higher load NOT lower .
BTW I am not just postulating here I do know what I speak of . I see these units daily and have done so since '90.

When Theory and Results dont match up, throw out the theory.

No offense, but youve got multiple accounts of this happening to different people in different cars. Some have aftermarket programming, others do not. Something is definately happening here.

I think you have failed to read so... The power, that would be the 12volts supplied externally, is what makes the load on the solenoid diminish. The spring load in the mechanism does not "stick" it cannot "stick" - have any of you seen this mechanism? It would seem not and would also seem that even fewer know what they are posting about. As I have said before, if the solenoid gave up it would be at the higher load NOT lower .
BTW I am not just postulating here I do know what I speak of . I see these units daily and have done so since '90.

Seen the mechanism personally no, I have a diagram of it from my local dealership sitting in my hands.

What your saying "if the solenoid gave up/failed it woud be at a higher load not lower" Thats fine and all but it aint happening were all experiencing easier efforts in putting into reverse not harder. I performed my search and there are numerous accounts of people not getting it into reverse but there is a hand full of people that are having this problem. What im getting from you is that somewhere something is supplying 12 volts to the solenoid when it's not soposed to be causing it not to work correctly is that what you saying? If so in my case then something from the outside is supplying about 6 volts because i have resistance putting my car into reverse it's just not enough to stop me or someone else from doing so.

FWIW: I can still put the tranny in reverse with the key off, it takes the same amount of effort.... Stiff but can still go into reverse.

Since you work on these daily wanna shoot me a good working one so i feel better about shifting gears?

With the afternmarket stuff you get what ya bought- may not be what they said or what ya want - got warranty?- read it carefully.
If your load is high into reverse vehicle at rest / the same with the key on or off, the solenoid is not being powered. This thread has gone in several directions some high load some no load issues. They are not all the same , while I will agree there is (are) concern (s)here . To continue to spout that they have a common / only one mode is more a case of armchair bitching. I was trying to help and some here seem to want to debate- Im not interested.
As to shooting you a good one - I don't give them away, just offer free help.

With the afternmarket stuff you get what ya bought- may not be what they said or what ya want - got warranty?- read it carefully.
If your load is high into reverse vehicle at rest / the same with the key on or off, the solenoid is not being powered.

Look i appreciate your help but i don't think your understanding whats going on here. Nothing on my Car is aftermarket that would of caused this, I have a bone stock T56 and have had my tune since april 15th of 05, like ive stated in earlier post this has just happened between sept 28 and jan 8th when i parked the car for the winter it was fine, i brought it out to swap rearends and i noticed this issue during the post test drive. My load is high with the key off but i can still put it into reverse it just takes effort so that means that it's still getting some kind of voltage from some where when it's not sopose to correct?. When i turn the key on there is no problem putting it into reverse it's like shifting into any other gear that means 12 volts is present. While im driving or i when command the solenoid to "inhibit" reverse (using my Solus)it gives me the same resistance it does when the key is off and STILL allows reverse (voltage is soposed to be 0) but is not. I don't believe thats normal operation. Im not trying to argue im trying to get to the bottom of this just like GuitsBoy we both seem to have the same problem here. Now let me ask you this the solenoid is soposed to block out reverse when the key is off correct? If so do you think it possible if the tranny is left in reverse acting like a parking brake on hills and stuff could that wear out the solenoid? The reason why i ask is because when i purchased the car last yr the parking brake didn't work and it's possible that the owner or dealer left the tranny in reverse when parked to keep it from rolling.

I have the same thing happen to me on occasion. It seems to happen more often when the car is cold. I'll be driving normally, no hard shifts or anything, and going from 4th to 5th I can feel the shifter going further to the right than normal and it will grind if I complete the shift. When I was under warranty I tried to get it fixed, but they couldn't replicate the problem. :eyes:

Smoked,
I guess I am confused.Seems like you have an oposite expectation but from what you've said, you car is functioning as designed.I think you have not heard me - This is NOT a reverse lock out ,it is an inhibitor. You will NEVER have reverse unavailable (albeit high load)
Key off, parked will give you HIGH reverse effort. key on parked or below 3-5MPH will give you lighter load = ONLY IF the ecm delivers 12V. If you have a light load at any other time , you ecm programming is incorrect OR you have the plugs reversed ( for skip shift).
There is no reason to think leaving the shifter in reverse would cause extra wear.

Smoked,
I guess I am confused.Seems like you have an oposite expectation but from what you've said, you car is functioning as designed.I think you have not heard me - This is NOT a reverse lock out ,it is an inhibitor. You will NEVER have reverse unavailable (albeit high load)
Key off, parked will give you HIGH reverse effort. key on parked or below 3-5MPH will give you lighter load = ONLY IF the ecm delivers 12V. If you have a light load at any other time , you ecm programming is incorrect OR you have the plugs reversed ( for skip shift).
There is no reason to think leaving the shifter in reverse would cause extra wear.
Ok thats cool, i guess ive never notice this before as "inhibitor" i would believe that it would keep me out of reverse when moving more then 5mph not kinda pervent it from happening. But my only true way to tell is find a local 6 speed and compare. I just never really noticed this before.

Good lord, this just happened to me today when driving home from work. I went right into reverse when trying to get into 5th. It scared the crap out of me.

Everything is stock, it's never happened before, and it was about 45 or 50 degrees out.

How about this scenario...

Obviously to release the solenoid it is recieving power at some point or another. What if the solenoid is binding due to corrosion/wear. He starts the car when it's cold, possible moisture freezing, tightening tolerances etc.... PCM triggers the solenoid, he puts it in reverse. The solenoid has no load so it retracts easily, but doesn't return because it's mechanically bound up. Now he drives normally and doesn't even realize the solenoid is stuck because he wont get into 5th or 6th until freeway speeds. When he does, the solenoid is still stuck retracted due to a mechanical problem in the solenoid and therefore allows an easy shift into reverse. Potentially, contact of the shifter to the solenoid could be enough to free it and subsequent reverse shifts wouldn't be possible.

Doesn't sounds like it could be a skip-shift issue because it's happening at freeway speeds and I don't think the PCM should command the skip shift solenoid under those conditions. From a GM TSB: The conditions for this feature are: engine coolant at normal operating temperature, vehicle speed of 24-31 km/h (15-19 mph), 21% or less throttle being used (refer to Service Information or the Owner's Manual for more details.)

If it were my car I'd pull the shifter off the top of the trans and take a quick look at the lockout solenoid to see if anything looks out of wack or possibly the shifter is managing to get around the solenoid (unlikely). If nothing was obvious I'd probably remove the solenoid from the trans, inspect it and potentially replace it. Hell, if you really wanted to backyard mechanic the problem you could even pull the solenoid and fish the harness into the driver compartment where you could test it as you were driving.

http://www.gmpartsdirect.com has the solenoid for a '00 for 101.32

Of course this all assumes you're not just smashing the shifter into reverse and overpowering the solenoid. Just my .02

Searching!

Mine just did the same damn thing today and its 90 degrees in TX. Its not just related to cold. The car was up to temp and I was on the hwy in 6th. I tried to shift into 5th and it went in to reverse instead. It can't actually ingage in reverse but it did grind like hell. It took me 3 times to firgure out that it was reverse and not 5th that was grinding. It had zero problems sliding into reverse at speeds it shouldn't be doing it at. This was just normal shifting and the tranny and PCM is completely stock.
I was also able to put the tranny in reverse like a hot knife thru butter with the car off in the driveway with the keys in my pocket. Same with the keys in.

Whats going on? I'm getting at that it might be my PCM sending the solonoid voltage when it shouldn't be.

Later I drove it and its fine. It works as it should.

bringing it back from the dead

i came across this problem over the weekend. it dosn't matter if i am driving at 40 mph, sitting at idle, sitting with the car in the "on" possision, or if the key is off, i can put the car in to reverse with no effort what so ever.

i took the center counsel and shifter out, and have been playing around with the solenoid and noticed that when i put the car in "on" the solenoid will pop out, but i can push it back in with mt finger. it will not come back out unless i turn the car off then on again

has anyone figured out what the problem is

ttt, i've had this happen to me a few times and would like to see if anyone has any fresh ideas.
Just like everyone else it was on the highway with minimal effort to go into reverse

well i was fiddleing with the noid last night and i think i fixed it

i took the shifter assembly off so that i could see the pin that comes out of the solenoid

as i was messing with it, i noticed i could twist the pin, so i twisted it until it was tight. i took the car around the block and had no problems, as if it never happend

With the car off you shouldn't be able to get into Reverse without some force. The Solenoid has to have a signal to allow you to be able to get into reverse at under 3mph..whatever the speed is.

I have am having the same reverse-lockout failure and I drive a 2008 Ford GT500. It does not have an LS1 engine, but it does have the Tremec 6060 found in the late model Corvette, Camaro, GTO, G8, and Dodge Viper and Challenger. At first, the shifter worked fine, then increasingly, the lockout started to fail. Eventually, it stopped completely and the solenoid had to be replaced. Again, the lockout worked for awhile and then started to fail intermittently. Then summer arrived and the problem disappeared. Now it's getting colder and the problem has returned. The mechanics can't figure it out. Has anybody?